ongoing mass shootings thread

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LuckyNumber7 said:
I wish people would stop distributing this rumor that the shooter was gay. Such a headline feels like we've stepped back 20 years, and we are somehow shaming him or his kind by laughing at his potential sexuality.

The fact that he had been to the bar several times and used gay social media just as much supports the idea that he's maniacal and was plotting this act. Maybe he was repressed and self hating, I don't know. But until a guy comes out and says he engaged in some form of homosexual act with him, I wish people would stop accusing that. I don't know if I'm saying this correctly or not. But yeah, I'd like to imagine he wasn't gay. So maybe I have a bias there.

But something I've always hated is the labeling of people based upon indirect evidence (i.e. flamboyance or a high voice).
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I kinda echo this sentiment. For me using those apps, scoutin gthe club, doesn't indicate he's gay at all. It indicates intricate planning... sure, if he actually dated guys on that app, that could change things. But if he just used it to scout familiar faces, find the best place they hang out so he could do his job there... it has nothing to do with his own sexuality and everything with his insanity.
 
I wrote a similar post but just didn't know how to word it. I don't want to come off as combatant, as quite frankly I do not care about the fine details at the moment. But I suppose I do want to put this out there.

Gay social media apps tend to be very shallow. You're on there for a date, or you're on there for sex. You're not on there to find out what the cool gay clubs are. Exactly what GG says -- from someone with experience using these things -- nobody asks such a question. It is so incredibly uncommon... so much so that it's no coincidence.

As for him being a frequent customer... everything I've heard from original sources of the articles suggest that he'd been there before. They seem to have warped it into a thing of 'years' or calling him a 'regular.' I haven't seen anyone say that. I've heard that he'd been before, and that he was offish while there. And that he'd told people he had a wife and kids. And that he was at times belligerent. And that he drank alone. Nothing to do with dancing or enjoying himself. It sounds to me like he was plotting and hated everyone there.

This doesn't mean he's not gay either. But I fear this is a media narrative, based upon misconstrued and otherwise soft evidence.
 
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Jumping too hard at that narrative makes it too easy for Oregopa's SUV episode to blame his parents (I haven't clicked it because I really have no interest in watching it, but I keep seeing links to some video his father supposedly posted about god punishing homosexuals) or be like "see this is because Islam!"
 
This thing seems to be more Columbine than Bataclan.

It's the perfect shit storm or very possible issue surrounding gun violence. Only thing we're missing is a history of playing violent video games.

It's certainly possible, and looking more and more likely, that his motivations included religion, shame over his true self, the disgraceful and continuing homophobia both in our nation and especially within organized religion, his father, and mental illness. Everyone wants to pick one, but it's all if the above.

The one thing that ties it all together is, still, the guns. Without access to this kind of weaponry he wouldn't have been able to do any of this. Period.
 
Headache in a Suitcase said:
This thing seems to be more Columbine than Bataclan.

It's the perfect shit storm or very possible issue surrounding gun violence. Only thing we're missing is a history of playing violent video games.

It's certainly possible, and looking more and more likely, that his motivations included religion, shame over his true self, the disgraceful and continuing homophobia both in our nation and especially within organized religion, his father, and mental illness. Everyone wants to pick one, but it's all if the above.

The one thing that ties it all together is, still, the guns. Without access to this kind of weaponry he wouldn't have been able to do any of this. Period.
Click to expand...

Pretty much sums it up :up:.

Your post does bring up one of the big reasons why it's so hard to actually get anywhere with these sorts of tragedies-there's a lot of factors involved, and people don't seem to know how to really juggle or deal with all of them. People seem to think that if you bring up the gun issue, somehow that means you don't care about religious extremism, or if you mention the mental illness (if that's a factor, and that's not always easy to pinpoint or discuss because of the stigma that still surrounds the issue) that somehow means you're excusing the shooter, or don't care about any other issues tied to the situation. It's like people can't comprehend the idea that it IS possible to be concerned about all the issues, and that even if your focus is heavily on one in particular, that doesn't mean you're disregarding or refusing to acknowledge the other factors.

(General "you" applying here, by the way.)

Plus, there's the obvious fact that it's just easier, or feels easier, at least, to fix a problem if it can be narrowed down to one main issue.

On that note, in terms of other issues that would be interesting to address, I'd like to hear more discussion about why it's young men who often seem to commit these sorts of crimes. A few women have gone on shooting sprees in the past, of course, but this sort of crime tends to be heavily male-oriented, and I think that speaks to some societal and cultural aspects of how a "real man" should act that don't get talked about nearly enough.
 
A tweet from Karla Ray. I used to work in a local news affiliate. The News Director is probably working with her to follow up leads and contact the FBI. I'm sure as a young reporter she will face some deflection from the FBI and Disney as they scramble to get their talking points in order over what can be an embarrassing development. At this point it's out in the media ether so we will if more national correspondents can get harder answers quicker.


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Oregoropa said:
A tweet from Karla Ray. I used to work in a local news affiliate. The News Director is probably working with her to follow up leads and contact the FBI. I'm sure as a young reporter she will face some deflection from the FBI and Disney as they scramble to get their talking points in order over what can be an embarrassing development. At this point it's out in the media ether so we will if more national correspondents can get harder answers quicker.


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I bet it was from misunderstood details. Disney has many magical things, but the magical ability to read a visitor's mind they do not.
 
LuckyNumber7 said:
I bet it was from misunderstood details. Disney has many magical things, but the magical ability to read a visitor's mind they do not.
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What?!

They have this woman on their payroll, of course they can.

tumblr_ml42r3q29x1rftqnno4_1280.jpg
 
Recommend checking out Samantha Bee's latest episode. Think I've said it before but the void left by Jon/Colbert has been picked up nicely by her and Oliver.

Tho I do really miss Colbert Report. Dude was so amazing with his character and interviews.


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Just like with the other terrorists killing sprees in the U.S, the president and the FBI and Homeland security failed .

They were warned about this guy in Orlando. They interviewed him twice. His co-workers spoke out about his behavior and comments.

Instead of keeping an eye on this guy, they drop him off their radar. Just like they did the others.

And before all the bodies are removed from the club, the president comes out and gives the American people a lecture and then brings up guns. He blames us.

When are we going to wake up to the fact that these radical extremists have declared war on the West?

It happened again a few days ago in France.
 
the iron horse said:
Just like with the other terrorists killing sprees in the U.S, the president and the FBI and Homeland security failed .

They were warned about this guy in Orlando. They interviewed him twice. His co-workers spoke out about his behavior and comments.

Instead of keeping an eye on this guy, they drop him off their radar. Just like they did the others.

And before all the bodies are removed from the club, the president comes out and gives the American people a lecture and then brings up guns. He blames us.

When are we going to wake up to the fact that these radical extremists have declared war on the West?

It happened again a few days ago in France.
Click to expand...

Radical extremists are absolutely at war with the west. If you think Obama denies this you really haven't been paying attention. He's the longest war time president in US history. Who've we been fighting? Eskimos?

When are you going to wake up to the undeniable fact that the other overwhelming majority of mass shootings in the United States are carried out by crazy white guys with a weapon that should not be available to the public?

Why does the GOP shoot down a bill, written by Peter King of all people, that would disallow known terrorists from purchasing a gun? Isn't that aiding and abetting?
 
the iron horse said:
Just like with the other terrorists killing sprees in the U.S, the president and the FBI and Homeland security failed .

They were warned about this guy in Orlando. They interviewed him twice. His co-workers spoke out about his behavior and comments.

Instead of keeping an eye on this guy, they drop him off their radar. Just like they did the others.

And before all the bodies are removed from the club, the president comes out and gives the American people a lecture and then brings up guns. He blames us.

When are we going to wake up to the fact that these radical extremists have declared war on the West?

It happened again a few days ago in France.
Click to expand...


The FBI do seem to be a common thread, but what would you suggest they do?

How did he blame us?


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the iron horse said:
Just like with the other terrorists killing sprees in the U.S, the president and the FBI and Homeland security failed .

They were warned about this guy in Orlando. They interviewed him twice. His co-workers spoke out about his behavior and comments.

Instead of keeping an eye on this guy, they drop him off their radar. Just like they did the others.

And before all the bodies are removed from the club, the president comes out and gives the American people a lecture and then brings up guns. He blames us.

When are we going to wake up to the fact that these radical extremists have declared war on the West?

It happened again a few days ago in France.
Click to expand...



Good points.

In a country unable to perform such basic surveillance, it really does make you wonder why these weapons of mass destruction capable of pumping 45 slugs of hot metal into human flesh in under a minute are so widely and easily available. Why was this guy able to purchase such a weapon? How are these weapons even available?
 
Irvine511 said:
Good points.

In a country unable to perform such basic surveillance, it really does make you wonder why these weapons of mass destruction capable of pumping 45 slugs of hot metal into human flesh in under a minute are so widely and easily available. Why was this guy able to purchase such a weapon? How are these weapons even available?
Click to expand...

But dude, I totally need a weapon like that for my own enjoyment! For hunting or whatever, you can't take that away from me! It's a basic human right, like loving and marrying who you want and to get abortions when you get raped...... owait.

Der terk er geernnnnnnnss :fist:
 
Headache in a Suitcase said:
But I need my semi to protect against government oppression mannnnnn. Cause when the Army comes to take my land, I need need to be prepared.

Cause the military doesn't have tanks and stealth bombers and shit.
Click to expand...


That's why I'm buying stealth bombers and nuclear-tipped ICBMs, as the Second Amendment so clearly enables me to do.


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