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Old 06-13-2016, 02:45 PM   #881
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ongoing mass shootings thread

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Originally Posted by IWasBored View Post
Yeah is that being as overlooked and disregarded as it seems? I've gotten literally all my news regarding this from a super pro gay echo chamber I've created for myself online (which to be honest is where I get probably 75% of news because if I have to wade through biases with any source, I might as well settle in where I can remind myself that not all the people are the same Trump supporting asshats I work with), and then came in here and read basically what amounts to a slight step up from the comments sections on articles. So what I'm seeing has all turned into hashtags and pictures at vigils, rather than this game of "chose an agenda to shout about."

I'd say it's getting regarded just fine. I see a lot of the religious right from my father's side who would gladly stand up and oppose gay marriage and denounce these "sinners" all with little rainbows on their Facebook profile picture, and their comments on how you must love one another etc.

Not that my one experience is indicative of everyone, but I definitely think this is a chance for Christian America to sympathize with the gay community over a common evil, so to say. If there's one thing the religious right truly despises, it's Arabs with guns in the name of allah.
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Old 06-13-2016, 02:59 PM   #882
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It is interesting (in an incredibly saddening way) how this issue is revealing the hierarchy of the Right's imagined enemies.

1. Muslims
2. LGBTQ
3. Single women
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Old 06-13-2016, 03:26 PM   #883
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Originally Posted by iron yuppie View Post
It is interesting (in an incredibly saddening way) how this issue is revealing the hierarchy of the Right's imagined enemies.

1. Muslims
2. LGBTQ
3. Single women
I'd place Mexican immigrants at 2, maybe tied with LGBTQ?
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Old 06-13-2016, 04:24 PM   #884
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Originally Posted by iron yuppie View Post
It is interesting (in an incredibly saddening way) how this issue is revealing the hierarchy of the Right's imagined enemies.

1. Muslims
2. LGBTQ
3. Single women


if anyone ever again states that transwomen are a threat to little girls in public bathrooms i think you have permission to punch them in the nose.

also, i think i now fully understand why #alllivesmatter is bullshit.


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6 Convoluted Ways Of Thinking About The Orlando Shooting If You’d Prefer Not To Acknowledge It As An Anti-Gay

Feel free to get lost in the weeds with one of these lines of tangled logic if you’re looking to avoid facing uncomfortable truths about anti-gay bigotry in our country.

1. Although the gunman specifically attacked a gay nightclub during Pride Month, this is really just an attack on the American way of life of going out on the weekends: There’s no need to defend the rights of gay people when you could instead just talk about how we’re not going to be scared away from fun nightlife activities. You could even consider using a completely beside-the-point hashtag like #NoToFearYesToWeekends when you post your labyrinthine arguments online.

2. There weren’t enough exits in the nightclub: Should you wish to make the convoluted argument that this is a club safety issue, and not an anti-gay hate crime, we’ve got you covered. Just posit that the Pulse nightclub didn’t have enough exits for evacuation, and that if a fire were to have happened in the club, just as many people would have died. Would a nightclub fire in a gay nightclub have been an anti-gay hate crime? This is precisely the kind of completely warped logic you can bring up when you talk about this issue.

3. The Pulse nightclub attack is solely about gun control or Islamic terrorism or mental health or some combination of just those things: Look, you have enough to discuss already without also bringing up the safety of the LGBTQ community. By the time you’ve exhausted every line of thinking here, you may find that you have successfully dodged a debate on systemic homophobia and violence in America!

4. This tragedy is a grim reminder of the dangers of alcohol consumption: If you’re totally unwilling to acknowledge the deeply entrenched homophobia at the core of the Orlando shooter’s decision to massacre a largely LGBTQ-identifying population, here’s a super-tenuous conclusion you can draw from the whole event: Intoxication is a serious threat to safety. The logical moves are a little all over the place, but you can get to this reasoning by focusing exclusively on the idea that alcohol inhibits your senses, which would technically make it more difficult to escape in the event of an emergency like an active shooter. That’s totally a way you can think of this situation if you’re willing to do the legwork!

5. The gunman knew it was a gay nightclub, but forgot: Okay, so if you’ve gotten to number five on this list, you’re truly committed to finding an incredibly roundabout rationale to explain away this terror attack without having to think about the very real hatred toward the gay community that seethes just under the surface of our society. And here’s some truly cloudy logic to match: While it may be clear from his Facebook activity that he was disgusted by homosexuality, no one can say for certain that Omar Mateen didn’t randomly forget that Pulse was a gay nightclub moments before opening fire. And because it can’t technically be proven incorrect, this may be the one for you.

6. Focus on how all the victims are “just people”: If you’d really, really like to totally sidestep this tragedy as being in any way connected to identity or sexuality, might as well just say this.
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Old 06-13-2016, 05:10 PM   #885
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Originally Posted by Irvine511 View Post
it's also anti-gay hate.
Could it also be self-hatred?

CJAD 800 – News. Talk. Radio. :: Homicidal homophobe used to hang at Orlando gay hotspot, some regulars recall :: World News Article
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Old 06-13-2016, 05:46 PM   #886
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I'd say it's getting regarded just fine. I see a lot of the religious right from my father's side who would gladly stand up and oppose gay marriage and denounce these "sinners" all with little rainbows on their Facebook profile picture, and their comments on how you must love one another etc.

Not that my one experience is indicative of everyone, but I definitely think this is a chance for Christian America to sympathize with the gay community over a common evil, so to say. If there's one thing the religious right truly despises, it's Arabs with guns in the name of allah.

I was curious is all.
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Old 06-13-2016, 05:48 PM   #887
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Originally Posted by Irvine511 View Post
if anyone ever again states that transwomen are a threat to little girls in public bathrooms i think you have permission to punch them in the nose.

also, i think i now fully understand why #alllivesmatter is bullshit.

Man, the last thing I want to do is hijack this thread to rant about the bathroom stuff. But I would feel a lot better about a lot of things if I could go around punching those people.
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Old 06-13-2016, 05:59 PM   #888
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it's also anti-gay hate.
Yes. Whatever the shooter's relationship to ISIS, let's not lose sight of the fact that this tragedy is a hate crime at its core. For those with narrow definitions of the term that limit hate crimes to the verbal realm, let this be a reminder that a twisted, hateful perspective on homosexuality can be extremely dangerous.
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Old 06-13-2016, 06:42 PM   #889
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Its funny, but I had that thought about this psycho while watching the news last night.
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Old 06-13-2016, 10:38 PM   #890
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ongoing mass shootings thread

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Its funny, but I had that thought about this psycho while watching the news last night.

The more I've heard, it seems more like part of his sadistic plotting. He supposedly frequented it but was always alone and had violent outbursts. He was also apparently using Jack'd, a gay dating app. Apparently asking others about the clubs and bars. Most people on those apps would be asking about you, or asking about having sex with you.

I can't get this out of my head. Like if he was genuinely plotting by visiting, I know why he chose Pulse. Pulse is a mega fire hazard of an establishment. Especially at the hour in which he chose to act. At 2 AM, at last call, they lock one of the internal doors. *I don't know why they do this* it has always bothered me as a serious fire hazard. It's a glass door reinforced with some aluminum frame. It is a horrendous scene I keep imagining in my mind because I can't stop imagining people getting pinned in that area. It just feels like he knew this.
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Old 06-13-2016, 10:57 PM   #891
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I don't know if that's geared towards me, but perhaps you didn't understand what I meant.
my post? oh no, it was just a general post regarding the subject, honestly! i completely understand where you're coming from, and i respect your not caring about the gun control discussion at the moment. not wanting to be involved in it is different than being some political person with an axe to grind (on either side, honestly) not wanting the discussion to happen at all.
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Old 06-14-2016, 01:00 AM   #892
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Originally Posted by LuckyNumber7 View Post
The more I've heard, it seems more like part of his sadistic plotting. He supposedly frequented it but was always alone and had violent outbursts. He was also apparently using Jack'd, a gay dating app. Apparently asking others about the clubs and bars. Most people on those apps would be asking about you, or asking about having sex with you.

I can't get this out of my head. Like if he was genuinely plotting by visiting, I know why he chose Pulse. Pulse is a mega fire hazard of an establishment. Especially at the hour in which he chose to act. At 2 AM, at last call, they lock one of the internal doors. *I don't know why they do this* it has always bothered me as a serious fire hazard. It's a glass door reinforced with some aluminum frame. It is a horrendous scene I keep imagining in my mind because I can't stop imagining people getting pinned in that area. It just feels like he knew this.
geeeeez..... just started to hear that he was
hanging out there previously a while ago on our news.

As for the kind of stuff you can't get out of your head right now...

After 9-11 up here in NYC mental health professionals had statements detailing the kind of possible physical, mental, emotional ( and maybe one other category) effects one might feel after that event. It was useful to have that kind of warning, and that it was normal to react such ways under those conditions.

Seems to me as horrific as this feels imagining what happened by that area of the club, what you are going through is in that range of reactions. You feel "crazy" ( maybe ) but you are not. You can expect that these intense reactions might happen. I hope brings you a little bit of ... comfort feels like too facile a word, but nothing else cones up for me.
Stay strong ,which like also means knowing that crying is a good thing when needed, too.
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Old 06-14-2016, 01:46 AM   #893
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When I get emotional, I tend to shut down and get this stone faced sort of look with little visible emotion. But right now, every time I see a monument lit up from somewhere in the world, or vigils being held in lands so far away, I tear up. I don't know why. I am happy to see all the love and support for the currently crippled city of Orlando.

There was a big vigil today downtown Orlando. The feeling I got from it was that this city is going to come back stronger and even more united. As Floridians, we tend to be from all over. Even the recent growth has been fueled in large by first generation Floridians from Jacksonville, Tampa/St. Pete, and South Florida. The sense of being a Floridian is a weak bond, but I feel as though Orlando and Central Florida have helped change that. I came here 6 years ago, and have watched this city grow. The spirits here might be low right now, but I think the rebound is going to make bonds even stronger. The response has been overwhelming. People from all over. Not just LGBT people. Everyone in Orlando is giving a hand in response to this tragedy.

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Old 06-14-2016, 01:47 AM   #894
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The only good thing about stuff like this is stuff like that
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Old 06-14-2016, 04:31 AM   #895
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Originally Posted by Irvine511 View Post
if anyone ever again states that transwomen are a threat to little girls in public bathrooms i think you have permission to punch them in the nose.

.

I won't get punched in the nose on that point of which you are correct. I just think the bathroom issue is a baseball 'steal sign' to low-life sexual predators (straight men) to hijack an identity to fulfill their sick fantasies.
I foresee an SVU 'ripped from the headlines' episode next season.


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Old 06-14-2016, 05:32 AM   #896
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When I get emotional, I tend to shut down and get this stone faced sort of look with little visible emotion. But right now, every time I see a monument lit up from somewhere in the world, or vigils being held in lands so far away, I tear up. I don't know why. I am happy to see all the love and support for the currently crippled city of Orlando.

There was a big vigil today downtown Orlando. The feeling I got from it was that this city is going to come back stronger and even more united. As Floridians, we tend to be from all over. Even the recent growth has been fueled in large by first generation Floridians from Jacksonville, Tampa/St. Pete, and South Florida. The sense of being a Floridian is a weak bond, but I feel as though Orlando and Central Florida have helped change that. I came here 6 years ago, and have watched this city grow. The spirits here might be low right now, but I think the rebound is going to make bonds even stronger. The response has been overwhelming. People from all over. Not just LGBT people. Everyone in Orlando is giving a hand in response to this tragedy.


That's pretty awesome.
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Old 06-14-2016, 05:49 AM   #897
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I won't get punched in the nose on that point of which you are correct. I just think the bathroom issue is a baseball 'steal sign' to low-life sexual predators (straight men) to hijack an identity to fulfill their sick fantasies.
I foresee an SVU 'ripped from the headlines' episode next season.


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Still deserving of a punch in the nose, though, because it's still an idiotic, fear-mongering position. I still can't wrap my head around how people can convince themselves that straight male sexual predators are out there thinking "well, I'd really like to be able to go into the women's room to rape but right now there's a law that says I can't. But if they make it so I can dress up like a woman, then I'm good to go." Like that's the law they were going to obey? That's the moral standard where they draw the line? That's been documented to have happened how many times? Versus the number of transwomen who have been assaulted in men's rooms. I'm starting to feel like that unless you've ever had to pee in public and been genuinely unsure of which bathroom to use out of fears ranging from either being physically unsafe in the men's room or just an extremely awkward, uncomfortable "what are you doing in here!" you're (generalized you, because I don't only mean you, I mean everyone being insane about this debate) not going to get it.
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Old 06-14-2016, 07:24 AM   #898
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When I get emotional, I tend to shut down and get this stone faced sort of look with little visible emotion. But right now, every time I see a monument lit up from somewhere in the world, or vigils being held in lands so far away, I tear up. I don't know why. I am happy to see all the love and support for the currently crippled city of Orlando.

There was a big vigil today downtown Orlando. The feeling I got from it was that this city is going to come back stronger and even more united. As Floridians, we tend to be from all over. Even the recent growth has been fueled in large by first generation Floridians from Jacksonville, Tampa/St. Pete, and South Florida. The sense of being a Floridian is a weak bond, but I feel as though Orlando and Central Florida have helped change that. I came here 6 years ago, and have watched this city grow. The spirits here might be low right now, but I think the rebound is going to make bonds even stronger. The response has been overwhelming. People from all over. Not just LGBT people. Everyone in Orlando is giving a hand in response to this tragedy.




Everyone here stands with you.
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Old 06-14-2016, 07:27 AM   #899
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I won't get punched in the nose on that point of which you are correct. I just think the bathroom issue is a baseball 'steal sign' to low-life sexual predators (straight men) to hijack an identity to fulfill their sick fantasies.
I foresee an SVU 'ripped from the headlines' episode next season.


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So bad guys are going to get guns anyway so we might as well make guns available to everyone, but a sexual predator is going to follow the law?

This is Trump's Merica


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Old 06-14-2016, 08:22 AM   #900
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Originally Posted by Oregoropa View Post
I won't get punched in the nose on that point of which you are correct. I just think the bathroom issue is a baseball 'steal sign' to low-life sexual predators (straight men) to hijack an identity to fulfill their sick fantasies.
I foresee an SVU 'ripped from the headlines' episode next season.


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This is a great example of someone (a governor of NC, maybe) making up a problem in order to present a solution that does nothing but offer a channel for bigots and idiots to express disapproval of modernity and increase fear and loathing of an already highly vulnerable community.

I'm much more worried about the transwomen who are going to be murdered by straight men.
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