Oh My God...McCain could win if he picks Palin!!!

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all these discussions about being qualified:

qualifications are nice and all, if you have done your job 20 years arguably you know more then with 2 years experience

but does that make the "qualified" leader a better leader than the "less-qualified"?

if Obama had been working in politics for 2 decades before runnin for President, do you seriously think he would still advocate change like he does? this Senator also stands for a new political leadership: someone who has 5 years experience is maybe not completely digested and spit out by the political system. lobbies, compromises, tactics.

arugably someone who has been working in politics for 5 years is still closer to the average joe on the street and knows more about real life and worries of the folks that vote him, about real changes, than someone who has moved in this political world of crooks and liars for decades.

just sayin´.
 
all these discussions about being qualified:

qualifications are nice and all, if you have done your job 20 years arguably you know more then with 2 years experience

but does that make the "qualified" leader a better leader than the "less-qualified"?

if Obama had been working in politics for 2 decades before runnin for President, do you seriously think he would still advocate change like he does? this Senator also stands for a new political leadership: someone who has 5 years experience is maybe not completely digested and spit out by the political system. lobbies, compromises, tactics.

arugably someone who has been working in politics for 5 years is still closer to the average joe on the street and knows more about real life and worries of the folks that vote him, about real changes, than someone who has moved in this political world of crooks and liars for decades.

just sayin´.


Is Obama only all talk?


Palin ran as a change agent she has been in office 2 years and has a great record as a reformer, a change agent, that actually delivered on change wirhin less than two years.

Did Obama run as a change agent four years ago ?

Does he have any reputation for shaking things up in the Senate? What has he done? Is there anything to back up this talk of change.

Has McCain been a change agent?

Has he shook things up in the Senate?

Is he a reformer?


Who is the real reformer?

Which V P candidate is the real reformer?

Which candidate only talks about change?
 
She has been to Kuwait.

and that is more than could be said of Obama.




by this logic, she's better equipped to deal with Putin because Alaska is closer to Russia than either Hawaii, Hyde Park, or DC (not to mention Phoenix, Sedona, San Diego, Crystal City, etc.)

please, point to me the evidence that Sarah Palin has given 1/100th the depth of thought, research, study, and policy proposals that Barack Obama has given in regards to the Persian Gulf.

you're free to disagree with Obama. but then, you'd have something concrete with which to intelligently disagree.

Ms. Palin has no such record, no such background, no such research, no such policy recommendations. nothing. she's a total neophyte on foreign policy, as most serious Republicans, and everyone in Alaska, is admitting today.
 
Is Obama only all talk?


Palin ran as a change agent she has been in office 2 years and has a great record as a reformer, a change agent, that actually delivered on change wirhin less than two years.

Did Obama run as a change agent four years ago ?

Does he have any reputation for shaking things up in the Senate? What has he done? Is there anything to back up this talk of change.

Has McCain been a change agent?

Has he shook things up in the Senate?

Is he a reformer?


Who is the real reformer?

Which V P candidate is the real reformer?

Which candidate only talks about change?




don't look now deep,

but you're making the same wild leaps and equivocations that you've accused Obama supporters of doing.
 
1/100th the depth of thought, research, study, and policy proposals that Barack Obama has given in regards to the Persian Gulf.


How much confidence are we supposed to put in paper work generated by committee members to serve what purposes?

Fill web pages?


His opinions on Iraq were about as good as mine.

The difference, I am not running for office and I can admit I made mistakes.
 
don't look now deep,

but you're making the same wild leaps and equivocations that you've accused Obama supporters of doing.


I am only stating my current thoughts and opinions.

I believe we all have bias'.

Though many of us claim to be objective.


Do you not believe it is accurate to say that both McCain and Palin have tangible records as reformers?
 
How much confidence are we supposed to put in paper work generated by committee members to serve what purposes?

Fill web pages?


His opinions on Iraq were about as good as mine.

The difference, I am not running for office and I can admit I made mistakes.


most people in Washington will tell you

that you will learn more about a country by talking to experts, academics military brass, contractors, etc., and gathering a wealth of information to process, analyze, and synthesize, than you ever will by making one of these PR "fact-finding" missions where one walks around in a hermetically sealed bubble, learns very little, and winds up looking like this:

0404W_BAGHDAD_wideweb__470x249,0.jpg


while talking about how lovely and safe the market is.
 
Do you not believe it is accurate to say that both McCain and Palin have tangible records as reformers?



yes.

but, as we're going to learn, claims of Palin's record as a reformer are greatly exaggerated.

and it is also accurate to say that Palin has a tangible record of abusing her political power for personal gain.

so, in the Cheney mold, i suppose this is a positive?
 
most people in Washington will tell you

that you will learn more about a country by talking to experts, academics military brass, contractors, etc., and gathering a wealth of information to process, analyze, and synthesize, than you ever will by making one of these PR "fact-finding" missions where one walks around in a hermetically sealed bubble, learns very little, and winds up looking like this:

0404W_BAGHDAD_wideweb__470x249,0.jpg


while talking about how lovely and safe the market is.


I have a very public record (in this forum) of being against the surge.

Of wanting to just draw down, and pull out and let the Iraqis solve if for themselves, or not.

I was sick of the daily body counts, I had extreme resentment for Bush/ Cheney / Rumsfeld.
I believed there was not a realistic chance for any success in Iraq. And to be honest, I wanted this major fuck up squarely on the hands of Bush / Cheney.

It was an easy call for me. What did I have at risk?


So I was 100% with Obama and not with McCain.

btw, Bush/ Cheney were not with McCain either.
It took them what 18 months and 2000? more dead Americans before they joined McCain with the surge.

McCain had a better understanding by going to Iraq 14 times since 2004.
Obama and myself did not go even once.
And most of the experts that had been there did support the surge.

I know why I got it wrong. What factors (bias') influenced my judgment.

Why did Obama get it wrong? What influenced his judgment?

Palin went to Kuwait to visit the troops and offer her support, and people keep telling me she is from a small state. :shrug:

Why didn't Obama go? How many enlisted men are from Illinois? How many Illinois National Guard have been deployed ?

He was planning on running for Commander in Chief.
 
Following up on some of the things Boston01 said last night...his claims about the circumstances under which Obama was elected to the Illinois state senate and the U.S. senate are more or less true, although I would argue with the description of his actions during the state senate campaign as 'screwing over' the person.

Obama knows his way around a ballot
Barack Obama

By David Jackson and Ray Long | Tribune staff reporters
6:48 PM CDT, April 3, 2007
The day after New Year's 1996, operatives for Barack Obama filed into a barren hearing room of the Chicago Board of Election Commissioners.

There they began the tedious process of challenging hundreds of signatures on the nominating petitions of state Sen. Alice Palmer, the longtime progressive activist from the city's South Side. And they kept challenging petitions until every one of Obama's four Democratic primary rivals was forced off the ballot.

Fresh from his work as a civil rights lawyer and head of a voter registration project that expanded access to the ballot box, Obama launched his first campaign for the Illinois Senate saying he wanted to empower disenfranchised citizens.

But in that initial bid for political office, Obama quickly mastered the bare-knuckle arts of Chicago electoral politics. His overwhelming legal onslaught signaled his impatience to gain office, even if that meant elbowing aside an elder stateswoman like Palmer.

A close examination of Obama's first campaign clouds the image he has cultivated throughout his political career: The man now running for president on a message of giving a voice to the voiceless first entered public office not by leveling the playing field, but by clearing it.

One of the candidates he eliminated, long-shot contender Gha-is Askia, now says that Obama's petition challenges belied his image as a champion of the little guy and crusader for voter rights.

"Why say you're for a new tomorrow, then do old-style Chicago politics to remove legitimate candidates?" Askia said. "He talks about honor and democracy, but what honor is there in getting rid of every other candidate so you can run scot-free? Why not let the people decide?"

In a recent interview, Obama granted that "there's a legitimate argument to be made that you shouldn't create barriers to people getting on the ballot."

But the unsparing legal tactics were justified, he said, by obvious flaws in his opponents' signature sheets. "To my mind, we were just abiding by the rules that had been set up," Obama recalled.

"I gave some thought to … should people be on the ballot even if they didn't meet the requirements," he said. "My conclusion was that if you couldn't run a successful petition drive, then that raised questions in terms of how effective a representative you were going to be."

Asked whether the district's primary voters were well-served by having only one candidate, Obama smiled and said: "I think they ended up with a very good state senator."

Obama behind challenges

America has been defined in part by civil rights and good government battles fought out in Chicago's 13th District, which in 1996 spanned Hyde Park mansions, South Shore bungalows and poverty-bitten precincts of Englewood.

It was in this part of the city that an eager reform Democrat by the name of Abner Mikva first entered elected office in the 1950s. And here a young, brash minister named Jesse Jackson ran Operation Breadbasket, leading marchers who sought to pressure grocery chains to hire minorities.

Palmer served the district in the Illinois Senate for much of the 1990s. Decades earlier, she was working as a community organizer in the area when Obama was growing up in Hawaii and Indonesia. She risked her safe seat to run for Congress and touted Obama as a suitable successor, according to news accounts and interviews.

But when Palmer got clobbered in that November 1995 special congressional race, her supporters asked Obama to fold his campaign so she could easily retain her state Senate seat.

Obama not only refused to step aside, he filed challenges that nullified Palmer's hastily gathered nominating petitions, forcing her to withdraw.

"I liked Alice Palmer a lot. I thought she was a good public servant," Obama said. "It was very awkward. That part of it I wish had played out entirely differently."

His choice divided veteran Chicago political activists.

"There was friction about the decision he made," said City Colleges of Chicago professor emeritus Timuel Black, who tried to negotiate with Obama on Palmer's behalf. "There were deep disagreements."

Had Palmer survived the petition challenge, Obama would have faced the daunting task of taking on an incumbent senator. Palmer's elimination marked the first of several fortuitous political moments in Obama's electoral success: He won the 2004 primary and general elections for U.S. Senate after tough challengers imploded when their messy divorce files were unsealed.

Obama contended that in the case of the 1996 race, in which he routed token opposition in the general election, he was ready to compete in the primary if necessary.

"We actually ran a terrific campaign up until the point we knew that we weren't going to have to appear on the ballot with anybody," Obama said. "I mean, we had prepared for it. We had raised money. We had tons of volunteers. There was enormous enthusiasm."

And he defended his use of ballot maneuvers: "If you can win, you should win and get to work doing the people's business."

At the time, though, Obama seemed less at ease with the decision, according to aides. They said the first-time candidate initially expressed reservations about using challenges to eliminate all his fellow Democrats.

"He wondered if we should knock everybody off the ballot. How would that look?" said Ronald Davis, the paid Obama campaign consultant whom Obama referred to as his "guru of petitions."

In the end, Davis filed objections to all four of Obama's Democratic rivals at the candidate's behest.

While Obama didn't attend the hearings, "he wanted us to call him every night and let him know what we were doing," Davis said, noting that Palmer and the others seemed unprepared for the challenges.

But Obama didn't gloat over the victories. "I don't think he thought it was, you know, sporting," said Will Burns, a 1996 Obama campaign volunteer who assisted with the petition challenges. "He wasn't very proud of it."

Endorsement or informal nod?

By the summer of 1995, Obama, 34, had completed his globe-trotting education and settled deep into Chicago's South Side.

He had gone to Harvard Law School with private ambitions of someday following Harold Washington as mayor of Chicago. At Harvard, where Obama was celebrated as the first black president of the Law Review, classmate Gina Torielli remembers him "saying that governor of Illinois would be his dream job."

Back in Chicago after graduation, Obama won respect for running Project Vote, which registered tens of thousands of black Chicagoans. "It's a power thing," the volunteers' T-shirts said.

Community organizers packed his wedding to Michelle Robinson, a South Shore resident and fellow Harvard Law graduate. The newlyweds bought a Hyde Park condo.

His memoir, "Dreams from My Father," was published that summer to warm reviews. He was working at a small but influential legal firm, teaching constitutional law as a University of Chicago adjunct professor and sitting on the boards of charities.

At the same time, the South Side's political map was thrown up for grabs when then-U.S. Rep. Mel Reynolds was convicted of sex crimes and a special election was called to fill his congressional seat.

Palmer joined the race and, according to multiple accounts, introduced Obama as the successor for her Illinois Senate seat.

"She said, 'I found this wonderful person, this fine young man, so we needn't worry that we'd have a good state senator,' " said former 5th Ward Democratic committeeman Alan Dobry, who volunteered to help both Palmer and Obama that year.

In recent interviews, Obama and Palmer agreed that he asked her whether she wanted to keep her options open and file to run for her state Senate seat as a fallback in case her congressional bid failed.

Obama says he told her: "We haven't started the campaign yet."

"I hadn't publicly announced," he said. "But what I said was that once I announce, and I have started to raise money, and gather supporters, hire staff and opened up an office, signed a lease, then it's going to be very difficult for me to step down. And she gave me repeated assurances that she was in [the congressional race] to stay."

Obama "did say that to me," Palmer says now. "And I certainly did say that I wasn't going to run. There's no question about that."

But beyond that, the private discussions they held in 1995 are shrouded today in disputed and hazy memories.

Obama said Palmer gave him her formal endorsement. "I'm absolutely certain she … publicly spoke and sort of designated me," he recalled.

Palmer disputes that. "I don't know that I like the word 'endorsement,' " she said. "An endorsement to me, having been in legislative politics … that's a very formal kind of thing. I don't think that describes this. An 'informal nod' is how to characterize it."

In July 1995, Obama announced he was planning to run for Palmer's seat. He filed papers creating his fundraising committee a month later and officially announced his candidacy in September.

He emerged that winter as a gifted campaigner who after finishing hectic workdays would layer on thermal underwear to knock on South Side doors.

In impromptu street-corner conversations and media interviews, he disparaged local pols for putting self-preservation ahead of public service. At the last house on a dark block, "he would start a discussion that should have taken five minutes and pretty soon someone was cooking him dinner," said paid campaign consultant Carol Anne Harwell.

Then Palmer's congressional bid collapsed. On Nov. 28, 1995, she placed a distant third behind political powerhouses Jesse Jackson Jr., who holds that congressional seat today, and current state Senate President Emil Jones Jr.

Palmer didn't fade quietly away. Citing an "outpouring" of support, she upended the political landscape by switching gears and deciding to run in the March 1996 primary for her state Senate seat.

But she had two big problems. To get on the ballot, Palmer needed to file nominating petitions signed by at least 757 district voters—and the Dec. 18 deadline was just days away.

And then there was Obama, the bright up-and-comer she had all but anointed.

Obama's aides said he seemed anguished over the prospect of defying Palmer. "I really saw turmoil in his face," Harwell said.

Obama sought advice from political veterans such as 4th Ward Ald. Toni Preckwinkle and then-15th Ward Ald. Virgil Jones, who say they urged him to hold his course.

"I thought the world of Alice Palmer," said state Rep. Barbara Flynn Currie (D-Chicago), now the House majority leader. But "at that point she had pulled her own plug."

According to Palmer, it was without her knowledge that her supporters initiated discussions to persuade Obama to step aside. They invited him to the home of state Rep. Lovana "Lou" Jones, now deceased. Obama arrived alone.

"It was a brief meeting," said Black, a Palmer friend who had advised Obama when he was a young community organizer in the mid-1980s.

Obama didn't try to justify his decision to reject Palmer's plea, Black said.

"He did not put it in inflammatory terms, he just did not back away. It was not arguments, it was stubbornness," Black said. "Barack had by then gone ahead in putting together his own campaign, and he just didn't want to stop."

'If you can get 'em, get 'em'

Just in time for the Dec. 18, 1995, filing deadline, Palmer submitted 1,580 signatures—about twice the minimum required. That day, Obama lashed out at her, telling the Tribune she had pressured him to withdraw.

"I am disappointed that she's decided to go back on her word to me," he said.

Obama campaign aides also responded that day—but quietly, and out of the limelight.

Davis and Dobry marshaled volunteers and began poring through the nominating petitions of Palmer and the three lesser-known Democrats, according to interviews.

"We looked at those petitions and found that none of them met the requirements of the law," Dobry said. "Alice's people, they'd done it in a great hurry. Almost all her petitions were signed a day or so before the deadline."

According to Davis, Palmer "had kids gathering the names. I remember two of her circulators, Pookie and Squirt."

Davis and others urged Obama to file legal challenges.

Such tactics are legal and frequently used in Chicago. Ballot challenges eliminated 67 of the 245 declared aldermanic candidates in Chicago before this past February's elections, an election board spokesman said.

Davis recalled telling Obama: "If you can get 'em, get 'em. Why give 'em a break?

"I said, 'Barack, I'm going to knock them all off.'

"He said, 'What do you need?'

"I said, 'I need an attorney.'

"He said, 'Who is the best?'

"I said, 'Tom Johnson.' "

Obama already knew civil rights attorney and fellow Harvard Law graduate Thomas Johnson, who had waged election cases for the late Mayor Washington and had offered Obama informal legal advice since the days of Project Vote.

With Johnson's legal help, Obama's team was confident. They piled binders of polling sheets in the election board office on the second floor of City Hall, and on Jan. 2, 1996, began the days-long hearings that would eliminate the other Democrats.

Little-known candidate Marc Ewell filed 1,286 names, but Obama's objections left him 86 short of the minimum, and election officials struck him from the ballot, records show. Ewell filed a federal lawsuit contesting the board's decision, but Johnson intervened on Obama's behalf and prevailed when Ewell's case was dismissed days later.

Ewell could not be reached for comment, but the federal judge's decision showed how he was tripped up by complexities in the election procedures.

City authorities had just completed a massive, routine purge of unqualified names that eliminated 15,871 people from the 13th District rolls, court records show.

Ewell and other Obama rivals had relied on early 1995 polling sheets to verify the signatures of registered voters—but Obama's challenges were decided at least in part using the most recent, accurate list, records show.

Askia filed 1,899 signatures, but the Obama team sustained objections to 1,211, leaving him 69 short, records show.

Leafing through scrapbooks in his South Shore apartment, Askia, a perennially unsuccessful candidate, acknowledges that he paid Democratic Party precinct workers $5 a sheet for some of the petitions, and now suspects they used a classic Chicago ruse of passing the papers among themselves to forge the signatures. "They round-tabled me," Askia said.

Palmer to this day does not concede the flaws that Obama's team found in her signatures. She maintains that she could have overcome the Obama team's objections and stayed on the ballot if she had more time and resources.

It was wrenching to withdraw, she said. "But sit for a moment, catch your breath, get up and keep going. I'm a very practical person. Politics is not the only vehicle for accomplishing things." She became a special assistant to the president of the University of Illinois and is now retired.

Obama said he has not been in touch with Palmer since 1996. "No, not really, no," he said.

Though she hasn't determined whom to support in the presidential race, Palmer, 67, said her dispute with Obama doesn't affect her assessment of his fitness to hold office.

Saying that jobless high school dropouts "are sitting on the steps next to my house," Palmer added: "There is a savage economy going on out here, and we've got collateral damage. I am looking closely to see who has the courage, the smarts."
 
in the Cheney mold, really ?


explain the personal gain



she tried to get a trooper fired for a personal family reason.

let's not forget, we have a president who started a war because someone tried to kill his dad.

elected office is for the settlement of personal grievances?
 
Who is the real reformer?

Which V P candidate is the real reformer?

Which candidate only talks about change?

I don´t know.

You think Obama only talks about change? Hmmm I don´t know. You have better insight because I just hear foreign news and his speeches show he has a vision. A good vision imho. But what has he done in Senate? In compare to McCain or the VP candidates? Can you tell me!

I admit I´m getting interested in American elections as the race is coming to an end.
 
she tried to get a trooper fired for a personal family reason.

let's not forget, we have a president who started a war because someone tried to kill his dad.

elected office is for the settlement of personal grievances?

I am aware of the scandal


but not the facts.

She wanted her ex-brother-in -law to lose his job in law enforcement. Her sister was tied up in a messy divorce.
( Could she pick up some PUMAs, here :wink: )

I do know that law enforcement can not be fired with out cause. I have friends that serve on Civil Service Board.

We could not even fire a cop that was in a bar drinking on the clock.


I just don't see this as being Cheney like. Cheney won't even recognize his own daughter and her partner.

And when you say personal gain, that leads one to believe she tried to enrich herself with money or something.


no doubt this incident will see more light I don't expect it to rise to anything more serious than a sister looking out for her little sister.

Will it be less acceptable to most people than living in a mansion partially paid for by a convicted felon
while your brother lives in a shack on a dollar a day. :shrug:
 
Despite VP nomination, Palin investigation continues
By Corey Allen-Young, CBS 11 News Reporter
Article Last Updated: 08/30/2008 07:25:29 PM AKDT


Governor Palin has made a big splash onto the national stage, however her state investigation here in Alaska continues.
Back in late July the legislative council approved $100,000 to investigate Governor Palin's potential abuse of power. Since, special investigator Steve Branchflower has been working methodically to bring to light the facts of a case that have only recently surfaced.

"The status of the investigation is that Steve Branchflower is taking statements right now from former members of the administration, and scheduling other appointments with other members of the administration, up to, and including Governor Palin to find out the facts of what happened," said Senator Hollis French, who is in charge of the legislative

investigation of Palin.
Branchflower is looking into the events that led up to the firing of former public safety commissioner Walt Monegan. It is alleged that Monegan may have been fired for refusing to fire Alaska State Trooper Michael Wooten, who went through a messy divorce with Palin's sister and is currently in the midst of a custody battle.

Regardless of Palin's status as the vice presidential nominee, many are calling for the investigation's continuance, "There is too much information to just erase it as a mistake," said Senator Lyda Green, a Republican from Wasilla, "It needs to be followed through very diligently, very carefully."

"The fact is the investigation will continue to go on regardless of governor Palin's position as the vice presidential nominee," said Andrew Halcro, who ran against Palin for governor in 2006.

Even though Governor Palin is now the vice president nominee, some have questioned her nomination whilst under a cloud of suspicion.

"I don't know how they would do that given the fact that Branchflower just began his investigation and there is a lot out there that is unknown," said Halcro.

"We certainly don't want to see anything like this on the national level if it is found there is abuse of powers on the state level," said Green.


i wonder how this is going to come into play with the future debates..:hmm:
 
i wonder how this is going to come into play with the future debates..:hmm:

Branchflower is looking into the events that led up to the firing of former public safety commissioner Walt Monegan. It is alleged that Monegan may have been fired for refusing to fire Alaska State Trooper Michael Wooten, who went through a messy divorce with Palin's sister and is currently in the midst of a custody battle.


I will go out on a limb here

and say not too much will come of this

again this is not a case of corruption for 'personal enrichment'

where she steered a multi-million dollar contract to a family member

like Joe Biden may have done with one of his children.
 
That second link is pathetic. She actually laughs as some stupid shock-jock insults one of her opponents, calling her a cancer, a bitch, fat, and implying she's a terrible mother. It strikes me as incredibly immature on her part, and also a plainly bad political move. Makes me question her judgment quite a bit.

One would hope that the 2nd in line for the most powerful position on the planet would have the maturity to denounce those kind of petty insults, let alone not laugh along with them.
 
Haven't been on today & don't have time to read through if this has been posted already, but it'd be hilarious if true. Be sure to click on the links to see the pictures:

Alaskan Governor's child may be her daughter's? - iReport.com

Alaskan Governor's child may be her daughter's?




Posted by: PaulTosone // 1 day ago // viewed 81,641 times
Atlanta, Georgia // embed media
Last updated: 15 hours ago
The nation has been abuzz today with talk of Sarah Palin, John McCain's surprise vice-presidential pick. The internet and news media exploded in the hours following the announcement.

Along with all the stories making their way through the news cycle is one regarding Trig Palin, her youngest child. Apparently, there has been suspicion, some reported through Alaskan media outlets even before the Vice Presidential buzz, that the child actually belongs to her daughter, Bristol Palin. Normally this would be a personal issue, but this becomes a public matter because of Sarah Palin's stance against abortion and birth control, promoting 'abstinence only' beliefs.
The story seems ludicrious, and surely the GOP workers that vetted her would have stopped McCain from choosing her if anything like this were true. Only, now it has come out that Governor Sarah Palin was not vetted properly. The McCain camp states that they didn't feel it was necessary.
Even if it is entirely false and ludicrous, people are talking about it, and are quite interested in it. It has cropped up on a number of liberal and conservative blogs and sites. One Republican blog pre-empted the rumors, urging people to support Governor Palin "no matter what happens." It is absurd to believe Barack Obama is a Muslim, but that hasn't stopped 10% to 15% of America believing it is true. It remains to be seen if this story will sprout legs. So far, no media outlet has outright disproved the rumor (which should be very easy to do), though the Anchorage Daily News has reported the rumor.

The believers have a few scattered points:

1. Bristol Palin left school for an extended period of time, due to mononucleosis according to her family for the last 4-5 months of Trig's pregnancy. Some classmates claimed later that they had seen Bristol Palin pregnant.

2. Sarah Palin did not reveal to anyone outside her family that she was pregnant until 8 months into her pregnancy. Even then, she showed no signs of pregnancy. Alaskan news outlets commented on this, but did not go further. There are pictures of her at Super Tuesday (just a month before the baby was born).

Baby news strikes a chord: Politics | adn.com

She is notably a very trim woman, so it would likely be difficult to hide a pregnancy.

3. There are supposed photos showing Bristol Palin having gained weight, possibly significantly so in the abdomen. I haven't been able to verify these.
4. Sarah Palin went into labor in Dallas just before she was due to deliver a keynote address at the Republican Governors' Energy Conference, and flew to Seattle, then Alaska while still in labor.

newsminer.com • Palin says she felt safe flying to Alaska to have baby

Supposedly, she was in labor during the 8 hour flight, and the crew and attendants did not know.

(Quote from the Article Above):

""Governor Palin was extremely pleasant to flight attendants and her
stage of pregnancy was not apparent by observation as she didn't show
any signs of distress," Boren said."

This is extremely risky behavior, and you are advised by doctors, traditionally, not to fly once you are past 7 months pregnant. If airlines are made aware, sometimes they will prevent you from flying. Sarah Palin did not inform the flight.

5. Sarah has had four children before, and a prolonged labor that lasted a flight from Dallas to Alaska is extremely unlikely, as labor times usually decrease with the number of births.

6. There is also some rumor of an interview with a co-worker of Todd Palin at the oil fields in Prudhoe Bay (North Slope, where Todd Palin worked for BP), though I haven't been able to verify this. The co-worker claims Todd told him of the situation, supposedly.
7. Likewise, there were at the time a few classmates of Bristol's that claimed they had seen her pregnant.
8. Sarah Palin appeared 4 months before the baby's birth in Vogue magazine, and was "trim and lithe." (Searching for photos.)

Now, the counterpoints are that:

-Of course, this is all very far-fetched. Republicans would have vetted her and this would have never slipped past them

-She may not have been showing the pregnancy, despite her trim and slim frame, because of the low birthweight of infants with Downs Syndrome.

-Mothers at 44 (as Sarah Palin is), have an extremely high rate of Downs Syndrome in their children. However, this does not exclude Bristol Palin, as very young mothers also have an increased risk of Downs Syndrome in their children.

The attached photo is Sarah Palin at Super Tuesday (2-05-08), credit to Brian Wallace of the Juneau Empire.

I had another photo of Palin at the Dallas RGEC, but I cannot seem to locate it.

I was hoping someone at CNN could just clear this matter up. It might make interesting filler, to have a story on what the internet has been talking about!

Paul Tosone

Atlanta, GA

<UPDATE>

-A picture of Governor Palin at home with her family that was printed in the Anchorage Daily News, taken six weeks before Trig's birth on March 9th.

All abuzz about Palin: Alaska News | adn.com

-This is a picture from the Alaskan Governor's website. It is only dated "2007." Some say that Bristol here appears to have perhaps a baby bump.

http://gov.state.ak.us/photos/PalinFamily_Outside_v01.jpg

-An Alaskan PodShow Podcast called Hike of the Week. Sarah Palin appears here and takes a hike and tour with the host. She is seven and a half months pregnant.

Hike of the Week with Governor Sarah Palin

-The Alaskan Government website has removed links to some photographs of the Palin family. This probably has nothing to do with this story here, but I thought I should mention it, for posterity.

-Here is an article posted on DailyKos that compiles much of the same information I have here.
Daily Kos: Sarah Palin Is NOT The Mother [Photos+Video]
-Here is an excerpt from a Wallstreet Journal article, accounting her labor, according to her:


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gov. Palin's opted to board a jet from Dallas in April
while about to deliver a child. Gov. Palin, who was eight months
pregnant, says she felt a few contractions shortly before she was to
give a keynote speech to an energy summit of governors in Dallas. But
she says she went ahead with it after her doctor in Alaska advised her
to put her feet up to rest. "I was not going to miss that speech," she
says.

She rushed so quickly from the podium afterwards that
Texas Gov. Rick Perry nervously asked if she was about to deliver the
baby then. She made it to the airport, and gave birth hours after
landing in Anchorage to Trig, who is diagnosed with Down Syndrome.
"Maybe they shouldn't have let me fly, but I wasn't showing much so
they didn't know," she says."

It's not on any of the major news sites yet, but if you google "Bristol Palin" & "pregnant," you get hundreds of articles.
 
Reading through a few of those links makes for a pretty convincing case that this is true. Even without the photos there were too many odd choices made.

Although ultimately I don't know how much bearing this would or should have on the election. Lying about a personal matter (especially one as sensitive as a child's pregnancy when you're a staunchly conservative, anti-sex ed/abstinence only conservative) doesn't necessarily indicate how you conduct yourself in your professional life. Then again, lying about a personal matter has gotten some people impeached. :shrug:
 
Haven't been on today & don't have time to read through if this has been posted already, but it'd be hilarious if true. Be sure to click on the links to see the pictures:



It's not on any of the major news sites yet, but if you google "Bristol Palin" & "pregnant," you get hundreds of articles.


a few hours back

when I heard that she flew from texas to alaska in labor

I googled and saw the a picture of family with the 17 year old holding the baby

and the wheels in my head started turning.


well, either it is her baby

or her grand child

I do think in the next fews days

the truth will get out.

as for that article

with all the hearsay :shrug:

I have written better fiction than that

that has been picked up in blogs

and had a life on the internet



but if this girl was walking around pregnant

and the mom was not

and if there are doctors and health care workers that know the 17 yr old had the baby


this thing will blow wide open



so going with my predictions

I will say it is bullshit

and Palin is not a Grandma, yet.
 
Was she at the Grassy Knoll too? Maybe it was one of the three hobos picked up on the rail car behind the knoll who fathered the baby too?
 
I have no idea if it's true or not, but if it is, I think it's more tragic than funny that some people think this sort of cover up is still necessary in 2008.
 
it's absurd for Republicans to charge Obama with inexperience when Palin is manifestly less experienced than Obama.

and for someone so obsessed with foreign policy, it's strange to have a VP who has no actual record of ever saying anything at all about foreign policy.

so as McCain has show us, experience doesn't matter at all. he's said, "you know all my years in Washington? you know all the foreign leaders i've met with? you know all the secret briefings i've attended? you see, folks, none of that matters. not even a bit. what matters is that you're authentic and spunky and you help me with the political math and enable me to win a news cycle and keep the pundits talking for days about how mistifying my pick was and at the same time, i've stroked the Know-Nothing creationist base of the Republican party who would have bitten my head off had i gone with people who actually are qualified, like Lieberman or Ridge. the only thing that matters in this race is personal story -- did i mention i was a POW? -- and being anti-choice. you know all my achievements that i've been talking about since 2006? they don't matter! i'm a POW, and Palin is a PTA mom. we're in it to win it!"


No one has anywhere near the experience that McCain has, and it actually would have been nearly impossible for McCain to pick a VP with the equal of 50 years of experience in National Security and Foreign Policy. Sarah Palin has spent her entire time in elected office outside of Washington and has experience that neither Biden, Obama, or McCain has and that has been a feature of every Presidential ticket that Americans have voted for over the past 40 years except in 1988.

Obama has slightly more experience than Palin, and its laughable to go after Palin over her experience when she is the VP candidate while Obama is the top of the Democratic ticket.

While I still would have prefered that McCain go with Ridge, there were risk there that could split the party. Its one of the reasons that Colin Powell decided not to run for the Repubican nomination in 1996.

Its interesting to note that no one in here criticized the possiblity of Sarah Palin as a candidate for VP in this way prior to McCain's selection of her friday.
 
I am aware of the scandal


but not the facts.



there is a probe, and the results of that probe will be released in November.

i think we can all understand what she did on a human level.

but if we're going to wave her executive experience as some sort of trump card over Obama and Biden (but, yet, not McCain) as the increasingly desperate Republicans are doing,

then it's entirely appropriate to point out the fact that it's quite likely that she abused the executive power she was given

in order to exact revenge over a personal issue.
 
Reading through a few of those links makes for a pretty convincing case that this is true. Even without the photos there were too many odd choices made.

Although ultimately I don't know how much bearing this would or should have on the election. Lying about a personal matter (especially one as sensitive as a child's pregnancy when you're a staunchly conservative, anti-sex ed/abstinence only conservative) doesn't necessarily indicate how you conduct yourself in your professional life. Then again, lying about a personal matter has gotten some people impeached. :shrug:


before I thought it was 65-70 % bullshit

but, after reading through all that
and looking at the pictures and videos


I will say I am now 95+ % sure it is bullshit
 
Obama's bounce appears to already be starting to slide. In today's Gallup poll he only leads by 6 points, down from the 8 points he had led by on Friday and Saturday. Obama only led by an average of 3 points through out the summer since winning the nomination, and its possible he could be down to 3 points before we see the first polling results from the Republican convention.

Gallup Daily: Obama-Biden Ticket Leads by 6 Points
 
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