Obama General Discussion, vol. 4

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Sense Mrs G is no longer posting things hoping they would stick:

Official site of Dreams from My Real Father (2012)

Has there ever been any other president with so many conspiracy theories tied to them? I mean I remember Bush and the Skull and Bones theories but I can't really remember any other president, at least in modern times that has a whole section of the internet taken up by conspiracy theories. :lol:

History will laugh at the "far left" narratives spewed by the right.
 
Newsweek-Obama-Gay-President.jpg


The halo is back :loveshower: officially kicking off the 2012 campaign season in the mainstream press.
 
Yes, but it's a gay halo, and everyone knows that angels can't be gay, because angels are from the Bible.
 
^I agree. But Newsweek is kind of lame in general. I just got subscription as part of my NPR membership and I haven't been particularly impressed. I like TIME much better--I've been a paying subscriber for something like 15 years!
 
It doesn't even make sense, and it's so tokenistic... they would have been better served going with that cartoon Obama on a unicorn shooting rainbows from his hands that's been doing the rounds.
 
with that sketchy birth certificate and both of his parents dead,
I guess his country of origin will always be debatable
 
Has removing the prohibition on foreign-born individuals from becoming President been seriously discussed in the US? I haven't seen it, but obviously I'm not American and have only kept loose tabs on this whole silly "birther" debate. It seems to me a wholly unnecessary prohibition that has led to a wholly unnecessary debate and conspiracy theory.

I mean, Australia has had six Prime Ministers born overseas, including the current PM, and New Zealand has had twenty-two, which is more than the amount of Kiwi-born PMs!* Australia requires electoral candidates to renounce any foreign citizenships they may hold (so I'll never be able to stand for election here, as I'd sooner gnaw off my own hands than renounce my New Zealand citizenship), but New Zealand doesn't. Haven't had any subversive agents of foreign powers yet! Hell, three out of New Zealand's four longest serving PMs were born overseas.

*The important disclaimer here being that formal colonisation of New Zealand only began in 1840, with the first PM taking office in 1856 - given that only three Kiwi PMs have been aged under forty, it's unreasonable to expect any of the twelve pre-1880 Prime Ministers to have been born in New Zealand rather than the UK. This exception doesn't apply to Australia, since federation took place over a century after colonisation began; I'm sure plenty of state premiers in the 19th century were UK-born.
 
Not to my recollection, no. We should discuss that issue a bit more, though, 'cause it'd be interesting to see what people think of the idea of changing that law. I mean, we had Schwartzenegger run California, so if someone who wasn't born here can run a state, I don't see why we can't allow them to be president.

(I know people hate Schwartzenegger, though, 'cause California's in a world of hurt right now financially. So that's not the best example. But still, you get my overall point, hopefully :wink:?)

As long as somebody runs the country in a competent, decent, intelligent manner, that's all I'm interested in. I really couldn't care less what part of the world they're from.
 
I know. Imagine explaining that to future generations.

What I also love is that he was a Republican. And Reagan was an actor before he became president, too, and again, was Republican. And yet conservatives still feel the need to bitch about Obama being more of a "celebrity" than a politician.

I also like that for all the whining Americans do about how celebrities should "stick to their day jobs" and "stay out of politics", we've elected a few of them to political office over the years. Yay for inconsistent mindsets!
 
Axver said:
Has removing the prohibition on foreign-born individuals from becoming President been seriously discussed in the US? I haven't seen it, but obviously I'm not American and have only kept loose tabs on this whole silly "birther" debate. It seems to me a wholly unnecessary prohibition that has led to a wholly unnecessary debate and conspiracy theory.

I mean, Australia has had six Prime Ministers born overseas, including the current PM, and New Zealand has had twenty-two, which is more than the amount of Kiwi-born PMs!* Australia requires electoral candidates to renounce any foreign citizenships they may hold (so I'll never be able to stand for election here, as I'd sooner gnaw off my own hands than renounce my New Zealand citizenship), but New Zealand doesn't. Haven't had any subversive agents of foreign powers yet! Hell, three out of New Zealand's four longest serving PMs were born overseas.

*The important disclaimer here being that formal colonisation of New Zealand only began in 1840, with the first PM taking office in 1856 - given that only three Kiwi PMs have been aged under forty, it's unreasonable to expect any of the twelve pre-1880 Prime Ministers to have been born in New Zealand rather than the UK. This exception doesn't apply to Australia, since federation took place over a century after colonisation began; I'm sure plenty of state premiers in the 19th century were UK-born.
Click to expand...

Our Constitution was written by God through the Founding Fathers. It is infallible and should never be changed in any significant way.
 
Irvine511 said:
Unless the gays want toget married. Then we need a big huge NO FAGS ALLOWED amendment.
Click to expand...

Well, that's implied by the First Commandment of the Constitution, which states that "Merka is a Christian Nation".
 
The big problem with the GOP is that it is almost exclusively white and aging. Presently, half of all births in the US are non-white, and in 20 years these kids will be voting. Resentment and fear of modernity may motivate the North Carolinians to get to the polls today, but the clock is ticking. If the GOP doesn't rethink it's immigration stance, it's opposition to marriage equality, and expand its appeal beyond white men in the suburbs and exurbs by offering more than anti-tax, anti-government rhetoric, it's got a big problem.
 
Moonlit_Angel said:
Not to my recollection, no. We should discuss that issue a bit more, though, 'cause it'd be interesting to see what people think of the idea of changing that law. I mean, we had Schwartzenegger run California, so if someone who wasn't born here can run a state, I don't see why we can't allow them to be president.

(I know people hate Schwartzenegger, though, 'cause California's in a world of hurt right now financially. So that's not the best example. But still, you get my overall point, hopefully :wink:?)

As long as somebody runs the country in a competent, decent, intelligent manner, that's all I'm interested in. I really couldn't care less what part of the world they're from.
Click to expand...

Exactly - I don't see why the office of President so desperately MUST be held by somebody born in the US while there are no place-of-birth restrictions on other important political positions. I'm surprised this hasn't been a significant topic of discussion, but the tone of conversation I see from many Americans just seems to unquestioningly accept that the President should be born in the US.

It seems to me that it rules out a decent amount of the talent pool. Hell, if somebody's come to a country, adopted it as their own, and aspires to lead it, it's probably safe to say they're as patriotic and fond of it as any natural-born citizen. I hate to think of the talent New Zealand would have lost if there had been a prohibition on foreign-born Prime Ministers - many of our best and most influential PMs would have been disqualified.

digitize said:
Our Constitution was written by God through the Founding Fathers. It is infallible and should never be changed in any significant way.
Click to expand...

I'm just waiting for somebody to print a Bible with the US Constitution in it.
 
Axver said:
Exactly - I don't see why the office of President so desperately MUST be held by somebody born in the US while there are no place-of-birth restrictions on other important political positions. I'm surprised this hasn't been a significant topic of discussion, but the tone of conversation I see from many Americans just seems to unquestioningly accept that the President should be born in the US.
Click to expand...

Pretty much the only time anyone seems to pay attention to the Constitution these days here is if it has to do with either the first or second amendments. And maybe the fourth or fifth amendments every once in a while. The rest of the document might as well not exist.

I've never understood that rule, either. Especially given that our nation essentially was built thanks to immigration.

Axver said:
It seems to me that it rules out a decent amount of the talent pool. Hell, if somebody's come to a country, adopted it as their own, and aspires to lead it, it's probably safe to say they're as patriotic and fond of it as any natural-born citizen.
Click to expand...

Agreed, especially with your second sentence there. It's so funny the way we view immigration in this country sometimes. We talk about how the fact that so many people want to come here proves why the U.S. is so great, and we talk all the time about the "melting pot" of America and how great it is.

Then we turn around and put a ton of restrictions on immigrants and treat them like lesser citizens. Go figure.
 
What good would it do to open things up for a foreign-born President that still has to preside over a practically irresolvable, broken/corrupted/sold out system?

Bigger fish to fry.

The bigger problem in this context is why we can only have a maximum of eight years of Reagan, Clinton, Obama, or Bush in the White House...and yet you could easily have 36 years of Dick Lugar in the Senate. I am all for the two term limit on the Presidency. I am entirely against allowing more than two terms for Senators. Among the many arguments in favor of congressional term limits, this is another to toss on the growing pile.
 
Indeed, it's certainly not the most pressing issue we should be addressing at this time, but it's an interesting discussion nonetheless, and something I wouldn't mind having brought up more often in the national discussion down the line if/when necessary.

Fully agreed on the term limit stuff, though, yes. Absolutely.
 
Moonlit_Angel said:
Pretty much the only time anyone seems to pay attention to the Constitution these days here is if it has to do with either the first or second amendments. And maybe the fourth or fifth amendments every once in a while. The rest of the document might as well not exist.
Click to expand...

Actually the Obama Administration argued before the supreme Court that Obamacare is constitutional under the Commerce Clause. Gay Rights advocates argue for marriage equality under the 14th Amendment and conservatives (and unevolved Democrats) argue against both using the 10th amendment.
 
Glad to see you agree that the only way to deal with debt is to raise revenues.

Because we sure as hell can't cut our way out of this.
 
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