PhilsFan
Blue Crack Addict
My mother is a moderate-conservative. She found Palin appalling and embarrassing to her as a woman.
Obama General Discussion
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Good find. Speaks for itself.This should show perfectly how the Republicans are the extreme and Democrats the center now. That is pretty indisputable.
Not only do we have the polling of the Republican base to show this, we have Republican members of Congress who have advanced some form of each of the conspiracies mentioned above.
Especially with respect to the birth certificate and socialism. Then there was the whole ACORN thing repeated over and over again by Boehner. How the hell could ACORN steal a landslide?
These people are absolutely insane. How could a Republican Congress person question where the President was born? They are all familiar with the law. They know Obama travels overseas, and in order to do so, you need to have a passport, which by the way, requires a birth certificate to obtain. Obama released his birth certificate during the campaign.
These Republicans have no intention of seeking bipartisan cooperation, and Obama has been clear from day 1 about seeking out their support. Yet the sad reality is if you ask most people, they will say Obama is the hyper partisan one.
deep
Blue Crack Addict
Where??
On Interference.com?
Certainly not in MA, Virginia of NJ.
It is only Feb. But if things don't change. In Nov the independents will break for the GOP, decisively.
No, not on interference.com.
In terms of POLICY.
Look at the things in that poll.
Are those mainstream views?
Look at the things Obama has proposed. The health care plan is in fact a centrist plan, not a government takeover. It is the Republicans in Congress running away from common sense things like budget deficit commissions, pay as you go, reducing farm subsidies, etc. They would rather lie, just like their supporters.
This is what I was talking about, POLICY. The elections have nothing to do with whether POLICIES AND BELIEFS ARE CENTRIST OR NOT.
It is an issue of voter trends vs the nature of policies.
Now, Deep, we have been through this before:
NJ and Virginia- State elections, decided on state issues. The only election in 2009 with any federal implications, NY 23, a Democrat won.
Massachusetts: I explained this to you as well. The exit polls do not back up the GOP assertion that Brown voters put him there to kill Obama's agenda. Someone here even linked an article to that effect.
You are right- it is only February- still a long time for voters to see the GOP obstruction agenda out in full force. The voters do not like obstruction either. I remind you, the Republicans in Congress still have lower approval ratings than Obama, by far.
Democrats have some work to do, especially with independents, but they are volatile by nature and generally vote based on whether they "feel" things are good or not. So the incumbents get blamed, whether they deserve it or not. Most people do not care about the long view, nor do they understand how we got into this mess and how getting out of it is going to be an inevitably slow and difficult process, no matter who is in office.
Whatever, I don't put alot of stock in the "most people" equation anyway, as most people can't tell you what is in the 1st amendment and most people think Judge Judy is a Supreme Court Justice.
We'll just see what happens in November.
Bluer White
New Yorker
No no, just wait until the independents see a few more Daily Kos polls. That will change some minds !!!
Kieran McConville
ONE love, blood, life
I might briefly bring up my old hobby horse and note that voluntary voting does tend to drag politics far from the centre. In Australia, a party like the GOP, talking only red meat to its 'base' like that... would be headed for oblivion. Utter wipeout.
2861U2
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
This should show perfectly how the Republicans are the extreme and Democrats the center now. That is pretty indisputable.
Not only do we have the polling of the Republican base to show this, we have Republican members of Congress who have advanced some form of each of the conspiracies mentioned above.
Especially with respect to the birth certificate and socialism. Then there was the whole ACORN thing repeated over and over again by Boehner. How the hell could ACORN steal a landslide?
These people are absolutely insane. How could a Republican Congress person question where the President was born? They are all familiar with the law. They know Obama travels overseas, and in order to do so, you need to have a passport, which by the way, requires a birth certificate to obtain. Obama released his birth certificate during the campaign.
These Republicans have no intention of seeking bipartisan cooperation, and Obama has been clear from day 1 about seeking out their support. Yet the sad reality is if you ask most people, they will say Obama is the hyper partisan one.
That poll is so completely phony it's laughable that people are taking it seriously. It's done by the Kos, whose founder invented this poll to put in his new book focused on comparing the Republican Party and the Taliban. It's made up...
Even if you buy that it's real, Kos/Research2000 have gotten so many polls so incredibly wrong that their operation has no credibility left whatsoever if it ever had any to begin with.
PhilsFan
Blue Crack Addict
I'd like to see a "legitimate" poll on this topic, then. Because most of that seems really, really realistic.
coolian2
Blue Crack Supplier
i wonder if there's a fox news poll that can be believed.
not to mention it's not the first poll that's made similar claims. i'd love to know what the 39% believe obama has done to be impeached.
Irvine511
Blue Crack Supplier
A few things:
1.)Research 2000 did the poll for daily kos, it was not a joint effort. There is no historical kos/r2000 operation like you suggest. Show me where research 2000 has gotten anything laughably wrong or used phony methodology. All polling companies have gotten plenty of things wrong in the past, nature of the business. Its like saying "the weatherman was wrong 50% of the time, fire his ass!" They are not a poll that has a reputation for bad faith methods or shoddy work, unless there is something you can tell us about this.
2.)Any site that has a bias can not automatically be discounted. Alot of liberal and conservative sites/publications(not fox news or move on) come up pretty clean on the facts. Daily Kos has their views, but their not notorious for butchering the facts like say, Rush or O'Reilly.
3.)This poll is of self identified Republicans. The methodology was published. Tell us where the problem is. What makes it laughable? What part are you ready to deny? The self identified Republicans part? The numbers? It was a pretty simple, straightforward, few-dimension poll. Funny thing is this poll has been widely reported by legitimate news agencies and I can not find anything rebutting it with a google search. Maybe you can point us in the right direction?
4.)Where is any of this inconsistent with what we are hearing from Republicans on the street and in Congress? Are you really ready to deny that a plurality of Republicans think ACORN stole the election, or that Obama is a socialist? How about the birth certificate? Obama had to create a whole website dedicated to rebutting these claims they are so widespread. This has been repeated so many times now that you even have Democrats thinking that the health care bill is "socialized medicine." This poll would be, and probably has been replicated everywhere. I know it already has been with respect to Sarah Palin- she is coming in as the 2012 favorite.
No doubt, most Republicans think an imbecile like Sarah Palin(as opposed to highly intelligent Republicans like Crist, Pawlenty, Tom Ridge, Orrin Hatch, John Warner, Colin Powell, Chuck Hagel, Dick Lugar,etc) is more qualified than Obama. Their votes said as much during the campaign. Not many Democrats voted McCain, and almost all Republicans did.
So given what I said above, the burden is on you to tell us where it is made up. Don't just assert.
The same thing Clinton did to get impeached: nothing.
I know I'll get people coming back at me saying he lied to congress, etc, but what the hell were they doing wasting our money investigating his penis in the 1st place? Unprecedented, I may add.
For Conservative men of supposedly strict sexual mores, I have never seen people so obsessed with a sex act between 2 consenting adults.
I fault Clinton for being deceptive the whole time about Monica, but its not something that Congress had any business investigating in the first place.
Bill Clinton should have sat in the oval office, looked right into the camera, said "I admit it, I was wrong, I have human flaws like everyone else and I ask for your forgiveness and respect for my privacy as Hillary and I work this out."
coolian2
Blue Crack Supplier
no fucking way. i just made a fox news joke. are there really that many retards out there? jesus fuck. give up america. you're fucked.
i totally agree. in fact i almost mentioned this in my post, but decided not to, which is good anyway as you put it much more eloquently than i would've.
why do you think i want to move there? go green party of aotearoa new zealand!
deep
Blue Crack Addict
Impeachment talk is ridiculous
Obama won't be, can't be impeached
until the GOP has the majority in the House of Representatives
Obama won't be, can't be impeached
until the GOP has the majority in the House of Representatives
coolian2
Blue Crack Supplier
Kieran McConville
ONE love, blood, life
I thought all Democrat presidents were impeached on sight. Isn't it in the consitittuttion or somethink?
Vincent Vega
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
Election -> Inauguration -> Impeachment. Just a matter of time.
INDY500
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
d e s p e r a t i o n
PhilsFan
Blue Crack Addict
Just like the people who hated on Obama for trying marijuana in his teens while ignoring Bush's problems with drugs and alcohol well into his adult life, you find no problems at all with the mistake Obama made once as opposed to the blunders Bush had with, you know, basic English? He mispronounced a word, but it was the correct word. Bush would mispronounce words, use the wrong word, make words up.
No need to reconcile your hypocrisy. Ever. Because this guy's a Democrat.
Vincent Vega
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
Others declare war on nations which name they cannot even pronounce.
MrsSpringsteen
Blue Crack Addict
latimes.com
Opinion
The winter of America's discontent
Dissatisfaction with both political parties runs deep.
Tim Rutten February 5, 2010
It has been more than four decades since the Congress of the United States has been able to summon the will to pass a major piece of social legislation. Not since 1965, when Medicare and the Voting Rights Act both overcame decades of opposition to become law, has Congress proved itself up to the task.
Significant healthcare reform is all but dead for this session, and the chances of substantively addressing the regulatory breakdown that allowed Wall Street's irresponsible speculation to precipitate the worst global financial crisis since the Depression seem to recede with each passing day. So too the prospects for passage of further stimulus measures to remedy the crisis of unemployment and underemployment that continues to ravage the lives of families in states from Michigan to California.
In the face of these daunting issues, what was it that preoccupied the Senate on the eve of its long weekend recess? The legislative drama du jour is the standoff between the White House and Sen. Richard C. Shelby (R-Ala.), who has put a personal hold on more than 70 executive branch appointments until the Obama administration agrees to fund a couple of pork-barrel projects he has earmarked for his state. One involves tens of millions of dollars for an FBI laboratory focusing on improvised explosives -- something the bureau doesn't think it needs. The other involves contract specifications for an aerial tanker that Northrop Grumman and Airbus would manufacture in Alabama, if they win the deal. (Boeing also is competing for the plane, which it would build in Topeka, Kan., and Seattle.)
Unless the administration agrees to give Shelby what he wants, he intends to invoke an archaic senatorial privilege that allows him to prevent the chamber from considering any of the administration's nominees to executive branch vacancies, no matter how crucial. Without the 60 votes to force cloture -- another archaic convention -- there's nothing the Democrats or the White House can do.
Outside the Senate, Shelby's conduct would be called extortion; inside the chamber, it's a "parliamentary tactic."
It's also the sort of shabby situation that brings into sharp focus both the sources of congressional dysfunction and the popular discontent on both the left and right with the congressional parties. Earmarks and pork are anathema to a majority of conservatives and independents; the Senate's outdated, made-for-obstruction rules and susceptibility to special interests are a source of increasing frustration to liberals and some independents. Yet, here we have one senator from one Southern state obstructing with impunity an entire nation's business -- purely for his narrow constituency's financial interests.
You don't have to attend a "tea party" convention to see the corrosive effect this sort of otherworldly political navel-gazing has on American attitudes toward the institutions of national government and the parties vying to control them. Evidence of the damage is scattered throughout the recent polls:
A Wall Street Journal/NBC News survey, for example, found that although 52% of the nation's voters retain a favorable view of President Obama, only 38% have a similar appraisal of the Democratic Party. The Republicans fare even worse; just 30%, fewer than
1 in 3 voters, view the GOP favorably.
A recent CBS News poll found that nearly half of all Republicans, 45%, disapprove of their party's congressional delegation.
A national Washington Post/ABC News poll found that just 24% of Americans, fewer than 1 in 4, trust congressional Republicans, like Shelby, "to make the right decisions for the country's future." (Wonder why?) The House and Senate Democrats didn't fare all that better, and are trusted by just 32%. Forty-seven percent of those polled -- still less than half -- have confidence in Obama's ability to make the right decisions.
When people's mistrust of their elected officials and the parties reaches these levels, there is little for political leaders to do but take counsel from their own anger and anxieties -- and, these days, the popular mood fairly seethes with both those things. Discontent with the present and apprehension about the future have become the background noise of our politics, yet both sides of the congressional aisle seem deaf to the din.
In one of his magisterial explorations of German politics between the wars, the historian Ian Kershaw mused that "there are times -- they mark the danger point for a political system -- when politicians can no longer communicate, when they stop understanding the language of the people they are supposed to be representing."
It would be reckless not to insist that this country and its politics remain, in crucial ways, far distant from Weimar. It would be rash, though, to pretend that the distance remains as great as it once was.
Opinion
The winter of America's discontent
Dissatisfaction with both political parties runs deep.
Tim Rutten February 5, 2010
It has been more than four decades since the Congress of the United States has been able to summon the will to pass a major piece of social legislation. Not since 1965, when Medicare and the Voting Rights Act both overcame decades of opposition to become law, has Congress proved itself up to the task.
Significant healthcare reform is all but dead for this session, and the chances of substantively addressing the regulatory breakdown that allowed Wall Street's irresponsible speculation to precipitate the worst global financial crisis since the Depression seem to recede with each passing day. So too the prospects for passage of further stimulus measures to remedy the crisis of unemployment and underemployment that continues to ravage the lives of families in states from Michigan to California.
In the face of these daunting issues, what was it that preoccupied the Senate on the eve of its long weekend recess? The legislative drama du jour is the standoff between the White House and Sen. Richard C. Shelby (R-Ala.), who has put a personal hold on more than 70 executive branch appointments until the Obama administration agrees to fund a couple of pork-barrel projects he has earmarked for his state. One involves tens of millions of dollars for an FBI laboratory focusing on improvised explosives -- something the bureau doesn't think it needs. The other involves contract specifications for an aerial tanker that Northrop Grumman and Airbus would manufacture in Alabama, if they win the deal. (Boeing also is competing for the plane, which it would build in Topeka, Kan., and Seattle.)
Unless the administration agrees to give Shelby what he wants, he intends to invoke an archaic senatorial privilege that allows him to prevent the chamber from considering any of the administration's nominees to executive branch vacancies, no matter how crucial. Without the 60 votes to force cloture -- another archaic convention -- there's nothing the Democrats or the White House can do.
Outside the Senate, Shelby's conduct would be called extortion; inside the chamber, it's a "parliamentary tactic."
It's also the sort of shabby situation that brings into sharp focus both the sources of congressional dysfunction and the popular discontent on both the left and right with the congressional parties. Earmarks and pork are anathema to a majority of conservatives and independents; the Senate's outdated, made-for-obstruction rules and susceptibility to special interests are a source of increasing frustration to liberals and some independents. Yet, here we have one senator from one Southern state obstructing with impunity an entire nation's business -- purely for his narrow constituency's financial interests.
You don't have to attend a "tea party" convention to see the corrosive effect this sort of otherworldly political navel-gazing has on American attitudes toward the institutions of national government and the parties vying to control them. Evidence of the damage is scattered throughout the recent polls:
A Wall Street Journal/NBC News survey, for example, found that although 52% of the nation's voters retain a favorable view of President Obama, only 38% have a similar appraisal of the Democratic Party. The Republicans fare even worse; just 30%, fewer than
1 in 3 voters, view the GOP favorably.
A recent CBS News poll found that nearly half of all Republicans, 45%, disapprove of their party's congressional delegation.
A national Washington Post/ABC News poll found that just 24% of Americans, fewer than 1 in 4, trust congressional Republicans, like Shelby, "to make the right decisions for the country's future." (Wonder why?) The House and Senate Democrats didn't fare all that better, and are trusted by just 32%. Forty-seven percent of those polled -- still less than half -- have confidence in Obama's ability to make the right decisions.
When people's mistrust of their elected officials and the parties reaches these levels, there is little for political leaders to do but take counsel from their own anger and anxieties -- and, these days, the popular mood fairly seethes with both those things. Discontent with the present and apprehension about the future have become the background noise of our politics, yet both sides of the congressional aisle seem deaf to the din.
In one of his magisterial explorations of German politics between the wars, the historian Ian Kershaw mused that "there are times -- they mark the danger point for a political system -- when politicians can no longer communicate, when they stop understanding the language of the people they are supposed to be representing."
It would be reckless not to insist that this country and its politics remain, in crucial ways, far distant from Weimar. It would be rash, though, to pretend that the distance remains as great as it once was.
Bluer White
New Yorker
If states like Alabama can't vote out these clowns, then term limits should eventually remove them.
*wishful thinking*
*wishful thinking*
Irvine511
Blue Crack Supplier
things are bad. and it will be a long time before they are again what they once were. but they could have been a whole lot worse.
coolian2
Blue Crack Supplier
it's obama's fault.
Vincent Vega
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
Well, the Democrats should be careful with such things: If you assume responsibility for the good things, whether it's truly thanks to you or not, then you will also have to take the blame for things that go bad. It could backfire.
Did they just publish this graph, or did they also provide an explanation which policies since Obama taking office can be attributed to that development?
Irvine511
Blue Crack Supplier
both.
i think the large point is that things are slowly getting better, and they are trying to tie that to the president. because that's good news for them.
of course, there's not all that much the president can actually do about unemployment.
this is spin, to a degree, but there are true facts there. and it's nice to see my side show a little gumption.
INDY500
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
Very clever cover I must admit. But as for the president's New New Deal," well, I hope he fails.
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