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Old 03-27-2008, 10:54 PM   #261
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what would you do without my lessons

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Old 03-27-2008, 10:55 PM   #262
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I'd probably be a clueless poli-sci student

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Old 03-27-2008, 11:01 PM   #263
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Old 03-27-2008, 11:07 PM   #264
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Old 03-28-2008, 04:29 AM   #265
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I wish Senator Obama would have addressed the plight of Native Americans in his speech.

Too bad that wasn't politically advantageous.

Maybe I missed something.
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Old 04-01-2008, 08:33 AM   #266
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Obama Fails to Assuage White Indiana Voters With Speech on Race

Heidi PrzybylaTue Apr 1, 12:01 AM ET

April 1 (Bloomberg) -- Andrea Helmer was interested in Barack Obama until she heard sound bites of his fiery pastor's sermons. Last week, she volunteered for Hillary Clinton's campaign in Indiana.

``As things came out regarding some of the things his pastor has said, I got concerned,'' said Helmer, a 36-year-old respiratory therapist and mother of two in Evansville, Indiana.

Interviews with dozens of Democrats in this overwhelmingly white region -- where voters will go to the polls in the May 20 primary -- suggest residual concerns over the controversy involving Obama's former pastor, Reverend Jeremiah Wright.

To be sure, this flies in the face of most polls taken after Obama's widely praised March 18 speech on race and the Wright controversy. In a March 30 Gallup survey, he had widened his lead over Clinton among Democratic voters to 10 points. A week earlier, he was also up 10 points in a Pew Research poll.

In an NBC/Wall Street Journal national survey last week, he ran slightly ahead of Republican John McCain in a general- election match-up, while Clinton ran slightly behind.

The polls are ``good news'' for Obama, said Jenny Backus, an unaligned Democratic strategist. ``He was able to use what was a pretty potentially dangerous issue for his campaign as a way to reinforce his campaign message.''

Unease Among Whites

Still, there are stirrings of unease among white voters, including those who fear the issue will hurt Obama in a general election. Pew also found that 39 percent of all white voters said the controversy made them less favorable toward Obama.

John Friend, an uncommitted Democrat and Evansville city councilman, said Republicans may use Obama's ties to the pastor much in the same way they attacked Democratic candidate John Kerry's patriotism in 2004.

``It's going to be like the Swift Boat thing,'' Friend said.

Last month, excerpts of sermons in which Wright is heard saying ``God damn America'' and ``U.S. of KKKA'' were broadcast on television and distributed over the Internet. In response, Obama delivered what his aides billed as a major address on race on March 18 in which he condemned the remarks.

That didn't repair the damage for some white voters, said Trent Van Haaften, an Indiana state representative from Mount Vernon who is backing Obama.

One Visit

``The 10-second sound bite'' is all that many voters know about the Illinois senator, who so far has visited Indiana just once this year, Van Haaften said.

While Obama, 46, is far behind Clinton, 60, in the April 22 Pennsylvania primary, the Indiana contest is competitive. Even if he loses in Pennsylvania, winning in Indiana and North Carolina two weeks later could allow him to wrap up the nomination.

The Obama campaign had long seen friendly territory in Indiana and Helmer's majority white and rural eighth district, which borders the candidate's home state of Illinois.

The recent intense focus on Wright is complicating Obama's efforts to appeal to some in culturally conservative southwest Indiana, which has a record of electing Republicans and conservative Democrats. Evansville is 86 percent white and 11 percent black.

For Helmer, who said she is worried about the slumping economy and rising health-care costs, Clinton, a New York senator, is a familiar figure she associates with the better times of the administration of her husband, former President Bill Clinton.

More Overtime

``Back when Clinton was in office our money was more stable, jobs were coming in, my husband had a lot more overtime,'' Helmer said.

That familiarity, along with media coverage of the pastor controversy, is pushing voters toward Clinton, said Democrat Justin Jarvis, a 34-year-old Evansville health-care worker.

``I know people who were previously Obama supporters who view it as reverse racism at its worst,'' he said.

Michael Rivera, a 33-year-old computer programmer from Evansville, said he had donated to the Obama campaign and now believes his electability is damaged.

``I understood where he was coming from, but I don't think anyone else will,'' said Rivera, who currently is backing Clinton.

Obama Response

Obama has spent the past two weeks responding to questions about the issue and last week said he would have left the church if Wright hadn't announced plans to retire and acknowledged his comments were offensive.

On March 25, Clinton fanned the flames by saying Wright ``would not have been my pastor.''

Phil Hoy, a 71-year-old retired minister who represents Evansville in the General Assembly and supports Obama, said the episode is hard to overcome in his community.

``We are not the most progressive state,'' said Hoy, who belongs to the same denomination as Obama, the United Church of Christ.

In addition, Clinton visited Evansville last month.

Obama may be able to turn Indiana around. He is stepping up efforts to court white rural voters in Pennsylvania, where he is on a six-day bus tour with Senator Bob Casey.

Evansville Mayor Jonathan Weinzapfel, who hasn't endorsed a candidate, said he expects the picture to change if Obama makes a similar effort in his area.

``Before Senator Clinton announced her visit the only real enthusiasm I heard was for Senator Obama,'' he said.
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Old 04-02-2008, 12:54 AM   #267
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I've only seen one poll here so far, which has Clinton up by 9 points; Obama hasn't really campaigned here yet; and there's more than a month still to go. But yeah, I expect fallout from the Wright newsblitz will be among his biggest obstacles with (white) voters who weren't already firm Clinton supporters from the beginning. (It may not help that we're an open-primary state, either.) It's ridiculous and thoroughly disheartening to me that a few selected fire'n'brimstone quotes from a candidate's former pastor, rather than his own voting record, platform and public statements, could be anyone's critical deciding factor, but I do think for some it will be.
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Old 04-04-2008, 01:51 PM   #268
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This is a speech from a sincere person.

McCain Remarks on Dr. King and Civil Rights

CQ Transcripts
Friday, April 4, 2008; 12:06 PM


Alvieda King, Ralph Abernathy Jr., Dr. Montgomery, members of the Southern Christian Leadership Conference: I appreciate your kind invitation, and I am honored to stand with you at this place on this day.

Martin Luther King Jr., was not a man to flinch from harsh truth, and the same is required of all who come here to see where he was in the last hours of his life. The Lorraine Motel is a civil rights museum now, but in the memory of America it will always be a crime scene as well. On the National Register of Historic Places, there are few sites remembered with more regret, or touched with so much sorrow.

If we think only of that day and that moment, there is no inspiration to be gained here. The man we remember was a believer in the power of conscience and goodness to shape events. But this place will always stand as a reminder that cowardice and malevolence lay claim to their own victories. No good cause in this world -- however right in principle or pure in heart -- was ever advanced without sacrifice. And Dr. King knew this. He knew that men with nightsticks, tear-gas, and cattle prods were not the worst of what might be lying in wait each day and night. He was a man accustomed to the nearness of danger. And when death came, it found him standing upright, in open air, unafraid.

We see him today from a distance of four decades, more time than the man himself lived on this earth. And it would not be unusual if his stature or reputation had faded with the passing of the years. It happens sometimes that the judgments of history overrule contemporary opinion, indifferent to the fame and approval of the moment. But this has not been the case with the first-born son of Alberta and Martin Luther King, Sr. He only seems a bigger man from far away. The quality of his character is only more apparent. His good name will be honored for as long as the creed of America is honored. His message will be heard and understood for as long as the message of the gospels is heard and understood.

Forty years and more after the great struggles of the civil rights movement, we marvel that such fierce passions could be aroused in defense of such petty cruelties. Separate lunch counters, the preferred seat on a bus, one restroom for whites and another for everyone else -- these were among the prerogatives fought for as if on a point of the highest principle. There is no end to human pride when it goes unchecked, no limit to arrogance and presumption when they pass uncorrected. Like every citizen he spoke for, Martin Luther King had seen the underside of life in America, where the rules of respect, and fairness, and courtesy were thought not to apply. It was a humiliating existence, unjust in matters both large and small, merciless in its routine of insult, sparing not even the elderly or little children from its crude bullying.

For black men and women, as Dr. King wrote, it was a life "plagued with inner fears and outer resentments." And yet, as he knew, fear alone would never right the offense. And resentment alone would never overcome the wrong. "Along the way of life," he said, "someone must have sense enough and morality enough to cut off the chain of hate and evil. The greatest way to do that is through love."

Martin Luther King today is honored by the world, in such a way that it is easy to forget he once knew the scorn of the world. And it wasn't just force of personality that made him the man he was. It was the power of truth, spoken with a servant's heart and a voice like no other. He put it this way once, expressing the spirit of both the cause and its leader: "I said to myself over and over again, 'Keep Martin Luther King in the background and God in the foreground and everything will be all right. Remember you are a channel of the gospel and not the source.'"

When Dr. King and his comrades began to break that chain with their campaign of peaceful protest, there were those who said, "Wait. Just give it a little more time. Be patient. Be patient, and one day America will come around." But patience had been tried, over many generations, and still millions lived in what he called the smothering, airtight cage of injustice. For his marches in Birmingham, Montgomery, and elsewhere, for his sit-ins and his sermons, he was called an agitator, a trouble-maker, a malcontent, and a disturber of the peace. These are often the terms applied to men and women of conscience who will not endure cruelty, nor abide injustice. We hear them to this day -- in Darfur, Zimbabwe, Burma, Tibet, Iran and other lands -- directed at every brave soul who dares to disturb the peace of tyrants.

Sometimes the most radical thing is to be confronted with our own standards -- to be asked simply that we live up to the principles we profess. Even in this most idealistic of nations, we do not always take kindly to being reminded of what more we can do, or how much better we can be, or who else can be included in the promise of America. We can be slow as well to give greatness its due, a mistake I made myself long ago when I voted against a federal holiday in memory of Dr. King. I was wrong and eventually realized that, in time to give full support for a state holiday in Arizona. We can all be a little late sometimes in doing the right thing, and Dr. King understood this about his fellow Americans. But he knew as well that in the long term, confidence in the reasonability and good heart of America is always well placed. And always, that was his method in word and action -- to remind us of who we are and what we believe. His arguments were unanswerable and they were familiar, the case always resting on the writings of the Founders, the teachings of the prophets, and the Word of the Lord.

Perhaps with more charity than was always deserved, he often reminded us that there was moral badness, and there was moral blindness, and they were not the same. It was this spirit that turned hatred into forgiveness, anger into conviction, and a bitter life into a great one. He loved and honored his country even when the feeling was unreturned, and counseled others to do the same. He gave his fellow countrymen and his fellow Christians the benefit of the doubt -- believing, as he wrote, that "returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that."

I remember first learning what had happened here on the 4th of April, 1968, feeling just as everyone else did back home, only perhaps even more uncertain and alarmed for my country in the darkness that was then enclosed around me and my fellow captives. In our circumstances at the time, good news from America was hard to come by. But the bad news was a different matter, and each new report of violence, rioting, and other tribulations in America was delivered without delay. The enemy had correctly calculated that the news from Memphis would deeply wound morale, and leave us worried and afraid for our country. Doubtless it boosted our captors' morale, confirming their belief that America was a lost cause, and that the future belonged to them.

Yet how differently it all turned out. And if they had been the more reflective kind, our enemies would have understood that the cause of Dr. King was bigger than any one man, and could not be stopped by force of violence. Struggle is rewarded, in God's own time. Wrongs are set right and evil is overcome. We know this to be true because it is the story of the man we honor today, and because it is the story of our country.

And yet for all of this, 40 years and a world away, we look up to that balcony, we remember that night, and we are still left with a feeling of loss. Here was a young man who composed one of literature's finest testimonies to the yearning for equality and justice under law -- writing on the margins of a newspaper, in the confinement of a prison cell. Here was a preacher who endured beatings, survived bombings, suffered knifings, abuse, and ridicule, and still placed his trust in the Prince of Peace. Here was a husband and father who will stand to children in every generation as a model of Christian manhood, but never got to raise his own sons and daughters, or to share in the gift of years with his good wife.

All of this was lost on the 4th of April, 1968, and there are no consolations to balance the scale. What remains, however, is the example and witness of The Reverend Martin Luther King Jr., and that is forever.

Thank you.
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Old 04-04-2008, 04:05 PM   #269
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[q]We can be slow as well to give greatness its due, a mistake I made myself long ago when I voted against a federal holiday in memory of Dr. King. I was wrong and eventually realized that, in time to give full support for a state holiday in Arizona. We can all be a little late sometimes in doing the right thing, and Dr. King understood this about his fellow Americans. [/q]

sounds like a poster in here who uses MLK to justify every thought he has, or who takes MLK's words and think that they're evidence of what "real" Republicans think.

it's good to know that he's no longer overtly racist like he was in the 1980s. but MLK would have understood. it was only effete liberal intellectuals who went to Yale who weren't racist in the 1980s, and no one wants to have a beer with them.
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Old 04-04-2008, 04:11 PM   #270
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Old 04-04-2008, 04:35 PM   #271
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Originally posted by anitram
I've been before, but never in the summer time, which is probably strange. I did love it at Christmas, though. I am mostly glad that they will finance everything so I can enjoy it like the upper tax bracket American that Bush loves. Capitalism, you gotta love it.
A travel guide.

Not really it's dated material, a little raw, but funny.
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