O Canada, We Want to Move to Thee

[U2Traveller]

That's another good point, the US population is much larger and more diverse than Canada's so we have more to deal with. Things that work for Canada might not work here, it would be too big of a task (such as health care, which even the liberal darling Hillary failed to deliver after she had been put in charge under Clinton!)

It's a VERY good point. It makes a HUGE difference. I mean, jee, how many actually LIVE in Canada? I know that small towns in America also have a very high quality of life. Canada is a small town compared to America (if America were a city).

Also, you just really cannot discount the American perspective and attitude. The American ideal. The American way, period. We Americans like to do it alone. We don't like to depend on government. We are always trying to put government in its place. It has its role in our eyes, but we certainly don't like to depend on it, and wouldn't be proud to have to depend on it totally for anything. Americans very much expect and demand to be able to make a life for themselves, and Americans are trying to incorporate healthcare into that philosophy. So we do things differently and we need improvement in the way we are doing things, so what? Does that make you superior? No. Our way is our way, and in the end we may just get all the kinks worked out and no one will even be able to deny that it is the best.

And if we fail, hey, we take it upon ourselves and blame no one else because that's the way Americans are. You, on the other hand, like to blame America for everything AND you like to depend on your government. You look to America for all the worlds problems. Meanwhile Americans are looking to themselves, taking responsibility. Yes, we DO take responsibility. We are doing things OUR way, ourselves and that's just the way we are. It seems to have made us the only superpower with a huge population that has a pretty darn good way of life. And any problems we have are only OUR problems in our minds. If we affect you, well, I feel for you, because I'd really HATE to feel powerless like that.

 

[U2Kitten]

True, we don't depend on gov't, and the more gov't gets involved in people's lives here, the worse things get! What works for Canada would not work here.

 

[U2Traveller]

True, we don't depend on gov't, and the more gov't gets involved in people's lives here, the worse things get! What works for Canada would not work here.

Exactly. It just wouldn't work here. Believe me, people here would rebel if the government presumed to get too involved. We make sure and we really pride ourselves on keeping government in its place. It is a very big issue always. States like to keep the Federal government in its place, too, because in a way each state is a country in itself and they don't like the Federal government to interfere. We're ALL like that. No one's complaining.

We like it that way. We think it's safe. We've seen what too powerful of a government can do and how it CAN lower the quality of one's life. You saw on Tuesday the power of the people. I do believe that even though the election didn't go the way many wanted on Tuesday MOST Americans saw that we still have the power. I know some groups feel even more empowered because of these elections, like conservative religious people.

Same goes with guns. It's our right to own them because if you can't that just puts too much power in governments hands. Americans are quite wary of government.

 

[dandy]

And if we fail, hey, we take it upon ourselves and blame no one else because that's the way Americans are. You, on the other hand, like to blame America for everything AND you like to depend on your government. You look to America for all the worlds problems. Meanwhile Americans are looking to themselves, taking responsibility. Yes, we DO take responsibility. We are doing things OUR way, ourselves and that's just the way we are. It seems to have made us the only superpower with a huge population that has a pretty darn good way of life. And any problems we have are only OUR problems in our minds. If we affect you, well, I feel for you, because I'd really HATE to feel powerless like that.

who are you directing these comments to, exactly?

you say you dislike arrogance and people saying they're the best, yet that's exactly what you're doing.

 

[U2Kitten]

Exactly. It just wouldn't work here. Believe me, people here would rebel if the government presumed to get too involved. We make sure and we really pride ourselves on keeping government in its place. It is a very big issue always. States like to keep the Federal government in its place, too, because in a way each state is a country in itself and they don't like the Federal government to interfere. We're ALL like that. No one's complaining.

We like it that way. We think it's safe. We've seen what too powerful of a government can do and how it CAN lower the quality of one's life. You saw on Tuesday the power of the people. I do believe that even though the election didn't go the way many wanted on Tuesday MOST Americans saw that we still have the power.

Same goes with guns. It's our right to own them because if you can't that just puts too much power in governments hands. Americans are quite wary of government.

Right, the majority of Americans are against too much gov't involvement and especially against socialism. I don' t mean to diss Canada, only to say this is a different country with more people and different people and you can't compare fairly!

Is this right, Canada has only 30 million people?

http://www.canadainfolink.ca/charttwo.htm

We have almost 10 times as many people to deal with! Well, I'll reserve my final count until we see how many people are moving up there

 

[U2Traveller]

who are you directing these comments to, exactly?

you say you dislike arrogance and people saying they're the best, yet that's exactly what you're doing.

How is what I said arrogance. It was just explaining the way Americans think and why we do what we do and why we will NEVER be like you. I am pointing out our differences...period. If you think it sounds arrogant, well, maybe it's just because you're proud.

It looked like a pretty honest and straightforward view of the world to me.

What's wrong with explaining how America thinks and showing that America is not all that bad, and what you think. Hmmm? I know, because it's more fun to look down on us. I know.

 

[U2Traveller]

Right, the majority of Americans are against too much gov't involvement and especially against socialism. I don' t mean to diss Canada, only to say this is a different country with more people and different people and you can't compare fairly!

Is this right, Canada has only 30 million people?

http://www.canadainfolink.ca/charttwo.htm

We have almost 10 times as many people to deal with! Well, I'll reserve my final count until we see how many people are moving up there

Lol. Like I said, maybe we should give them some of our population so that they can start dealing with the challenges a very diverse and large population brings. Oh, and I hope some of those people who move up there keeps the American perspective and desire. That'll really give them fits having to fit them in.

The thing is we DON'T fit in with these countries. There is no room for Americans, the way we think, but in America...and that doesn't mean that they are right, just different. Why can't they accept this? I guess because, hmm, then they'd have to admit that America is something to be admired.

Bono admires America. Do you think he's stupid? If you do stop being a fan.

 

[kobayashi]

yes canada has a little more than 30 million people. the nation is very diverse in its make up, likely just as much as america.
-
it will be different from issue to issue and we cannot make broad generalizations to compare american service delivery with canadians. in some cases, economies of scale will help the americans. in other cases geographically dense areas help canadians. but i can tell you, since i am heavily involved in it, that our nations do study one another a lot and learn a lot.

 

[spinninghead77]

Exactly. It just wouldn't work here. Believe me, people here would rebel if the government presumed to get too involved. We make sure and we really pride ourselves on keeping government in its place. It is a very big issue always. States like to keep the Federal government in its place, too, because in a way each state is a country in itself and they don't like the Federal government to interfere. We're ALL like that. No one's complaining.

The government in the US gets involved quite a bit more in the lives of the people then it does here in Canada, but in very different ways.

Our government gets involved by providing us with health care and protecting us.

Yours gets involved by trying to control who people marry and the reproductive rights of women.

I can't believe that American's are telling Canadians to listen to them. We listen to you much more than you do to us. We pay attention to what is going on in your country. I wouldn't have had to look up the population in your country, I know it. I stayed up late on Tuesday night to see the results in YOUR election. Canadians are very well informed about the US.

 

[dandy]

this thread is going nowhere, fast.

 

[U2Traveller]

yes canada has a little more than 30 million people. the nation is very diverse in its make up, likely just as much as america.
-
it will be different from issue to issue and we cannot make broad generalizations to compare american service delivery with canadians. in some cases, economies of scale will help the americans. in other cases geographically dense areas help canadians. but i can tell you, since i am heavily involved in it, that our nations do study one another a lot and learn a lot.

You mean Canada and the U.S. study each other?

I really don't see why Canadians have to start getting on a high horse. What, are they afraid of what the rest of the world will think?

If Americans did that, America would not be the superpower. No one who is truly successful can live their lives according to what other people think. Look at U2, look at Donald Trump. I just use these two examples because I know a little about them. Believe me, if they listened to what others think they wouldn't be successful.

Sure, you have to have a little bit of people skills, and you have to be responsible when you have power (like America should be) but believe me, they aren't swayed by the negative views of others.

Canadians seem to be big wimps when they start to echo the rest of the world when it comes to their closest neighbor and supposed friends. Yeah, what good friends.

 

[kobayashi]

well it is going in very very tight circles wherein we convince ourselves, damn the numbers, that we are the best

 

[U2Traveller]

The government in the US gets involved quite a bit more in the lives of the people then it does here in Canada, but in very different ways.

Our government gets involved by providing us with health care and protecting us.

Yours gets involved by trying to control who people marry and the reproductive rights of women.

I can't believe that American's are telling Canadians to listen to them. We listen to you much more than you do to us. We pay attention to what is going on in your country. I wouldn't have had to look up the population in your country, I know it. I stayed up late on Tuesday night to see the results in YOUR election. Canadians are very well informed about the US.

Please. It isn't the government. That was people's choice. That's why things are put up for a vote, you know. How is that the government getting involved? No one was held at gunpoint at the voting booths or threatened to vote any certain way.

 

[kobayashi]

You mean Canada and the U.S. study each other?

I really don't see why Canadians have to start getting on a high horse. What, are they afraid of what the rest of the world will think?

If Americans did that, America would not be the superpower. No one who is truly successful can live their lives according to what other people think. Look at U2, look at Donald Trump. I just use these two examples because I know a little about them. Believe me, if they listened to what others think they wouldn't be successful.

Sure, you have to have a little bit of people skills, and you have to be responsible when you have power (like America should be) but believe me, they aren't swayed by the negative views of others.

Canadians seem to be big wimps when they start to echo the rest of the world when it comes to their closest neighbor and supposed friends. Yeah, what good friends.

yes canada and the us study each other. im surprised you dont know that. you get more goods from us than any other nation and we get more goods from you than any other nation. i work in ottawa (the capital, but you probably knew that) and i am going to be in the U.S. embassy for 3 days next week. i am being welcomed-why? because we are bringing about $3m US with us to spend in the states on research.

i think i am done with this thread. U2Traveller, if you have any more wisdom for me, send a PM. or just throw a sheet of paper across the border, theres so few of us here it will find me. the government will deliver it for me as they do everything else

 

[spinninghead77]

Please. It isn't the government. That was people's choice. That's why things are put up for a vote, you know. How is that the government getting involved? No one was held at gunpoint at the voting booths or threatened to vote any certain way.

You are right.

Maybe I just prefer the way that we do it here. The government allows everyone to have the freedom to choose. If you don't like gay marriage then don't be involved in a gay marriage. If you don't support abortion then don't have an abortion.

I like it the way Canada does it. You like it the way the US does it. I guess that is why we both choose to live in, and believe in our countries.

 

[U2Traveller]

Yes, this thread is going nowhere fast and I'm sick of it.

Bottom-line, you just need to change your perspective, I think. But, will people? Most likely not. And most Americans don't let others control them.

I hope for good things for America. We will have a hard time. We have trouble coming. Everyone does. I fear slightly for America, but that's a good thing to be wary, and it shows I love it. I fear because well, I know that the future won't be good for any country, let alone America. But, I also believe in the American people, and I believe in God, and I know what I know, and I think there's still a lot of good this country can, should, and will do.

I abhor people who eagerly look forward to our demise, and I'll tell you this, it won't happen. Not with people like Americans living in America. We never give up. If some do, oh well.

I think the biggest problem for America, the biggest threat, has been and always will be its citizens, whether or not we can continue to work together and stay together.

Yes, the constitution may hang by a thread by the end, but that doesn't mean it will fall.

Unlike many people I am not afraid for the future. I look forward to it, and the challenges it will bring, the heartache, the opportunity to grow and become stronger. I look forward to God's working going forward. I look forward to thing going forward according to God's design and in seeing how things are all working out and how God truly IS in control.

I look forward to the future with anticipation and excitement, just like I did these elections. Someone with the faith I have only sees the future as something I already knew and was promised, and something to no fear because it's the way it's supposed to be, and God is in charge.

America is the place to be in the end in a lot of ways. America is truly the light and the vehicle. America is the HOME, the base for God's work.

 

[U2Traveller]

yes canada and the us study each other. im surprised you dont know that. you get more goods from us than any other nation and we get more goods from you than any other nation. i work in ottawa (the capital, but you probably knew that) and i am going to be in the U.S. embassy for 3 days next week. i am being welcomed-why? because we are bringing about $3m US with us to spend in the states on research.

i think i am done with this thread. U2Traveller, if you have any more wisdom for me, send a PM. or just throw a sheet of paper across the border, theres so few of us here it will find me. the government will deliver it for me as they do everything else

I do know that. I just wanted to make sure that was what you were saying. Yes, we are the closest trading partners. I use to not have a problem with that.

P.S. I almost made it to Canada this summer. We were so close yet so far away. We were in Glacier National Park, and we didn't have the documents to get across. So sad that that has to be the case now. We were thinking about going to Waterton, that's why.

 

[U2Traveller]

You are right.

Maybe I just prefer the way that we do it here. The government allows everyone to have the freedom to choose. If you don't like gay marriage then don't be involved in a gay marriage. If you don't support abortion then don't have an abortion.

I like it the way Canada does it. You like it the way the US does it. I guess that is why we both choose to live in, and believe in our countries.

Our government allows us to have the freedom to choose, too. People chose to vote the way they did. If you blame anyone blame the people who voted for it. They certainly had the freedom to do so. THEY make the government, they make the choices. So, don't blame the government. You're not going far enough. No one forced me to vote for Kerry, either. I admit, I tried to pressure my family to also vote for Kerry, but people are stubborn.

As for these amendments, I am highly uncomfortable with them and frankly disappointed with people in Utah for passing it. They didn't have to. The government didn't make them. How can you blame the government that it passed? It was the people, even, who got it on the ballot in the first place.

 

[dandy]

Yes, this thread is going nowhere fast and I'm sick of it.

Bottom-line, you just need to change your perspective.

no, not arrogant at all.

you're arguing against no one, u2traveller. no one in this thread has said anything negative about the US, although it seems you wish someone would. i have no problems with your enthusiasm for your country, but i think that patriotism should be about why you love your country, and not why your country is better than anyone else's.

 

[U2Traveller]

no, not arrogant at all.

you're arguing against no one, u2traveller. no one in this thread has said anything negative about the US, although it seems you wish someone would. i have no problems with your enthusiasm for your country, but i think that patriotism should be about why you love your country, and not why your country is better than anyone else's.

I don't necessarily think the U.S. is better than anywhere else. After all, that God-like study says it ain't so.

 

[meegannie]

Someone even SAID that Canadians get better service in foreign countries than U.S. citizens do, lol.

I don't think it's right at all, but it's certainly true.

Originally posted by spinninghead77I like it the way Canada does it. You like it the way the US does it. I guess that is why we both choose to live in, and believe in our countries.

Every countries has its positives and its negatives.

 

[U2Traveller]

I don't think it's right at all, but it's certainly true.





Every countries has its positives and its negatives.

If it's true I can only hope that Americans will wise up, realize they're being discriminated against, and well, reduce their tourist industry. I know I certainly would. BUT, I'm inclined to doubt it's true. Maybe for some, but not for all. You are putting all non-Americans in the same category, too, then.

I tend to believe that some non-Americans DON'T act like that, and I think Americans can tell the difference. I've just never been in Europe. If someone was rude to me, believe me, I'd leave, and I wouldn't tip, lol. And I'd never come back, and I'd tell everybody else not to, too, so you know, it might hurt their business a little.

If they want to be arrogant and bigoted then they can suffer the consequences because unlike other oppressed people, Americans aren't weak and without resources.

 

[meegannie]

I tend to believe that some non-Americans DON'T act like that, and I think Americans can tell the difference. I've just never been in Europe. If someone was rude to me, believe me, I'd leave, and I wouldn't tip, lol. And I'd never come back, and I'd tell everybody else not to, too, so you know, it might hurt their business a little.

Of course ALL non-Americans aren' t like that. I think it's narrow-minded and misguided, but the fact is that Americans aren't very well-regarded abroad.

 

[U2Traveller]

Of course ALL non-Americans aren' t like that. I think it's narrow-minded and misguided, but the fact is that Americans aren't very well-regarded abroad.

I don't know that that's a fact at all. Maybe by some, but not by all.

If they are, by whoever they are, do you think that this will in any way benefit them? No, in the end they'll just be bitter and disappointed, and targets to terrorists just like everybody else.

 

[spinninghead77]

Our government allows us to have the freedom to choose, too. People chose to vote the way they did. If you blame anyone blame the people who voted for it. They certainly had the freedom to do so. THEY make the government, they make the choices. So, don't blame the government. You're not going far enough. No one forced me to vote for Kerry, either. I admit, I tried to pressure my family to also vote for Kerry, but people are stubborn.

As for these amendments, I am highly uncomfortable with them and frankly disappointed with people in Utah for passing it. They didn't have to. The government didn't make them. How can you blame the government that it passed? It was the people, even, who got it on the ballot in the first place.

Listen. I wasn't putting down the US or blaming anyone. My earlier message actually said "You're right". I just think that I prefer the government doing away with things like bans on gay marriage then letting the people vote. When people vote on something like that then 51% of people get to decide how 100% of people will act, and I don't like that. Here, the government saw that people wanted gay marriage and gave it to them. Not everyone wanted it, but it only affects the people that do want it.

 

[GibsonGirl]

Wow. That MUST mean it's true. *sarcasm* Nope, I just don't think they're looking at all the facts. I know they're not.

I wasn't even going to respond to this... I was just going to walk away and try not to give it another thought.

But then I thought, WHAT THE HELL? This is the United Nations Human Development report we're talking about! The UN does not just slap together a report without "looking at all the facts"! Don't be absurd! A lot of economics and statistics goes into analyzing this sort of thing. I think you need to seriously review what quality of life is officially defined as, because I honestly don't think you know what it means.

Standard of living is NOT limited to one place, such as Utah. It is based upon the country AS A WHOLE. So while things may be peachy clean where you live, things might be worse off in other places. Just like in Canada, Newfoundland is economically worse off in comparison to a province like Ontario. Yet, AS A WHOLE, the standard of living in Canada is better than the standard of living in the United States, AS A WHOLE.

Oh, and trust me, this isn't just "one study." Canada's quality of life was rated number one for seven consecutive years just a few years ago. It has slipped a little since then, but it has still been hovering around the four-five range, and has still been consistently higher than the US.

So please, don't utterly dismiss these studies and quotes we keep on giving you, because they aren't a complete load of nonsense. And no one's trying to tell you that the quality of life in America is bad. We're just saying that it's a little better in Canada.

 

[Souly]

I don't think it's right at all, but it's certainly true.

I agree. Canadians are nice people

 

[GibsonGirl]

I agree. Canadians are nice people

When we don't get worked up.

FYM brings out the worst in me.

 

[U2Traveller]

I wasn't even going to respond to this... I was just going to walk away and try not to give it another thought.

But then I thought, WHAT THE HELL? This is the United Nations Human Development report we're talking about! The UN does not just slap together a report without "looking at all the facts"! Don't be absurd! A lot of economics and statistics goes into analyzing this sort of thing. I think you need to seriously review what quality of life is officially defined as, because I honestly don't think you know what it means.

Standard of living is NOT limited to one place, such as Utah. It is based upon the country AS A WHOLE. So while things may be peachy clean where you live, things might be worse off in other places. Just like in Canada, Newfoundland is economically worse off in comparison to a province like Ontario. Yet, AS A WHOLE, the standard of living in Canada is better than the standard of living in the United States, AS A WHOLE.

Oh, and trust me, this isn't just "one study." Canada's quality of life was rated number one for seven consecutive years just a few years ago. It has slipped a little since then, but it has still been hovering around the four-five range, and has still been consistently higher than the US.

So please, don't utterly dismiss these studies and quotes we keep on giving you, because they aren't a complete load of nonsense. And no one's trying to tell you that the quality of life in America is bad. We're just saying that it's a little better in Canada.

Sorry. I don't agree. No study or no one saying it's so makes me go, okay, then it's so. I observe with my own eyes and senses, thank you.

As for the government should "give" things to the people view...well, Americans prefer to tell the government what to do.

 

[U2Traveller]

Americans are also nice people.