McCain speaks out against attack ads

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Diemen said:


That link is downright scary.


Yes it is.



And people complain about Moore being biased. :eek:

And Moore is not biased, he lies and tells half truths.

Somehow, I fail to understand how people who have a problem with Moore would not have a problem with this person as well.
 
They really will give anyone a book contract these days, as long as it looks like the publisher can make a fast buck. It's a damn shame.
 
Dreadsox said:


Yes it is.





And Moore is not biased, he lies and tells half truths.

Somehow, I fail to understand how people who have a problem with Moore would not have a problem with this person as well.

I think I may have worded my post wrong - we're basically in complete agreement here. :) People who despise Moore for his tactics should be just as outraged if not more so at this wacko.
 
Diemen said:


I think I may have worded my post wrong - we're basically in complete agreement here. :) People who despise Moore for his tactics should be just as outraged if not more so at this wacko.

I was thinking the same exact thing. Would you trust a guy who makes insulting remarks about the Pope? I think the remark about the Pope being "senile", as well as the impending demise of the Catholic Church, is way out of line. :mad: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: OK, Moore is biased. He definitely has an agenda. So does this guy.
 
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Dreadsox said:
And Moore is not biased, he lies and tells half truths.

:eyebrow:

Moore is NOT biased? :hmm:

Don't they ALL tell lies and half truths? (All meaning these politically slanted media types like Moore, Limbaugh, Hannity, etc. etc.)
 
Christmas in Cambodia

As Kerry's war record gets further scrutiny, it seems that he has embelished, or fabricated, some stories through the years. The latest is Kerry's "Christmas in Cambodia" story. He made several claims on the Senate floor which lack supporting evidence and are being refuted by more than just the Swift Boat crews.....

"I remember spending Christmas Eve of 1968 five miles across the Cambodian border being shot at by our South Vietnamese allies who were drunk and celebrating Christmas. The absurdity of almost being killed by our own allies in a country in which President Nixon claimed there were no American troops was very real."

Note: Nixon was not president in December 1968.

Also:

All the living commanders in Kerry?s chain of command?Joe Streuhli (Commander of CosDiv 13), George Elliott (Commander of CosDiv 11), Adrian Lonsdale (Captain, USCG and Commander, Coastal Surveillance Center at An Thoi), Rear Admiral Roy Hoffmann (Commander, Coastal Surveillance Force Vietnam, CTF 115), and Rear Admiral Art Price (Commander of River Patrol Force, CTF 116)?deny that Kerry was ever ordered to Cambodia...
 
Quite possibly he meant "President-elect Nixon", which is what he was. I'll investigate this other stuff. We historians like to compare ourselves to detectives.:wink:
 
If Kerry signed a Navy Standard Form 180, both sides of this issue would know what really happened. I for one would be interested to read the truth. What does Kerry have to hide?
 
It interesting that the man is clinging to his 4 1/2 months in Vietnam as credentials to be president rather than his anti-war actions or the 20 years in public office.
 
A_Wanderer said:
It interesting that the man is clinging to his 4 1/2 months in Vietnam as credentials to be president rather than his anti-war actions or the 20 years in public office.

So now the pro-Bush team wants to look at people's previous records? Please if that was the case Bush would have never even gotten the nod for Republican canidate yet alone presidency. Look at how he left Texas and every other business venture he made...and his military record not even worth mentioning.
 
I'll just say that Jerome Corsi's anti-Catholic sentiments are terribly upsetting to me. The guy strikes me as a real hate-mongerer. This is not in any way meant to say that Kerry doesn't deserve criticism. Far from it. This feeling has nothing to do with John Kerry. He calls the Pope "senile" and implies that the demise of Catholilcism is right around the corner, as we saw in that link. It's the Catholic in me as I am in fact an independent rather than a Democrat. I would like another salesman. I wonder if he hates us so much, who else does he hate irrationally?:mad: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored:
 
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I think its unwise to simply use one experience as the reason that you should be president. If that cornerstone for your bid on the presidency is undermined then you are up a particular creek without a certain instrument.

Bush's record in both business and the air national guard has been called into question plenty of times, Farenheit 9/11 levels really big charges to show how inept Bush is and that got a nationwide release, and the outcry over his millitary record too. Politics is a dirty game and each side will do everything to bring down the other down - I just hope that some of this mud slinging reflects badly on the perpetrator rather than the victim.
 
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I absolutely agree. For some reason this one just strikes me as one of the more hypocritical attacks and it almost makes me laugh.
 
I agree, A_Wanderer. I despise mud-slinging. I hated the whole campaign of 1988, quite frankly, because it was too damned muddy, the whole thing. It was politics at its worst. And politics at its best is, I will agree, really dirty stuff and both sides will play the game until the electorate is burned out to a crisp.
 
Kerry has made his Vietnam experience the cornerstone of his presidential bid. It does not look that the image he has created will stand reasonable scrutiny.
 
nbcrusader said:
Kerry has made his Vietnam experience the cornerstone of his presidential bid. It does not look that the image he has created will stand reasonable scrutiny.

Perhaps not, but I'd like another source. O'Neill has had an axe to grind against John Kerry since 1971, and Corsi is a nutjob. One of the "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth" pulled a flip-flop over signing an affadavit for the article in the Boston Globe. I'm suspicious of the credibility of these particular guys. How do we know they're not just a couple of hate-mongerers, or guys with grudges or jealousy? Or out to make a quick buck while they're at it? Muslim voters are absolutely up in arms over Corsi's anti-Islamic statements. I saw a series of anti-Islamic statements from him over the years, and they're damning. I can also do without his insulting the Pope, thank you very much. He thinks priests are a bunch of pedophiles. While I do not wish to condone or whitewash the sex scandals, which are a disgrace and a crime, this is terribly unfair to the 90+% of priests who do their jobs and keep their promises. I say he's got issues. :mad: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored:
 
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Now that Muqtada al-Sadr is surrounded in Iraq, reports are that he has shrapnel in his leg....

Just wondering if he is going to apply for the Purple Heart
 
:tsk:

Now you're insulting the entire military? It's not like they just give out purple hearts like they're candy. You're calling into question the validity of anyone who has ever received one.

Are you going to make fun of Max Cleland now? Seriously ...
 
verte76 said:


Or out to make a quick buck while they're at it?

That is what I suspect more than anything. I'm now so pleased I didn't get into the publishing industry. They really will print anything as long as they think there's money to be had.

Really, do people honestly think Kerry made this shit up?
 
ThatGuy said:
:tsk:

Now you're insulting the entire military? It's not like they just give out purple hearts like they're candy. You're calling into question the validity of anyone who has ever received one.

Are you going to make fun of Max Cleland now? Seriously ...

Actually, I am just pointing out in a facetious way how John Kerry got 3 Purple Hearts. It's a joke, lighten up. In no way am I trying to disrespect the Purple Heart. I know the sacrifices all our military have made for my freedown and am 100% thankful for that. Including those that received them legitimately.

Before all this Kerry talk, I actually thought the Purple Heart was something you received for a heroic achievment. It forced me to research it a little more.

Thank you, John Kerry.
 
swizzlestick said:


In no way am I trying to disrespect the Purple Heart.

...

Before all this Kerry talk, I actually thought the Purple Heart was something you received for a heroic achievment.

:confused: Those seem to be contradictory statements.

Hey, you know what would be really funny? Going down to one of those veterans' parades and knocking the ribbons (that they probably didn't earn, and would mean nothing even if they did) off of those old guys' hats. Hilarious!
 
I have not heard very much legitimate criticism on the swiftboat vets, its usually just right-wing nutjob attacks followed by them being part of a Vast Right Wing Conspiracy. Can somebody please explain to me why its wrong to criticize Kerry for claiming to have been in Cambodia during Christmas 1968 when a substantial ammount of evidence points to the contrary?

I dont understand how some (this is Daily Kos and DU thankfully not here) turn it around and start questioning their service, its almost as if its the same hatred they had for the troops during the war is still there only Kerry gets a pass because although he was for the war it was before he was against it.

I think that questioning the mans service is wrong, but considering how much emphasis he has put on it for his campaign holding what he has said in regards to events to scrutiny as well as his actions in the anti-war movement are fair game.
 
A_Wanderer said:
I have not heard very much legitimate criticism on the swiftboat vets, its usually just right-wing nutjob attacks followed by them being part of a Vast Right Wing Conspiracy. Can somebody please explain to me why its wrong to criticize Kerry for claiming to have been in Cambodia during Christmas 1968 when a substantial ammount of evidence points to the contrary?

I dont understand how some (this is Daily Kos and DU thankfully not here) turn it around and start questioning their service, its almost as if its the same hatred they had for the troops during the war is still there only Kerry gets a pass because although he was for the war it was before he was against it.

I think that questioning the mans service is wrong, but considering how much emphasis he has put on it for his campaign holding what he has said in regards to events to scrutiny as well as his actions in the anti-war movement are fair game.

My feelings exactly.

ThatGuy. Again I am not knocking the Purple Heart. John Kerry should be commended for going to Vietnam. Something Bush did not do. Something Clinton did not do. Something my dad or a lot of Americans didn't do. But that isn't to say because you didn't go to Vietnam was a bad thing. It was a horrible conflict. My dad was in the Navy and was stationed in the Mediterranean Sea for 12 months and never got called. Would that be considered heroic? In my eyes yes.

No matter what you think of the Swiftboat Vets for Truth, they still were the people that served with Kerry. Over 250 of them have now spoken out against his service. They are saying he is lying about what really happened. This is 250 men! And yes, men that served 5 feet from him. Even if he was my candidate, I would believe them. Why won't Kerry sign a standard Form 180 to release all his records? What is he hiding? This whole debate can be put to rest if he would do that. Bush has realeased his records on the National Guard.

Kerry's Vietnam service is open for debate since he has made it the main issue of his campaign. I don't feel it should be an issue, personally. Even though Kerry did serve only 4 months compared to the standard 12, he still is a hero for serving his country and going to war.

I just find it ironic that the Democrats during the Vietnam war were the ones who were the most outspoken against it, and now they are the ones who are praising it.
 
A_Wanderer said:
Can somebody please explain to me why its wrong to criticize Kerry for claiming to have been in Cambodia during Christmas 1968 when a substantial ammount of evidence points to the contrary?

A_W,

Kerry has now said it was January, not Christmas. They are making the addendum to his autobiography now.
 
Well, it would help if O'Neil weren't claiming that those wounds were self-inflicted. I have seen the citations for the medals on the Internet. They are signed by military top brass, including the Secretary of the Navy. The Swift Boat guys have the doctor who treated him wrong, it was another doctor. There seem to be holes in their narrative. It's like Soren Kierkegaard's "leap of faith", something you either believe or don't believe mainly based on your opinion of John Kerry.
 
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