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Old 07-02-2010, 01:10 AM   #801
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That is just flat out wrong.

A family member of mine (mother of a cousin by marriage) recently discovered she had cancer upon returning from a vacation and was immediately admitted to the hospital. After all the tests had been administered to determine exactly what she had, it was found that the cancer was at an advanced stage and immediately began treatment. It's too early to tell, but it seems like she'll be okay.

And last year I attended a friend's BBQ where I started talking sports with someone. He told me he no longer plays any competitive sports because he had surgery. Then he told me the story: In February of last year he started getting headaches. Then he collapsed a short time later and was rushed to the hospital.

That is not the norm. depends were you live.

There are problem with EVERY system, no question. I have said it many times. what is coming is a problem. You will never pay zero, and you will pay for visits. It will increase as demand and cost rise. Even the Presidents Budget director said so yesterday I think. Your going to pay so the free stuff isn't eeven in the equation. Read the bill. you will pay

Tests determined that he had a brain tumour. Within days he was operated on and the tumour removed. He now has regular checkups, and he can't do anything that involves physical contact that might result in a head injury. But he said he's never felt better in his life and is functioning like he did before.

In both cases they paid a grand total of $0. And they will always pay that amount and not have to worry about being dropped because of pre-existing conditions.

I cannot stress this enough: are there issues with our health care? There most certainly are, but I dare anyone to find a country that has a perfect system. There are none.

BUT with that said, I would much rather have our system, warts and all, than the one south of the border.
That is not the norm. depends were you live. I could tell you 10 stories of horror for every one like you friend

Mark Cussy, 24 year old fun a lump in his testi. He waited and waited for the speacilist. Rule with TC is it is out in 24 hours. 100% Curable.

By the time we convinced him to get to the states instead of waiting, it was too late. so there is another view. 100 curable, and he was dead waiting for the specialist.

There are problem with EVERY system, no question. I have said it many times. what is coming is a problem. You will never pay zero, and you will pay for visits. It will increase as demand and cost rise. Even the Presidents Budget director said so yesterday I think. Your going to pay so the free stuff isn't even in the equation. Read the bill. you will pay .

It is not free.
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Old 07-02-2010, 01:32 AM   #802
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in a word, fraud and waste . again more accountants in the healthcare system here than Nurses.

Anyone seee the waste of the H1N1 vaccines .. the ones we were told that we were going to die if you didnt get one? BS

Very few people got it . The CDC was combining the number of seasonal flu with H1NI. so the numbers were totally false. I am not sure how many, but we saw very few.. very few. we didn't tak the shots either.

Follow the money of that contract. you would be surprised
Can you please elaborate about this. I can't tell if you think the vaccine is fake, the number of H1N1 infections is fabricated, or the possibility of a pandemic a fraud.
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Old 07-02-2010, 01:34 AM   #803
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Rule with TC is it is out in 24 hours. 100% Curable.
How many medical professionals say any cancer is 100% curable?
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Old 07-02-2010, 01:59 AM   #804
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That is not the norm. depends were you live. I could tell you 10 stories of horror for every one like you friend

Mark Cussy, 24 year old fun a lump in his testi. He waited and waited for the speacilist. Rule with TC is it is out in 24 hours. 100% Curable.

By the time we convinced him to get to the states instead of waiting, it was too late. so there is another view. 100 curable, and he was dead waiting for the specialist.
This, combined with your previous "the only reason for emergency back surgery is loss of bowel control" is causing my BS alarm to go into Defcon 5 mode. Testicular cancer definitely has a high rate of curability, but it is not 100%.

Exactly what kind of medically related profession are you in?
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Old 07-02-2010, 02:07 AM   #805
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I could show you other lists, and it would depend on who's list it is, where countries are .

The other problem with these is the fact that we have more People than the Uk, or Denmark . So to base it on $$ per person doesn't really relate.
One would think an economy of scale could apply. Why would it cost more per capita to treat people in a larger system?
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Primary care is a HUGE part of the problem.It IS the problem for most people I have acknowledged that from the begining. The BIGGEST problem is dealing with Medicare and Medicaid, and the insurance companies is getting approval for procedures. It is no easier from the Government, than it is from Insurance companies.
The government isn't trying to turn a profit by denying coverage to sick people. How can you reasonably say that it's harder to get the state to subsidise procedures and medications than a for-profit insurance company?
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Their is a problem when a hospital or Drs office has more accountants than Nurses.

I have 5 people for every 50 patients who do nothing but deal with medicare and insurance Cpomapanies. It is a huge part of the cost.
Could it relate to having a system beholden to corporate interests? Perhaps a radical overhaul could produce a better system.
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Adding a HUGE new, multi layer Government "agency" is going to fix that? NO . They cant even run the VA.

The other problem is Medicare fraud is HUGE as it is now .
Adding another layer of bureaucracy wouldn't solve anything. But streamlining a system which guarantees universal healthcare in some form seems better.


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The republican running for FL Gov used to own HCA , and under his watch, his company stole 2.7 BIllion dollars from Medicare. Biggest fraud ( that they caught) in history.
I don't understand how this links into having a public system. Is this meant to be an argument for or against private hospitals?

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So yes, there is a primary care issue, but it it easily solved. Look at what Kentucky does. a Dr visit will cost you 5.00 bucks. Tests are included. You see the same Dr etc etc
You repeat that there are costs to healthcare in socialised systems but present this. I don't think this is a free-market solution. If individuals are only paying $5 per visit the costs must be made up elsewhere, and you haven't demonstrated how this example is an easy solution to primary care issues.
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Look at the Clevland Clinic. Once again a working examle of how to fix that problem. Easily. You don't destroy the Heart depatment at a place like the Cleveland Clinic to get people accesses to a Prmary Care Dr .
Who is advocating the destruction of specialist centers?
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Leaders of UK, Saudi's , Canada , you name it, go to the Cleveland Clinic for hearts or Sloan in New York for cancer. Why? Why don't they go to their own hospitials?
Private hospitals can cater very well for those who can pay, but not everybody can. A system which offers reasonable quality of care to everybody does more good than one which gives extraordinary care to the minority.
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If you are in an accident, we have the best trauma centers in the world. we are top of that list as we are in heart, cancer, and every other speciality. You want those trauma centers to be your GP ?
Which posters have proposed the elimination of specialists?
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If you have a business, and part of it is very good, and part is not working, you tear down the whole business to fix the part that is not working? No, that would be insane.
I don't know anything about the American system. But if there are problems which can't be avoided with the current setup isn't serious change worthwhile? (and I'm not making a judgement of the Obama reforms).
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There are many, many good working examples of how to fix the problems. Bush didnt deal with it, and this guy has a whole different idea of what it all means, and it is not about medical care.
Is it about socialism?
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The best way to look at is that yes, many countries have much better access to GP's, but their speciality and ability to move from GP to a cancer Dr or diagnosis SUCKS . That's why they all come here.
I have relatives who haven't died in public healthcare, and I doubt they would have done as well in the US given their financial state.
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so, it is lest costly, way less, to fix the GP problem, which is getting much worse by the day. We are running out of GP's.
You haven't offered any solutions to that issue.
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This will never fly, so really, it is a moot point. We are too culturally different than UK or Denmark . people scream at McDonalds when their 1.00 hamburger takes 3 minutes they will howl when they can't get a Mamogram or other speciality care.
McDonalds produces fast burgers because it makes money. Should profit be the driving force of medicine?
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In Canada it takes 9 to 18 months to get a specialty surgery. Most people would die of cancer in that period. That's why they come here.
More anecdotes please - they're nearly as good as evidence.
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again, I believe this is a moot point. I do agree that we have a GP problem. this already has made it worse.

This bill isn't about healthcare. I don't believe it will pass the Courts.
Why not?
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Old 07-02-2010, 06:20 AM   #806
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Follow the money of that contract. you would be surprised
To the Club of Rome?
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Old 07-02-2010, 06:26 AM   #807
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Mark Cussy, 24 year old fun a lump in his testi. He waited and waited for the speacilist. Rule with TC is it is out in 24 hours. 100% Curable.

By the time we convinced him to get to the states instead of waiting, it was too late. so there is another view. 100 curable, and he was dead waiting for the specialist.
Another flat out lie!

First of all, 24 hours? 100% curable? Complete BULLSHIT!

Secondly, just last week you were saying you lived in Florida, now you're living in Canada?
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Old 07-02-2010, 09:54 AM   #808
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That is not the norm. depends were you live. I could tell you 10 stories of horror for every one like you friend

Mark Cussy, 24 year old fun a lump in his testi. He waited and waited for the speacilist. Rule with TC is it is out in 24 hours. 100% Curable.

By the time we convinced him to get to the states instead of waiting, it was too late. so there is another view. 100 curable, and he was dead waiting for the specialist.

There are problem with EVERY system, no question. I have said it many times. what is coming is a problem. You will never pay zero, and you will pay for visits. It will increase as demand and cost rise. Even the Presidents Budget director said so yesterday I think. Your going to pay so the free stuff isn't even in the equation. Read the bill. you will pay .

It is not free.

While I agree with Diemen about my BS alarm going off the charts, I have to ask: Where do you live? In the United States or in Canada?

Also, if I ever meet someone like you who claims to be in the medical field and discover that he/she is unable to put together a comprehensible sentence with proper grammar and spelling, then I'd probably look for someone else to treat me.
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Old 07-03-2010, 02:54 PM   #809
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Can you please elaborate about this. I can't tell if you think the vaccine is fake, the number of H1N1 infections is fabricated, or the possibility of a pandemic a fraud.
The numbers were combined with seasonal flu by the CDC. As i am sure you know, many people die by seasonal flu alone. Elderly, or people with supressed immune system.

Average 400K- 600 K per year in the states. Seasonal flu killed a zillion times more than H1N1 , and even then, it could have been season flu.

I am trying to find the orignal CDC site where they reported people with N1H1 , as even at the bottom of the page it would say " These numbers are combined totals of N1H1 cases and deaths with seasonal flu . Yes, some people died, but the total number was approx , in there own words 8,000-18.000 That doesnt even come close to seasonal flu. . It is reasonable that 8-18 K people in the USA have some respitory problems , which means that seasonal flu could kill them as much as anything. The confirmed Number, was around 6,000, and now on the site, they blame the low numbers to " undereporting, which is total bogus. " we at first were on high alert, , and we swabbed and tested ANYONE who came in with flu like symptons. We were required to report them.

I will find the orginal page if it is still up ( we watched it every day ) . I have a copy in an e-mail somewhere.

*80 million did not have H1N1 . it was between 8-16 thousand.

I know 10 people in my hospital ( we have a staff of over 4,000) who took the shot. When we refused, they threatend us with suspension. we said "good" we will go to the beach. hey backed off quickly

These numbers are bogus.


Updated Estimates from April 2009 – March 13, 2010


Using the same methodology CDC has again updated the estimates to include the time period from April 2009 through March 13, 2010 on April 19, 2010.
  • CDC estimates that between 43 million and 88 million cases of 2009 H1N1 occurred between April 2009 and March 13, 2010. The mid-level in this range is about 60 million people infected with 2009 H1N1. BS !!!
  • CDC estimates that between about 192,000 and 398,000 H1N1-related hospitalizations occurred between April 2009 and March 13, 2010. The mid-level in this range is about 270,000 2009 H1N1-related hospitalizations.
  • CDC estimates that between about 8,720 and 18,050 2009 H1N1-related deaths occurred between April 2009 and March 13, 2010. The mid-level in this range is about 12,270 2009 H1N1-related deaths.
End of Season Estimates from April 2009 – April 10, 2010


Using the same methodology CDC again updated the estimates to include the time period from April 2009 through April 10, 2010 on May 14, 2010. Although sporadic cases of influenza are expected to occur during the summer months, no additional updated estimates using this method are planned since influenza activity is now at a low level in the United States and few hospitalizations and deaths are expected over the summer.

  • CDC estimates that between about 195,000 and 403,000 H1N1-related hospitalizations occurred between April 2009 and April 10, 2010. The mid-level in this range is about 274,000 2009 H1N1-related hospitalizations.
  • CDC estimates that between about 8,870 and 18,300 2009 H1N1-related deaths occurred between April 2009 and April 10, 2010. The mid-level in this range is about 12,470 2009 H1N1-related deaths. Still BS but more a little more realistic.
Remember if you didnt get the shot, you would die. BS Follow the money on the Vaccine. they just burned 70 million doses.

At those numbers, everyone here would have known someone who died.


I will check my e-mail, for the site when I sent it to someone back then, and the flat out said, in writing, they were combining seasonal and H1N1 , in cases, hospitalizations and deaths.
  • Note: Less than 5% of increases in the estimates from one reporting date to the next are the result of delayed reporting in cases, hospitalizations and deaths.
I got the flu, was tested and it was not H1N1. I work in a public trauma center in a major city.. Not one single person in the ER, had the shot, not one had H1N1 .
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Old 07-03-2010, 03:39 PM   #810
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This, combined with your previous "the only reason for emergency back surgery is loss of bowel control" is causing my BS alarm to go into Defcon 5 mode. Testicular cancer definitely has a high rate of curability, but it is not 100%.

Exactly what kind of medically related profession are you in?
Tc 35 years ago was just about 100% death sentence . Today , it is 100% curable if caught before stage 3-4 , and many of those survive. In MOST cases. Nothing is 100 %,, but the Drs will tell you that and you will if the treament protocol is followed, meaning checking yourself, and seeking an ultrasound , and if a mass is detected, it is assumed to be TC , and the protocol is to remove the testi within 24 hours. If there is no Vascular Invasion, the next course if often surveilance for 2 years consisting of marker tests, quarterly ct's scans it;s path is Testi, Lymph Retropenial lymph nodes, lungs, brain.

It is usually a combination germ cell and non germ cell. Chorio carcinoma is the most agressive, and it is extremely agressive ( It is what Lance Armstrong had ) who had a "buddy the size of a grapefut which he ignored until he was coughing up blood

Embryonal carcinoma is next, and is also very aggressive. Non Seminoma is much slower. TC is sually some combination of these different type

CC, EC and seminoma is treat with Chemo if it has progressed. The outcome, provided someone didnt hide it for a year is 100% cure rate.

Seminoma is slower in growth and reated with radiation, most of the time. Teratoma is another type, which sn'y actually ccancer, but can turn into it. It is surgically removed.

3 types of cancer , for the most part, respond to chemotherapy as a complete cure . There are exceptions, but not many .

TC, Childhood Lukemia , and Hodgekins diesease.

Dr Larry Einhorn, discovered a combination of chemo's bleomycin, etoposide, and cisplatin. Cisplatin was the magic ingredient, and was discovered to work by Dr Einhorn . Nobody know why this works, but this combination is one of the most studied things in medicine. If Dr Einhorn knew why it worked, he would have won the Nobel prize. Almost all chemo regimes, come from the addition of cisplatin

Lances was in his brain. He ignored it for a long time. His chance of survival was approx 20 % .

All kinds of work is going on for cancers, and they get further every year , but there is a long way to go. Gleevec for instance, is a genetic "switch" that can turn on and off a gene by pill, and many people with CML , and GIST have been saved by this. Cancer will never be "cured" except in those 3 mentioned about, for everyone, but more and more cancers are responding to the drugs that came from Dr Einhorns work. His and many others.

Everyone outside of those 3 types, reacts differently. Many women beat breast cancer or people with colon cancer. Getting there with lung cancer, and others.

But yes, early treatment for TC is approx 99-100 %
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Old 07-03-2010, 03:48 PM   #811
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That is just flat out wrong.

A family member of mine (mother of a cousin by marriage) recently discovered she had cancer upon returning from a vacation and was immediately admitted to the hospital. After all the tests had been administered to determine exactly what she had, it was found that the cancer was at an advanced stage and immediately began treatment. It's too early to tell, but it seems like she'll be okay.

And last year I attended a friend's BBQ where I started talking sports with someone. He told me he no longer plays any competitive sports because he had surgery. Then he told me the story: In February of last year he started getting headaches. Then he collapsed a short time later and was rushed to the hospital.

Tests determined that he had a brain tumour. Within days he was operated on and the tumour removed. He now has regular checkups, and he can't do anything that involves physical contact that might result in a head injury. But he said he's never felt better in his life and is functioning like he did before.

In both cases they paid a grand total of $0. And they will always pay that amount and not have to worry about being dropped because of pre-existing conditions.

I cannot stress this enough: are there issues with our health care? There most certainly are, but I dare anyone to find a country that has a perfect system. There are none.

BUT with that said, I would much rather have our system, warts and all, than the one south of the border.
I have some friends at Princess Margaret. Great Hospital . I have spent time there. There are still alot of issue. Again, why is everyone paying for CT-scans at private facilities? Why do they come over the border for treatment Mayo, many people from Canada go . They cater to them.

no, nothing is perfect. but I find it strange that many Canadien officials come to the States for heart and Cancer treatment... why ? Didn't you guys have a big time Politician come to the states for cancer, or heart treatment? I read that somewhere not long ago, and the paper was blasting him.

He said, the treatment he needed he couldnt get there. I believe he came to miami didnt he?
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Old 07-03-2010, 03:54 PM   #812
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The moral of the story is the Government cannot do it for us in the states. No way.

Then, you must understand the cultural difference from a citizenship who doesn't want to wait, wants it now , and there is no way they will put up with the Chaos it will be.

Number one thing I hear, and have seen here was dealing with insurance companies. the Government is better at running an insurance company than the insurance company? Medicare is hard enough, we can't even imagine his fiasco of "free" ( it is not free)

How many uninsured people will die from now to 2014, because the Medical care bill, hasn't started yet, and they are not even close to having the "electronic records" which is essential ? How many ?

Be $ 5,000 toilet seats everwhere. This will not pass the courts any way .
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Old 07-03-2010, 03:58 PM   #813
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The moral of the story is the Government cannot do it for us in the states. No way.

Then, you must understand the cultural difference from a citizenship who doesn't want to wait, wants it now , and there is no way they will put up with the Chaos it will be.

Number one thing I hear, and have seen here was dealing with insurance companies. the Government is better at running an insurance company than the insurance company? Medicare is hard enough, we can't even imagine his fiasco of "free" ( it is not free)

How many uninsured people will die from now to 2014, because the Medical care bill, hasn't started yet, and they are not even close to having the "electronic records" which is essential ? How many ?

Be $ 5,000 toilet seats everwhere. This will not pass the courts any way .
For someone who can't ever really answer questions asked of him, I find it ironic that you can sum of the moral of the story. Especially in such a nonsensical manner.
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Old 07-03-2010, 04:05 PM   #814
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The moral of the story is the Government cannot do it for us in the states. No way..
But all those kids get the Government medical care, and that guy who got beat up will be ok because he can get Government medical care.

At least that's what you said earlier. So which is it? Can Government do it for us, or not?
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Old 07-03-2010, 08:08 PM   #815
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I know 10 people in my hospital ( we have a staff of over 4,000) who took the shot. When we refused, they threatend us with suspension. we said "good" we will go to the beach. hey backed off quickly
This is frightening.
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Old 07-04-2010, 03:45 AM   #816
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it passed on a bi-partisan vote, too



you do realize that is a ten year projection.

I guess when the 'mark up' a bill they are required to do this.

why not say it cost 120 billion a year?


did you complain about the cost of Bush's Irag mis-adventure?

COSTOFWAR.COM - The Cost of War
It's been 18 months and Obama has embraced and used the same methods as bush. Why doesn't he end it then?

My opinion, but your mis- directing the anger. Obama is comander in Chief. he could stop it tomorrow. Maybe once he got it, he saw the whole story.

Obma has been President for 18 month. He could end it at any point, but he knows he cant


1.5 trillion could subsidize health insurance for a lot of people . ever though of why he doesn't.? Unions... they need the public options as the money paid in for HC for members, is "gone " Union dues went some where.

I love the film of the NEA President saying, " The education union isn't about the kids, it is about money and power " beautiful. It's in his own words and on film
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Old 07-04-2010, 03:57 AM   #817
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This is frightening.

Remember at the beginning that it was a Medical emergency. A National emergency. Total BS

They just burned I think it was 90 million doses. The Hospital were required to reprt ANY seasonal flu as possible H1N1 , even if the test was no. Then the combined the numbers of seasonal and H1N1, hospitializations and deaths. said so right on the bottom of their site.

We know flu season, we know what is coming etc, and it took abut 2 days to find this was totally bogus, and how "organzied it was to get people to take ths shots.

we have seen it before. We never take the shots. By the time anything gets out, we have been exposed to it months ahead.

They were going to suspend everyone who wouldn't take them. CDC is a very political organization.

Never be the first one to take these shots. The flu shots of a few years back killed more people, or bad side effects than H1N1 ever could .

we have immunities to most of these things. Mexico, not so much... if that was even H1NI..

again, look who got the contracts for the vaccine. Follow the money. Then you will get some idea why they want medical and economic control of healthcare. No this isn't theroy. search it. You will only believe it if you see it yourself.

Respectfully, I am trying to tell you this is not what they say it is. am asking for your own knowledge to look this stuff up. It will freak you out, and like H1N1, it is right there on the appropriate agencies sites. Plain view.

To us, it was like it was a drill. We do them all the time,, and the H1N1 was just like the others.
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Old 07-04-2010, 04:12 AM   #818
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But all those kids get the Government medical care, and that guy who got beat up will be ok because he can get Government medical care.

At least that's what you said earlier. So which is it? Can Government do it for us, or not?
They can it for kids, they do it for people like the Boston guy, and they can do something so that there is no more pre-existing conditions, etc, but they CANT take over and run the system I cannot stress this enough. What they are doing is Nationalizing 1/7th of the national economy. They are trying to give themselves power over all the banks. Wall street, they will curse them and such, but will make regulations with no teeth. Democrats get their money from wall street, not republicans.

1.7 trillion dollars, going 10 years, and they will save money? No.

PS Unions have spent the dues that is supposed to pay for members medical care. the money is not there. They are using it for "other purposes".. Politcal power? Yup

Did you see that the LA Conty employee have to pay a "fee" of 130 a motnh even if they are not in the Unions? Also, some union out there, is using dies to hire busses to go to AZ or a banks guys house to protest.

They are spending the mebers money that is supposed to be invested to pay for future medical car and pension. Not politics. The suing members won the case.

This is about power and control. Dont believe me if you want, but I have seen SEIU nurses meetings.. they HAVE to be there, or just pay the same fee. Unions dont run hospitals.

You could give everyone a tax credit, to offset the cost of insurance to people in need and still have money left over. This is only going to force everyone into the "public option. You cannot keep your own if you are happy with it. That is a false promise.

The single best thing they could do, is allow me, from FL , to buy insurance in ____ state, or better yet, the same pool congress gets. They have at last count some 450 different plans at all price levels. Competition lowers prices.

Last 2 paragraphs are Hillary's plan.(in basic) It would work, work very well. The unemployed or disbled etc, could use medicaid or , elderl, medicare. Sme stabliztions has to be done to Medicare.

Please, this int even political. This is about something I care about deeply. It's not my job, I care about my patients . This is not what they say it is. Congress, most of them, have no idea what is in the bill. It took us 20 lawyers just to understand it. You think Nancy does? Congressman don't write these bills ( most of them) staff does by direction... Chief of Staff?
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Old 07-04-2010, 05:45 AM   #819
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diemen View Post
This, combined with your previous "the only reason for emergency back surgery is loss of bowel control" is causing my BS alarm to go into Defcon 5 mode. Testicular cancer definitely has a high rate of curability, but it is not 100%.

Exactly what kind of medically related profession are you in?

R.T.F.P

go back to Nixon days when they started keeping cancer statistic's. from aprox 100 % death to 100 % cure. Same thing moved from the top of one list to the other. We can debate this all day, but it wold be a waste of time. I KNOW .

Want to trade jobs for a day?
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Old 07-04-2010, 05:54 AM   #820
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diemen View Post
This, combined with your previous "the only reason for emergency back surgery is loss of bowel control" is causing my BS alarm to go into Defcon 5 mode. Testicular cancer definitely has a high rate of curability, but it is not 100%.

Exactly what kind of medically related profession are you in?

R.T.F.P.

I said loss of bladder control, in relation to paralysis spine/back problems. I did not say the only . It is a medical emergency

A gunshot in the spine would be an emergency reason for backsurgery ( IE : Spine) Car accident, slips and falls, sports injury , anything involving the spine COULD also be an emergency . If someone puched someone in the face, you know how easy it is to break C-7? That could easily be an emergency. People have rear end car accidents, and walk around for weeks with fractured c-7 and not know it. A local ER will say" muscle strain" You could drop in a second with a fractured c-7.

As bad or Worse problem with leg paraysis and lost of bowel control due to a spinal cord injury. Again, that is a medical emergency


R.T.F.P Decon 5 alright
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