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Old 03-23-2010, 11:55 AM   #461
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Ryan can't possibly be worse than Palin or Jindal. I'm still giggling over his speech criticizing Volcano monitoring.

Well, the bill has been signed. Only took 20 pens to do so. Oh and shout out to the Lefties out there, handed not Socialists , as 3 of the last 4 Presidents have been southpaws. Thankfully we don't have to claim the W.
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Old 03-23-2010, 12:01 PM   #462
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Please, do not turn this in an abortion thread (or it'll probably be closed quickly). Besides, from what I understand nothing has changed with respect to the situation before ObamaCare so it's not worth derailing the thread.
not trying too, all i was saying was that the states should decide, I didn't express an opinion either way. i just don't want anyones personal convictions to be decided who is in the federal offices. handle it at the state level.

i didn't mean to offend anyone here

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Old 03-23-2010, 12:26 PM   #463
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i didn't mean to offend anyone here


i don't think you did offend anyone -- it's just that FYM has a very, very, very hard time discussing abortion, that's all.
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Old 03-23-2010, 12:38 PM   #464
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not trying too, all i was saying was that the states should decide

I presume you are young, comparatively speaking (I'm 54)


but this whole let the States decide is reminiscent of the 'anti - Civil Rights' movement.
If States decided, plural marriage might be legal in Utah, many States had laws on the books that prevented mixed-race marriages. And of course, 'States Rights' was the chant of slave holders , too.

I don't think you agree with those any of those positions.
But, the "let the States decide" puts you in their company.
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:18 PM   #465
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The Secret Service are looking for your friends

Health Care Bill Spurs Assassination Calls on Twitter - ABC News
Sadly I was anticipating this.

I honestly do not understand how this bill and this President has stirred up so much hate. It baffles me. I can read and hear all the debates about the negatives surrounding this bill and anger over President Obama and it will never make any sense to me.
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:20 PM   #466
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I presume you are young, comparatively speaking (I'm 54)


but this whole let the States decide is reminiscent of the 'anti - Civil Rights' movement.
If States decided, plural marriage might be legal in Utah, many States had laws on the books that prevented mixed-race marriages. And of course, 'States Rights' was the chant of slave holders , too.

I don't think you agree with those any of those positions.
But, the "let the States decide" puts you in their company.
well i guess 34 is younger. however what if the government passed a law that would have prevented mixed marriages? of course i don't agree with slavery. in your cases yes, the govt made the right decesion, however i don't think people should be fined if they don't have health care. and the irs enforcing it? aren't they in our lives enough?
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:22 PM   #467
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Sadly I was anticipating this.

I honestly do not understand how this bill and this President has stirred up so much hate. It baffles me. I can read and hear all the debates about the negatives surrounding this bill and anger over President Obama and it will never make any sense to me.
anything the govt does will always have haters. i remember when people thought is was a bad idea to get tax cuts.
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:41 PM   #468
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however i don't think people should be fined if they don't have health care. and the irs enforcing it? aren't they in our lives enough?
If you choose to go uninsured and then get sick you cost me. When you speed you put my children's life in danger. Do you not believe in fines at all?

Are they really in your life? How did they hinderence your life today?

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i remember when people thought is was a bad idea to get tax cuts.
Well they are when you can't afford them, but of course the tea baggers won't protest about that...
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:41 PM   #469
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well i guess 34 is younger. however what if the government passed a law that would have prevented mixed marriages? of course i don't agree with slavery. in your cases yes, the govt made the right decesion, however i don't think people should be fined if they don't have health care. and the irs enforcing it? aren't they in our lives enough?
for over 30 years now, I have been self employed

if I don't pay Social Security payments on my income the IRS comes after me now.

Social Security is a retirement plan, is that more essential than Health Care?
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:44 PM   #470
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If you choose to go uninsured and then get sick you cost me. When you speed you put my children's life in danger. Do you not believe in fines at all?

Are they really in your life? How did they hinderence your life today?



Well they are when you can't afford them, but of course the tea baggers won't protest about that...
see another bad govt idea
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:45 PM   #471
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for over 30 years now, I have been self employed

if I don't pay Social Security payments on my income the IRS comes after me now.

Social Security is a retirement plan, is that more essential than Health Care?
i am paying into social security without the hope of getting so where does that leave me? plan for retirement through other means. if i had to choose between health care or SS, I would choose HC. I have always said that I shouldn't have to pay into SS if I don't want it.
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:46 PM   #472
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see another bad govt idea
You quoted like 3 different ideas
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:49 PM   #473
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I'm getting the feeling Swan, that you just don't like government at all and lean closer to anarchy? Am I right?
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:49 PM   #474
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[QUOTE=BVS;6703213]If you choose to go uninsured and then get sick you cost me. When you speed you put my children's life in danger. Do you not believe in fines at all?

Are they really in your life? How did they hinderence your life today?

/QUOTE]

the irs came after me because they claimed i didn't report my state income tax return in 2007. I just had to send in the paper work to show that I had. Major inconveince that took a couple months to work out. Sure I believe in fines but why should I have to pay for something that I don't want? If I get sick without health care and then I try to get some through the feds after I get sick, they should grant it too you, then fine you when you didn't have it.
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:51 PM   #475
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I'm getting the feeling Swan, that you just don't like government at all and lean closer to anarchy? Am I right?
no am i just a fan of limited govt. my step father was a hospital administrator for the Veterans admin for over 30 years and he would talk to us about the ineffiecent ways of govt health care.
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:53 PM   #476
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I'm getting the feeling Swan, that you just don't like government at all and lean closer to anarchy? Am I right?

i am not a libertarian either, what you don't know about me is that I protested in washington dc the war in iraq after my wifes cousin dies so I really don't ride either side of the dumb political realm. I just don't like big govt programs due to ineffientcy and looming bankruptcy.
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:54 PM   #477
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however what if the government passed a law that would have prevented mixed marriages?

the 'so called' founding fathers or framers passed a lot of bad laws
or left out many people from the 'rights' they gave themselves, that is why when people ask what was their intent? I find the question odd.


As for Federal Laws that discriminate, or exclude classes of people from equal protection? We should be moving away from that and become a more enlighten society.

Yet, some still yearn for the 'good ol days' when states could exclude some people, to the advantage of other people.
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Old 03-23-2010, 01:58 PM   #478
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Sure I believe in fines but why should I have to pay for something that I don't want?
You don't want coverage because you're independently wealthy and can afford a major surgery if something happens to you today?

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If I get sick without health care and then I try to get some through the feds after I get sick, they should grant it too you, then fine you when you didn't have it.
This doesn't make any sense.

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no am i just a fan of limited govt. my step father was a hospital administrator for the Veterans admin for over 30 years and he would talk to us about the ineffiecent ways of govt health care.
And I've worked in public hospital administration for years and I can tell you it's not always much better. And the public insurance companies aren't efficient at all. I work in a hospital that is 60% covered. Last year we only had 38% of procedures reimbursed. And Medicare paid out much more than public insurance companies, so a lot of what they are telling you, lies.
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Old 03-23-2010, 02:01 PM   #479
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the 'so called' founding fathers or framers passed a lot of bad laws
or left out many people from the 'rights' they gave themselves, that is why when people ask what was their intent? I find the question odd.


As for Federal Laws that discriminate, or exclude classes of people from equal protection? We should be moving away from that and become a more enlighten society.

Yet, some still yearn for the 'good ol days' when states could exclude some people, to the advantage of other people.
thats why i don't like big government...its still run by people which by nature are flawed. of course we should move away from things that discriminate. but spending more money doesn't end that.
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Old 03-23-2010, 02:04 PM   #480
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You don't want coverage because you're independently wealthy and can afford a major surgery if something happens to you today?


This doesn't make any sense.


And I've worked in public hospital administration for years and I can tell you it's not always much better. And the public insurance companies aren't efficient at all. I work in a hospital that is 60% covered. Last year we only had 38% of procedures reimbursed. And Medicare paid out much more than public insurance companies, so a lot of what they are telling you, lies.

medicare still does though turn down people like my grandmother who has alheimzers but thank god some of her treatments were picked up by cigna. my stepdad was telling the truth though, he could have lied to me but whom to do you mean lied to me.
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