Just a day in the life of a racist

[anitram]

RALEIGH, N.C. (AP) - A state representative forwarded an e-mail to fellow lawmakers that claimed, ``Two things made this country great: White men & Christianity.''
Rep. Don Davis, a white Republican, said he received the letter Friday and forwarded it to every member of the state House and Senate. He said he didn't consider the letter racist.

``I just put it out for information. People can read into it whatever they want to,'' Davis said.

``There's a lot of it that's truth, the way I see it,'' Davis said. ``Who came to this country first - the white man, didn't he? That's who made this country great.''

The letter angered other lawmakers who considered it offensive and racist.

``It absolutely destroys the racial harmony that we are trying to foster in this state and in this nation,'' said Rep. William Wainwright, vice chairman of the Legislative Black Caucus.

Rep. Ron Sutton, the only American Indian in the General Assembly, said he had no use for such sentiments in the Statehouse. ``It just shows his white-supremacist, Gestapo mentality,'' Sutton said.

The address says the e-mail was sent to Davis from an Internet site called God's Order Affirmed in Love.

``Two things made this country great: White men & Christianity,'' the letter says. ``Every problem that has arrisen (sic) can be directly traced back to our departure from God's Law and the disenfranchisement of White men.''

And people thought Jesse Helms' legacy wouldn't last...

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o lijepa
o draga
o slatka
slobodo

[This message has been edited by anitram (edited 10-28-2001).]

[Rono]

Well, ehh, hmm, damned now i need to blaim my ancestors for creating America.

This sucks,.....

[This message has been edited by Rono (edited 10-28-2001).]

[theSoulfulMofo]

WHITE MEN + BURNING CROSSES = KKK of AmeriKKKa

See what Rep. Davis would say to THAT!

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"Yes, there are two paths you can go by, but in the long run
There's still time to change the road you're on." - Stairway to Heaven, Zoso: Led Zeppelin

[DrTeeth]

Originally posted by Rono:
Well, ehh, hmm, damned now i need to blaim my ancestors for creating America.

This sucks,.....

[This message has been edited by Rono (edited 10-28-2001).]

I'm just happy to know my ancestors are all female.

[Johnny Swallow]

Originally posted by anitram:
... white-supremacist, Gestapo mentality...

[popkidu2]

this guy's dumber than the moose up here in new hampshire.

seriously, that type of comment won't fly. I'm sure he'll be out on his ass come next election.

Someone needs to clue him in...the Native Americans were doing just fine before we got here.....they sure as hell took better care of the earth than we ever will.

[U2girl]

The thing that pisses me off at white racists is the fact that the white race did more bad things than any other.

Just think:
- who invented slavery?
- who killed millions of Indians in North and South America? (either by weapons or by bringing new, unknown diseases)
- who promotes racism the most?


White people.

The fact is the white race got lucky and got to the technology that enabled it spreading across the world first. Also, the white race got lucky that it lives in the part of the world easiest to manipulate for agriculture and the mildest climate etc...it has NOTHING to do with it being any better than other races. It was pure coincidence.


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"It's about finding your way into the music." - Edge

"Something inside said this could be everything in your life." - Bono

"U2 as a band does things no one else can do. I think that is a very powerful thing." - Larry

"Adam believed in the band before anyone did." - Bono

[This message has been edited by U2girl (edited 11-01-2001).]

[Johnny Swallow]

KILL THOSE RACIST WHITE ASSHOLES!!!



U2girl, many different races have enslaved other people, white/black/asian/indian you name it. You can't prove that anyone race 'invented' it. And you can't measure racism, black people can be just as racist as white people. Ever heard of the Black panthers? Louis Farakahn?

Don't believe everything you see on TV.

[U2girl]

Originally posted by Johnny Swallow:
KILL THOSE RACIST WHITE ASSHOLES!!!



U2girl, many different races have enslaved other people, white/black/asian/indian you name it. You can't prove that anyone race 'invented' it. And you can't measure racism, black people can be just as racist as white people. Ever heard of the Black panthers? Louis Farakahn?

Don't believe everything you see on TV.

True, but white race used slavery more massively than other races. US even had a war to free slaves!
And, gee, don't you think i know there are racists among black people too?
Why do you think they became racists? Because of the way white racists treated black people.

It's true-white race did/does more dirty things than other races.

[speedracer]

Originally posted by U2girl:
True, but white race used slavery more massively than other races. US even had a war to free slaves!

Not entirely true...if I remember correctly, most of the West's slaves were bought from *black* slaveholders in Africa.

[melon]

Ah yes...the greatest of all generalizations and cop-outs in history: "race." Racists of all shapes and forms are, perhaps, the most pathetic, because, for some reason, people are categorized simply by skin color.

Now let's have a token melon history lesson here (if only the high schools had done their job!). Slavery is extremely old. It's even mentioned in the Bible in a few places (mostly supportive of it, ironic enough). That, itself, should say that this isn't a "white phenomena," as the world of the Bible was not Caucasian (don't let those white Jesus statues fool you ). Slavery is probably as old as man itself, as all governments were essentially autocratic, whether it be at the tribal level or at an imperial level. Hence, when you have all the power, it's much easier to force your subjects to do things they don't want to. What if you don't have enough subjects? You conquer your enemies and add them to your "work force." This was obviously the preferred way of doing things in everywhere from ancient Egypt to the Roman Empire to the more sophisticated form of slavery, feudalism.

Obviously, now, the point of contention here is likely the African slave trade of the 1600s to the 1800s. This was imported to the U.S. by the Dutch--I guess you can say, "white people." But it's not a simple case of the Dutch traders stealing people in Africa. Slavery in Africa was extremely common, as warring tribes would often conquer their enemies, only to enslave them. To think that Africa was immune to this practice is an incredible fallacy. So, quite often, the Dutch traders would come in to these African empires and trade goods for slaves. The African imperial leaders, seeing an opportunity for wealth, consented; hence, in many instances, these corrupt empires sold their own people away. To be fair, though, the Dutch often did kidnap Africans in addition to their "legally" traded slaves.

I think I've made my point clear here, but I'll make a quick synopsis:

1) labelling people by their race is stupid, because it wasn't "white people" who brought in the African slave trade, it was the Dutch, or, better specifically, corrupt Dutch businessmen using the Bible as justification for their actions (remember how I said the Bible supported slavery?).

2) slavery was not invented by white people, and surely was not used exclusively by white people, as it was used in Asian, Middle Eastern, and even African cultures as a convenient way to take out enemies and increase their workforce.

3) white people have been enslaved as well, as the Romans often enslaved the European "barbarians" as well, not to mention the sophisticated form of slavery, feudalism, which lasted well over 1000 years and wasn't even abolished in Russia until around the 1850s.

4) nothing is as simple as it seems, and that does include slavery.

Any comments?

Melon

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"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time

[U2Bama]

Johnny Swallow, Speedracer, and Melon summed it all up best here. Something else I learned in college from a "revisionist-revisionist" history professor: there were freedmen (former slaves) in the Louisiana Territory who eventually owned plantations and, yes, even their OWN slaves. But this was in Louisiana which had a more liberal slave system influenced by that of the French.

The sad thing is that slavery still exists in the African nations of Sudan, Nigeria and Mauritania, but we are not supposed to criticize it since it is part of the "culture."

~U2Alabama

[pub crawler]

Originally posted by melon:
Any comments?

Yes. Melon, you seem to be justifying slavery and/or racial prejudice. The fact that whites may have been enslaved at various times throughout history does not in any way justify the racism towards people of color that exists in America today.

[brettig]

I dont think he was ever defending slavery- rather he was attacking the contention that the concept of slavery was the invention of Western/White society. What he did point out was that certain parts of the Bible, particularly the Old Testament do appear to support the concept...

I also applaud anyone who sees feudalism as just another mode of slavery- having read recently about Napoleon's 1812 Invasion of Russia I cannot think of the system any other way...

[pub crawler]

Originally posted by brettig:
I dont think he was ever defending slavery- rather he was attacking the contention that the concept of slavery was the invention of Western/White society.

Point well taken. I realize that melon's purpose was (at least partially) to rebut U2girl's somewhat rash comments but within the context of this thread, which began with the quotes of the ethnocentric (and in my view, ignorant) Rep. Davis, my feeling is that melon's comments could actually be taken as a defense of people like Davis.

If we're talking about America and we're talking about today, i.e. 2001, then we've got to talk about the fact that whites still hold the balance of power in this country.

[pub crawler]

...and an imbalance of power among racial and/or ethnic groups seems to foster racial inequalities.

That's all I'm sayin'.

[brettig]

It does...we've got our own 'dirty laundry' regarding indigenous people in australia i assure you...

[U2girl]

Originally posted by melon:
Slavery is probably as old as man itself, as all governments were essentially autocratic, whether it be at the tribal level or at an imperial level. Hence, when you have all the power, it's much easier to force your subjects to do things they don't want to. What if you don't have enough subjects? You conquer your enemies and add them to your "work force." This was obviously the preferred way of doing things in everywhere from ancient Egypt to the Roman Empire to the more sophisticated form of slavery, feudalism.

Obviously, now, the point of contention here is likely the African slave trade of the 1600s to the 1800s. This was imported to the U.S. by the Dutch--I guess you can say, "white people." But it's not a simple case of the Dutch traders stealing people in Africa. Slavery in Africa was extremely common, as warring tribes would often conquer their enemies, only to enslave them. To think that Africa was immune to this practice is an incredible fallacy. So, quite often, the Dutch traders would come in to these African empires and trade goods for slaves. The African imperial leaders, seeing an opportunity for wealth, consented; hence, in many instances, these corrupt empires sold their own people away. To be fair, though, the Dutch often did kidnap Africans in addition to their "legally" traded slaves.

I think I've made my point clear here, but I'll make a quick synopsis:

1) labelling people by their race is stupid, because it wasn't "white people" who brought in the African slave trade, it was the Dutch, or, better specifically, corrupt Dutch businessmen using the Bible as justification for their actions (remember how I said the Bible supported slavery?).

2) slavery was not invented by white people, and surely was not used exclusively by white people, as it was used in Asian, Middle Eastern, and even African cultures as a convenient way to take out enemies and increase their workforce.

3) white people have been enslaved as well, as the Romans often enslaved the European "barbarians" as well, not to mention the sophisticated form of slavery, feudalism, which lasted well over 1000 years and wasn't even abolished in Russia until around the 1850s.

4) nothing is as simple as it seems, and that does include slavery.

Any comments?

Melon

Yes.

It's true that human history is full of battles and conflicts-and in those conflicts winners always took vengeance on losers (using them for slavery, burning down their homes etc...).

Interesting thought: feudalism as a form of slavery? I guess that's one way of looking at it, though when i think of "slavery" usually black people's and Romans's slavery come to mind.

1) Well Dutch people are white, aren't they?

Another thing i was getting at was that the white race has been expanding more than other races. (going into Americas, colonizing Africa-i think in some parts of N. Africa French language is still used quite often)
While doing that, it was very aggresive towards the native people over there, winning eventually with the use of its higher development and/or pressuring people to Christian faith.

This has nothing to do with slavery, but it does have to do with white racism:
let's not forget that Germans were using "arian race is supreme" propaganda to justify what they did to Jews and others, "who had to make place for the supreme race".

I think it's ironic that, of all the races, white people (white racists), claim to be above the rest.

Like i said, it was all about coincidence and luck. No way are whites automatically better than other races. All races are equal: there are good and bad people to be found any- and everywhere in the world.

[Johnny Swallow]

*Looks down*
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This post brought to you by: Ignorance "It never fails."

AIM: JuanSwallow

[This message has been edited by Johnny Swallow (edited 11-02-2001).]

[Popmartijn]

Originally posted by U2girl:
1) Well Dutch people are white, aren't they?

No.

I'm pink and rosy

Interesting thought: feudalism as a form of slavery? I guess that's one way of looking at it, though when i think of "slavery" usually black people's and Romans's slavery come to mind.

I think I agree with the thought of feudalism as slavery. You mentioned what comes first to your mind when talking about slavery and I don't think you're the only one thinking like that. But like Melon said, slavery is unfortunately more widespread and older than that.


C ya!

Marty



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People criticize me but I know it's not the end
I try to kick the truth, not just to make friends

Spearhead - People In Tha Middle