It's Justice - NOT Charity!

[BostonAnne]

Eliminating poverty...

Eliminating Aids & Debt and allowing trade...

Giving 800 million people a chance to receive the basic care that we do - that is NOT CHARITY. These 800 million people deserve a chance to live. They deserve running water, food, an education and health care.

To pull out what I posted in another thread:

If you haven't already, please check out the intro to "Make Poverty History" campaign.

http://www.makepovertyhistory.org/

After the intro, please notice the first thing that is mentioned.

We don't want your money.

Then, please note all of the organizations that have banded together to run this campaign. They scroll by on the bottom right corner. World Vision, Unicef, Christian Aid, and Save the Children are there to name a few. I bet you recognize more. All of these organizations do accept donations and do great things with the money they collected - but they are banding together to say that it isn't enough.

Charitable donations aren't what is needed to solve the problem. The issues need to be resolved at a government level to bring about change. Sending money to the individual organizations isn't making the difference.

And while I respect all of your rights to keep your charitable donations private - your voice is needed in this effort for justice.

we want you to repeatedly make it clear that 30,000 people dying unnecessarily each and every day from extreme poverty, is absolutely and totally unacceptable.

Would you deny for others
What you demand for yourself?


Where you live should not decide
Whether you live or whether you die

 

[verte76]

Thanks BostonAnne. That's right, these people are not going to ask for your money. They are going to ask for your support. It's as simple as writing your political representatives and asking them to support legislation to help these people live in dignity. It *is* justice, not charity.

 

[BostonAnne]

I'm glad you agree verte. I started this thread to continue the conversation from the "OF WHITE WRISTBANDS, BRAD PITT and ETHIOPIA" thread.

The two posts from that thread initiated this thread:

You can wear all the stuff you want - it would be far better to send money to the organization in need.

you have no clue what i do, charity wise. and you will continue to have no clue, because it's no one's business but my own.

While I responded to both of them within the thread, I started a new thread to address the subject. I feel that this issue is not charity, but justice.

 

[BostonAnne]

I just found a link to this article.

http://www.sojo.net/index.cfm?action=news.display_archives&mode=current_opinion&article=CO_040616_wallis

Bono's speech fits into this thread nicely:

Bono spoke at the Africare dinner in Washington, to fifteen hundred of the capitol's leaders and media. "Excuse me if I'm a little nervous," Bono apologized, "but I'm not used to speaking to less than 20,000 people!" Then he spoke like a preacher.

"So you've been doing God's work, but what's God working on now? What's God working on this year? Two and a half million Africans are going to die of AIDS. What's God working on now? I meet the people who tell me it's going to take an act of God to stop this plague. Well, I don't believe that. I think God is waiting for us to act. In fact, I think that God is on His knees to us….waiting for us to turn around this supertanker of indifference.... waiting for us to recognize that distance can no longer decide who is our neighbor. We can't choose our neighbors anymore. We can't choose the benefits of globalization without some of the responsibilities, and we should remind ourselves that "love thy neighbor" is not advice: it is a command." I can hear the tones of Micah in the voice of Bono and also in Gordon Brown. Now at the beginning of a new century and millennium, I see a new generation of young activists coming of age and committing themselves to build global justice.

 

[Sherry Darling]

How I love that man!

Boston Anne, as always, your committment helps us keep on keeping on!



SD

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

I'm glad you agree verte. I started this thread to continue the conversation from the "OF WHITE WRISTBANDS, BRAD PITT and ETHIOPIA" thread.

The two posts from that thread initiated this thread:





While I responded to both of them within the thread, I started a new thread to address the subject. I feel that this issue is not charity, but justice.

call it what you will, it still doesn't take away from my opinion that i don't have to advertise what i do, be it giving money or a more hands on approach, and i'm insulted by people who insinuate that because i don't care to advertise what i do in neon lights that i'm not "doing my part."

 

[U2democrat]

Can i get an AMEN from my fellow Blue Crackers out there?

 

[diamond]

i think when bono said it's
a 'war on indifference' it clarified alot.

that's what the meat of the idea is. a war to do something.
it's against complancey and it's a war against arguing about wristbands.

in short its for all of us to shut up and do something.
period.

db9

 

[pax]

Wow, db is on a roll today.

 

[verte76]

I normally don't screw with ribbons, bracelets and other symbols either. I just don't. I know alot of people who do. I see yellow bracelets and red ribbons all over the place.Wearing a white bracelet or red ribbon or whatever the hell in itself doesn't mean anything if you don't act on your conviction. Just having the belief isn't enough.

 

[BostonAnne]

I stopped posting in the bracelet thread and started this new thread. The subject is:

Is helping Africa and other poor countries get on their feet..

Justice or Charity.

NOT bracelets.

 

[U2democrat]

I normally don't screw with ribbons, bracelets and other symbols either. I just don't. I know alot of people who do. I see yellow bracelets and red ribbons all over the place.Wearing a white bracelet or red ribbon or whatever the hell in itself doesn't mean anything if you don't act on your conviction. Just having the belief isn't enough.

I agree. Even though I am wearing a yellow wristband, I know and understand the cause, it's not just to conform to everyone else. Unfortunately most people I know wear them to fit in. Now that I'm 18 and will soon be independent hopefully I'll be able to contribute more to the causes I believe in. I currently do a lot of volunteering for Democratic Party stuff, I hope to do more.

 

[BostonAnne]

 

[U2democrat]

What's that for?

 

[starsgoblue]

Yes! It's not about charity at all....it's about doing the right thing. I don't want to hear arguments about 'Well Africa is doing this soooo I won't do anything."

Bono put it this way.....if you are driving along and you see a huge car wreck with a person badly injured and you realize that person is a drunk driver....well you're still going to call an ambulance. No excuses.

 

[U2democrat]

The feeling when actually doing labor to help people rather than signing a check is so wonderful. If only more people would get off their lazy butts and do something this world would be a better place.

 

[BostonAnne]

What's that for?

I'm sorry U2democrat, I'm just feeling a little frustrated.
Everyone keeps talking about the bracelet thing. I left that behind at the other thread and am trying to discuss charity vs justice.

It's me. I just didn't relate my thoughts correctly at the beginning of this thread is all.

Carry on.

 

[U2democrat]

I'm sorry U2democrat, I'm just feeling a little frustrated.
Everyone keeps talking about the bracelet thing. I left that behind at the other thread and am trying to discuss charity vs justice.

It's me. I just didn't relate my thoughts correctly at the beginning of this thread is all.

Carry on.

My bad!

 

[BostonAnne]

So is justice a subject that is as private as charity?

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

I stopped posting in the bracelet thread and started this new thread. The subject is:

Is helping Africa and other poor countries get on their feet..

Justice or Charity.

NOT bracelets.

well when you quote me, i'm going to respond to that quote... that quote was in the "wristband" thread, and was directed at certain people who were insinuating that i'm not "doing my part" because i think ribbons and wristbands are cheesey

 

[BostonAnne]

well when you quote me, i'm going to respond to that quote... that quote was in the "wristband" thread, and was directed at certain people who were insinuating that i'm not "doing my part" because i think ribbons and wristbands are cheesey

I understand that switching to this new thread is confusing everyone. Sorry about that.

The point I was getting at with your response in the other thread is that you used the word charity.

you have no clue what i do, charity wise. and you will continue to have no clue, because it's no one's business but my own.

So I drummed up all of the links & quotes that I posted in this thread to point out that it's justice not charity.

 

[indra]

I understand that switching to this new thread is confusing everyone. Sorry about that.

The point I was getting at with your response in the other thread is that you used the word charity.



So I drummed up all of the links & quotes that I posted in this thread to point out that it's justice not charity.

I think that is a problem though...getting people to agree that it is justice and not charity. It's much easier to think of this as charity, write a check, and forget about it, than to actually push for real change in the way the world sees and deals with the problem of extreme poverty, no matter where it is. I'm not singling anyone out...we all do it, but changing the perception of this as a problem that can be solved by giving to charity to seeing it as an issue that must be dealt with on a more basic level is a very important (yet frustrating) first step.

 

[anitram]

I'll offer some of my opinions.

Yes, this is about justice. But I think justice in itself is just an abstract terms to people who have not seen this sort of suffering first hand. And for that, I can't and don't really blame them. Viktor Frankl said once, about discussing the holocaust, that those who didn't go through it will never understand, and those who did, you don't have to say a word to, because they just get it. Africa is a terribly sad and a terribly inspired place, but for most people, it is a series of pictures or disconnected frames on a film roll.

Yes, the Buddha was right - all life is suffering, but everything is relative. Some people will become incredibly impassioned for this cause without having seen it first hand, but I believe that the vast majority will always experience a sort of disconnect, because it's not children dying in the ditch in front of your home. You don't see it, you don't mourn it on a daily basis.

So, the question is, how do we turn this from an abstract idea into something that reaches each of us personally? Is Oprah right? Do we honestly not believe these children are equal to our children, because in our hearts, if we believed that, we'd never allow what's happening? I don't think she's right per se, I just don't think that the multitude of people really comprehend what death and destruction mean. The first world and its people have largely been sheltered for the last 50 years. We've not had our children slaughtered and our wives raped in our homes while our men fought wars. We've not had millions die of famine or diarrhea. We've not lived as starving refugees in a land that didn't want us. This is what the Africans experience every day of their lives, and our hearts just haven't broken for them completely yet.

IMVVHO, Bono is in some ways barking up the wrong tree. I've said this before and I don't think it was an incredibly popular opinion, but I'll say it again. He's done well with the politicians and many are on board. But he's spending too much time and too much energy with the politicians and that doesn't inspire the people. He has to go to the streets and get the complacent middle class behind him in huge numbers. It is my opinion that he has thus failed to do so, and he's also not really tried all that hard. The politicians will never give him what he wants until they have pressure from the people. And the people will not apply any pressure until they start to see in concrete and real terms what this tragedy entails.

 

[U2democrat]

I agree with the anitram that the middle class needs to be inspired. We're the politicians constituents, and if the constituents ain't happy, the pols are nervous. We need to make noise, that'll get something done.

 

[indra]

IMVVHO, Bono is in some ways barking up the wrong tree. I've said this before and I don't think it was an incredibly popular opinion, but I'll say it again. He's done well with the politicians and many are on board. But he's spending too much time and too much energy with the politicians and that doesn't inspire the people. He has to go to the streets and get the complacent middle class behind him in huge numbers. It is my opinion that he has thus failed to do so, and he's also not really tried all that hard. The politicians will never give him what he wants until they have pressure from the people. And the people will not apply any pressure until they start to see in concrete and real terms what this tragedy entails.

I agree. Politicians don't do things because the things are right, they do them because they get pressure from their constituents. Until their constituents care enough to push, the politicians won't do that much.

 

[Katey]

I agree with Anitram as well. It's a very real problem right now that the grassroots movements are not taking hold and it's not being dramatized enough. The politicians know it,they've told activists you need middle america and you don't have it. I do think organizations such as DATA and many others do need to concentrate on these grassroot appeals in addition to working with the politicians, it seems to have had a bit of a shift in focus since the hearts of america tour. I'm not saying thats up to Bono or DATA even for that matter but there is a need to get back to bringing this to the people.

 

[nbcrusader]

Is helping Africa and other poor countries get on their feet..

Justice or Charity.

I'm not sure it is either.

I would characterize it as loving thy neighbor.

But I understand and support the thoughts behind the call for justice.

 

[starsgoblue]

I can see Anitram's point....BUT what of when Bono drove around in a trailer truck across middle America and talking to citizen's about the AIDS crisis?
Bono has tried to get grassroots support but to be honest the governments of theses nations are the ones imposing the crippling debts and denying medical treatment to those in Africa. It's a multifaceted problem.

 

[BostonAnne]

IMVVHO, Bono is in some ways barking up the wrong tree. I've said this before and I don't think it was an incredibly popular opinion, but I'll say it again. He's done well with the politicians and many are on board. But he's spending too much time and too much energy with the politicians and that doesn't inspire the people. He has to go to the streets and get the complacent middle class behind him in huge numbers. It is my opinion that he has thus failed to do so, and he's also not really tried all that hard. The politicians will never give him what he wants until they have pressure from the people. And the people will not apply any pressure until they start to see in concrete and real terms what this tragedy entails.

I agree with you that the answer is getting to the people and not the politicians at this point. I argued the same point in the "Bush will help Bono" thread.

I think Bono has started to shift gears with the Heartland tour, the Bill O'Reilly interview and the kick off the of "One" campaign to name a few.

 

[BostonAnne]

I'm not sure it is either.

I would characterize it as loving thy neighbor.

But I understand and support the thoughts behind the call for justice.

Exactly. So why is it so hard for us (not us here at FYM, but us as in all people) to all band together and Love thy neighbor? It's such a basic moral guideline that we are all taught to follow - Religious or not.

I know what Anitram said about people being detached because it's not their front yard has a lot to do about it - but what can be done to change this?