How does society go about fighting obesity?

[ImOuttaControl]

Well, how do we? Obesity in the U.S. is quickly becoming the most costly health care issue. It's become as costly as smoking and will soon surpass it. I've also read recently that the obesity levels in Europe and Australia have also been going up dramatically. Sure some people are genetically prone to carry a little more weight, but the sad truth is that too many people simply are couch potatos and overeat.

There are a few ideas:

--Make gym costs tax deductable or partially subsidized by goverment to get more people there. Americans are paying nearly 100 Billion per year in obesity health related costs, so I believe this would be a good investement.

--Why is it that junk food seems cheaper than healthy food? If I want a bag of salad mix, I could just as well go buy a frozen pizza for myself--they're usually cheaper. I believe that junk food should have a sin tax on it. What would I consider junk food? candy, regular soda, potato chips, cookies, ice cream...those sorts of things that have really no nutritional benefit. That sin tax could be used to subsidize farming, which would lower the price of your fruits, grains and veggies and make eating healthy a cheap thing to do.

--As for fast food, I'm unsure. Do I think people should be able to sue McDonalds for "making them fat?" Absolutely not. But fast food is a huge part of the problem...maybe something as simple as putting calorie/fat/carb content on the package of all their products might educate people to just how bad it is to scarf down their double quarter pounder with cheese, supersized soda and supersized fries. Maybe a lot of people are stupid and just don't know this stuff is bad for you?

--Most importantly, school's need to start focusing on nutrition and health. Being someone who was overweight in high school, I can remember we had no education whatsoever on nutrition other than the flawed "food pyramid." I had no clue why I kept gaining weight.. Kids need to be educated on how many calories they need, how to keep track of calories, what foods to avoid and how simple the whole idea of weight management is--if you eat more calories than you burn, you'll gain weight if you eat less than you burn, you'll lose weight. So very simple.


That being said, I'm off to the gym. I'm curious to hear some other thoughts on this issue.

 

[bsp77]

I feel guilty now.

 

[ImOuttaControl]

I feel guilty now.

Why's that?

 

[U2Kitten]

Last time this came up I was furious that anyone would want to control individual's eating habits (even advocating the gov't do it) or even taxing them. The rationale was obesity is a large health problem. True. But....

...would you tax or deny care to an AIDS patient who got it through unprotected sex or drug use even though he knew he was taking risks?

...would you deny care to a smoker with lung cancer or emphazema (sp) because they ignored the warnings and anti smoking campaigns?

...would you refuse care for a drunk who was injured driving drunk even though he had heard all the don't drink and drive speeches?

Of course you wouldn't. You'd say someone was cruel and outrageous for even suggesting it.

So why only pick on fat people? Don't like fat people?

Of course bad eating habits lead to poor health. So do a lot of other things like the ones I've mentioned. You can't control every single person's lifestyle, nor should anyone try.

 

[ImOuttaControl]

Last time this came up I was furious that anyone would want to control individual's eating habits (even advocating the gov't do it) or even taxing them. The rationale was obesity is a large health problem. True. But....

...would you tax or deny care to an AIDS patient who got it through unprotected sex or drug use even though he knew he was taking risks?

...would you deny care to a smoker with lung cancer or emphazema (sp) because they ignored the warnings and anti smoking campaigns?

...would you refuse care for a drunk who was injured driving drunk even though he had heard all the don't drink and drive speeches?

Of course you wouldn't. You'd say someone was cruel and outrageous for even suggesting it.

So why only pick on fat people? Don't like fat people?

Of course bad eating habits lead to poor health. So do a lot of other things like the ones I've mentioned. You can't control every single person's lifestyle, nor should anyone try.

Ummm you didn't read my post did you? It doesn't make much sense to what I was saying.

As for your last 2 points. "Don't like fat people?" Well, if you'd have read my post you'd have seen that I was very overweight at one point and did something about it, so I have a lot of sympathy for people who are obese because I know the self-consiousness and vicious cycle it can be.

We shouldn't try to stop people from being fat? This is costing nearly 100 BILLION a year! That's like saying we shouldn't try to get people to use condoms to prevent aids or we shouldn't try to get people to quit smoking!

 

[U2Kitten]

We shouldn't try to stop people from being fat? This is costing nearly 100 BILLION a year! That's like saying we shouldn't try to get people to use condoms to prevent aids or we shouldn't try to get people to quit smoking!

Care to wonder how many billions AIDS is costing the world? Or smoking? Or what about people just getting hurt doing jackass stunts? See no one is making a big deal out of those lifestyle choices, so that's what I mean, why are the health problems caused by obesity being targeted? In the end, you CAN'T force a person to eat, drink, smoke behave or have sex responsibly.

and I'm really surprised that anyone (not targeting anyone in this thread just FYM in general) who is so gung ho about keeping gov't out of private lives would even suggest it.

 

[bsp77]

Why's that?

I haven't been jogging recently and have been eating a lot of crap. You just reminded me that I should be jogging.

 

[bsp77]

And why has an argument started here? I didn't see anything offensive in the original post, just cause for discussion.

I, on the other hand, will be offensive. Most (not all) obese people need some more self control. Not saying that I am perfect, I need some more control myself. But if I started getting really overweight, I would do something.

 

[melon]

I'd say we're obese for a few reasons:

1) We're a large country with a good proportion of the nation unable to get anywhere, except via driving. I'd be curious to know urban obesity rates versus rural/suburban obesity rates.

2) Food consumption. We consume a lot of food, and most of it is unhealthy and nutrient-deficient. Why must "health food" be in a special section of stores and cost more? All food should be "health food."

Of course, some people are genetically obese, so there are special needs required for them. However, I would say that many more are obese, due to the factors above.

Melon

 

[BVS]

You can't force, but once again I'm going to say education is key.

We are a society that is bombarded with so many conflicting images and ideas as adults. Atkins, SouthBeach, Low Fat, No Carb, this image is healthy no this is, etc.

I don't think taxing or whatever will change a thing. We need to educate our children early on so that when they are adults and obese they don't ask themselves why? And when they are bombarded with several conflicting diets they will be able to approach them in an educated manner.

I think it will be a long time before we really get anywhere with this problem. We have some that are force feeding us images or waif-like women and bulked up men and saying this beautiful. On the other hand we have overweight people saying this is what a person should look like, there is no problem with this.

 

[AvsGirl41]

Exercise. Plain and simple.

People know McDonalds isn't good for them and they eat it anyway. I know a salad is better for me than a pizza, but I will choose the pizza every time. I don't want to have to pay a sin tax for my stupidity.

Anyway, exercise is the key. Americans love the image of athletics, and the image is precisely the problem. Sports and exercise are seen as this elite thing to participate in. Look at the sports culture within our kid's schools. It's all about who's good enough to play and make it to the top, not about the love of the game and the need for exercise.

I did a huge research paper on the sports culture, and obviously I can't say if this is true across the board, but from what I was reading, Europe approached sports with a different outlook. Average people did it because it was healthy and fun, not because they wanted to compete.

We should do that. Have kids, all kids, participating in some kind of athletic activity--anything they want, and let them enjoy it. No pressure on making the cut, on winning the games, on keeping up these incredible schedules, making the school proud. Emphasize it for fun and health. (And don't favor it above academics!)

That's all well and good for kids, but what about adults? I do agree that cities should fund more recreation centers and parks for such purposes. From my own experience, I would love to hit the ice whenever I wanted, swim, or have a park close where I could walk and rollerblade comfortably. I could join a gym, but I loathe those places. There simply isn't any place for me to go.

Americans will probably solve their obesity problem when we run out of oil.

 

[sallycinnamon78]

Get Bush to launch a WAR ON OBESITY.
(sorry)

 

[U2Kitten]

Education never works. Look at anti drug, anti smoking, responsible drinking, safe sex, etc. People KNOW the things they're eating aren't healthy. They eat them because they taste good and it makes them happy.Some people are even addicted to food. Nothing is going to stop them until each individual person makes the decision because THEY want to, not because they were forced.

 

[Ft. Worth Frog]

Actually it is pretty cheap to eat fresh fruits and vegetables. Apples, oranges, bananas, etc. are mcuh better snacks than pre-packaged salty/sugary fat bombs and cheaper to buy ( writing this as I munch on my double-stuff oreos.)

 

[ImOuttaControl]

Exercise. Plain and simple.

People know McDonalds isn't good for them and they eat it anyway. I know a salad is better for me than a pizza, but I will choose the pizza every time. I don't want to have to pay a sin tax for my stupidity.

Anyway, exercise is the key. Americans love the image of athletics, and the image is precisely the problem. Sports and exercise are seen as this elite thing to participate in. Look at the sports culture within our kid's schools. It's all about who's good enough to play and make it to the top, not about the love of the game and the need for exercise.

I did a huge research paper on the sports culture, and obviously I can't say if this is true across the board, but from what I was reading, Europe approached sports with a different outlook. Average people did it because it was healthy and fun, not because they wanted to compete.

We should do that. Have kids, all kids, participating in some kind of athletic activity--anything they want, and let them enjoy it. No pressure on making the cut, on winning the games, on keeping up these incredible schedules, making the school proud. Emphasize it for fun and health. (And don't favor it above academics!)

That's all well and good for kids, but what about adults? I do agree that cities should fund more recreation centers and parks for such purposes. From my own experience, I would love to hit the ice whenever I wanted, swim, or have a park close where I could walk and rollerblade comfortably. I could join a gym, but I loathe those places. There simply isn't any place for me to go.

Americans will probably solve their obesity problem when we run out of oil.

I agree with most all of your post, except for the part about the sin tax. I'm not saying this is a huge tax or anything, just that maybe those candy bars might cost a couple cents extra, then use that money to bring down the prices of healthy foods like vegetables, fruits and whole grains.

 

[ImOuttaControl]

Education never works. Look at anti drug, anti smoking, responsible drinking, safe sex, etc. People KNOW the things they're eating aren't healthy. They eat them because they taste good and it makes them happy.Some people are even addicted to food. Nothing is going to stop them until each individual person makes the decision because THEY want to, not because they were forced.

So you say just do nothing? Combine the costs to taxpayers for dealing with the things you mention; obesity, drug addictions, smoking illness, drinking problems, sex(aids, std's..ect), and you have hundreds of billions of dollars. Well, I for one feel that if we can prevent even some of these problems through eductation and other unimposing measures, that's a good thing. Or is it not a good thing for people to better themselves? Often times people don't have the proper education to make the right choices.

 

[bsp77]

Education never works. Look at anti drug, anti smoking, responsible drinking, safe sex, etc. People KNOW the things they're eating aren't healthy. They eat them because they taste good and it makes them happy.Some people are even addicted to food. Nothing is going to stop them until each individual person makes the decision because THEY want to, not because they were forced.

Not true. All of these programs work, not as much as we would like, but they do work.

 

[Sheltie]

Education never works. Look at anti drug, anti smoking, responsible drinking, safe sex, etc. People KNOW the things they're eating aren't healthy. They eat them because they taste good and it makes them happy.Some people are even addicted to food. Nothing is going to stop them until each individual person makes the decision because THEY want to, not because they were forced.

I agree. It is a personal choice. Health is already taught in schools but kids and teens still eat the junk. It is a lifestyle choice and each individual has to make the choice to live healthy.
I go to the gym three and sometimes four days a week. Im not saying Im better then anyone but it is a committment and choice I made to be a healthy person. I pay for this myself by making adjustments in other areas of my life.
I dont need a tax deduction for it and no one else does either. Cutting out the junk alone would pay for a gym membership.

 

[BVS]

Education never works. Look at anti drug, anti smoking, responsible drinking, safe sex, etc. People KNOW the things they're eating aren't healthy. They eat them because they taste good and it makes them happy.Some people are even addicted to food. Nothing is going to stop them until each individual person makes the decision because THEY want to, not because they were forced.

Yes everyone just drop out of school and be ignorant for the rest of your life!!!

That is the most ridiculous statement I've heard. Education never works? Education doesn't work because it's not reaching out to everyone or not done properly. I won't get into sex or drugs because that's not part of this discussion but I'll address the issue at hand.

NO people don't always know what they are eating is unhealthy for them! People assume ordering salad is better than ordering a hamburger, but the truth is the size of some salads served in some restaurants with lets say a ranch dressing can be the same exact amount of calories as a hamburger, then if you add breaded chicken breast on top you've exceeded that of a hamburger.

I've seen people go on diets cut out this and that and then ask why they aren't losing weight when I see them go through 6 Dr Peppers in a day. They don't realize the calories and the sugars they are putting in their body and how much water they are actually depleting from their bodies.

People are not educated enough. People assume Quizno's is better than Mc Donalds when the truth is some sandwiches are just as bad, plus they have options like getting an extra large sandwich. But they think since they are eating at Quizno's it's better than McDonalds.

 

[BVS]

I agree. It is a personal choice. Health is already taught in schools but kids and teens still eat the junk.

Yes I had health classes in school, I learned the basic food groups but that's pretty much where it ended. We didn't learn the difference between trans fats and saturated fats, good calorie intake and bad calorie intake, good colestehol and bad, etc.

They teach you the basic food groups say eat healthy yet serve nothing but fries and pizzas in the cafeterias.

 

[Sheltie]

People know what they are eating and if it is healthy or unhealthy. Schools do need to improve lunches but there is always the option of bringing a lunch from home.

 

[ImOuttaControl]

I agree. It is a personal choice. Health is already taught in schools but kids and teens still eat the junk. It is a lifestyle choice and each individual has to make the choice to live healthy.

No offense, but I'm a teacher and know that health class is usually a joke, my students tell me all the time. I graduated from high school 6 years ago, and I certianly know they taught little or nothing about nutrition then.

If obesity is a "lifestyle choice" that costs $100 billion a year and $50 Billion of that is paid for by taxpayers, then it becomes something more.

That logic, it should be my "personal choice" as a taxpayer to not pay a dime to pay for these sorts of medical bills--if people want to get fat and get diabetes, heart attacks..ect, they can pay for it all on their own. But we all know I don't have that choice.

 

[BVS]

People know what they are eating and if it is healthy or unhealthy.

I'm sorry but that's just not true. Believe me I'm surrounded by people who think they are eating healthy and they aren't.

 

[Sheltie]

I'm sorry but that's just not true. Believe me I'm surrounded by people who think they are eating healthy and they aren't.

well, there is just no excuse for that because there is so much info on eating right and staying healthy. This info is all over the media.

 

[ImOuttaControl]

Yes everyone just drop out of school and be ignorant for the rest of your life!!!

That is the most ridiculous statement I've heard. Education never works? Education doesn't work because it's not reaching out to everyone or not done properly. I won't get into sex or drugs because that's not part of this discussion but I'll address the issue at hand.

NO people don't always know what they are eating is unhealthy for them! People assume ordering salad is better than ordering a hamburger, but the truth is the size of some salads served in some restaurants with lets say a ranch dressing can be the same exact amount of calories as a hamburger, then if you add breaded chicken breast on top you've exceeded that of a hamburger.

I've seen people go on diets cut out this and that and then ask why they aren't losing weight when I see them go through 6 Dr Peppers in a day. They don't realize the calories and the sugars they are putting in their body and how much water they are actually depleting from their bodies.

People are not educated enough. People assume Quizno's is better than Mc Donalds when the truth is some sandwiches are just as bad, plus they have options like getting an extra large sandwich. But they think since they are eating at Quizno's it's better than McDonalds.

I agree with you completely.

Your statement about restaraunts:

I used to work in a good restaraunt as a server, and one time I checked the big containers of dressing to see how bad it was. For 2 tablespoons of buttermilk ranch it was something like 30 grams of fat and 475 calories. Add cheese and croutons to that and you could just as well have a burger....On a side note, I'm a little afraid of restaraunt cheesecake now, I checked it out and for this little slice it was 750 calories and 60 grams of fat!

Your also right on about people on diets. My buddy's wife was telling me she couldn't lose weight and was frustrated by it. I looked in the porch and saw about 4 cases of regular soda out there, so I asked if she drinks that. She said yes, usually 4 cans a day! My head was about ready to explode! Here's a college educated woman who still doesn't know about the whole calorie thing! I explained that she was drinking 600 empty calories a day x7 days a week...that's over 4000 extra calories a week! Considering a pound of fat is 3500 calories, you see how that might be a problem. Anyway, to quit wrap it up and quit rambling, people are not nearly educated enough about healthy eating.

 

[BVS]

well, there is just no excuse for that because there is so much info on eating right and staying healthy. This info is all over the media.

And its all conflicting. This one says no carbs, this one says carbs are good, this one says no fat, this one says you need some fat, etc etc etc.

So yeah we're REAL educated.

 

[nbcrusader]

We've been educating people for decades about food content and good nutrition.

I agree with AvsGirl41 - one key is exercise.

We are a sedentary society. We drive to place where we walked before. Kids don't play outside, the sit behind the computer.

The other factor is consumption. We eat because it is time to eat, not because we are hungry. We eat until the pain in our stomach surpasses the pleasure in our mouth.

And if we don't like what it does to us - too bad. We have drugs & surgery to fix it.

 

[verte76]

Two years ago, I was overweight and unhappy about it. I started reading stuff about nutrition and calories, and then started a diet. I took butter out of my diet, emphasized greens, I picked a favorite green, iceberg lettuce, and started eating this every day with just a few Greek olives thrown in to make it tasty. Yes, olives have calories, but if you're conservative about them this won't hurt. You'll have something very tasty with a low caloric content. You need to make sure whatever you pick to eat is tasty, otherwise you can't stick with it, and it won't be painful. You won't feel like you're giving anything up. Choose a form of exercise you really like. Walking appeals to alot of people, you don't have to use fancy gym equipment, although I like the local pool, where there's a heated bubble during the colder months so you can still swim. I've been doing this combination for two years, have lost 30 pounds, and couldn't be happier about this. I'm not the most disciplined person in the world, either. It's hard but certainly not impossible if you want to do it. You have to want it.

 

[U2Kitten]

People know what they are eating and if it is healthy or unhealthy.

Exactly, people DO KNOW what's healthy and what isn't (this goes for food, booze, cigs,sex, etc.) It's even kind of an insult to say otherwise. They make their own personal decisions regardless of what anyone says. I'm saying a multi billion dollar 'education' progam (like the war on drugs) DOES NOT work, kids even make fun of the commercials! It may work a little but not worth the money, so yes I think it's a waste of money.

Schools do need to improve lunches but there is always the option of bringing a lunch from home.

This is another point. They try to make the lunches healthier but you can't make the kids eat it (I know as a mother who has been a school volunteer at lunchtime) It all goes in the trash. Come on, you've been a little kid, how much does 'it's good for you' mean when you don't like the taste? Of course this gives on answers, but it is reality.

Also burger joints are going for healthier options offering milk instead of soda or apple slices instead of fries with kids' meals, but they don't sell, and even if the parents order it you can't force them to eat it.

Which brings me to the subject of forcing food on kids. My husband to this day will not touch green vegetables because his mother forced him to eat them when he didn't like or want them, and kept them hard and cold in the fridge until he finished them before he got another meal. My sister won't eat tomatoes because her kindergarten teacher forced her to drink her tomato juice. You can psychologically scare a kid of good food by forcing it on them.

Again I know this is no answer. But neither is big money in gov't programs. We can just hope everyone will eventually do the right thing for their own good.

 

[BVS]

Exactly, people DO KNOW what's healthy and what isn't (this goes for food, booze, cigs,sex, etc.) It's even kind of an insult to say otherwise. They make their own personal decisions regardless of what anyone says.