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Old 11-14-2001, 12:19 PM   #61
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double post

[This message has been edited by anitram (edited 11-14-2001).]
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Old 11-14-2001, 12:35 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally posted by adam's_mistress:

It's about as unfair as saying "If you're conservative, then you ought not listen to U2 because their beliefs coincide with yours"
Well, that was actually my point, so I think I do agree with you. But, and this is just a question, do you think sharing religious or political views with a band/song helps you understand it better? In a way I would say yes, because you understand better where the band/song is coming from. But it IS music, not theology or politics, and so (as Blue Room said) is supposed to be accessible and even open to different interpretations by diffrent people.
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Old 11-14-2001, 12:38 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally posted by anitram:
"I believe that it's a woman's right to choose. Absolutely"

1989. Mother Jones interview.

[This message has been edited by anitram (edited 11-14-2001).]
See now, that is very interesting to me. Thanks for posting that btw.

*tries hard not to start another debate*
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Old 11-14-2001, 01:14 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ody:
Well, that was actually my point, so I think I do agree with you. But, and this is just a question, do you think sharing religious or political views with a band/song helps you understand it better? In a way I would say yes, because you understand better where the band/song is coming from. But it IS music, not theology or politics, and so (as Blue Room said) is supposed to be accessible and even open to different interpretations by diffrent people.
Sure, sharing the same religious and/or political views as a band does help to better understand what they are trying to convey. But on the same token - if I were to walk blindly into a song not knowing what it was about and the song wounded up intriguing me - I would try to educate myself on what is being said so I could better understand what the song was trying to convey.

The same would go for any kind of art - literature, painting, architecture... The more you look at it, the more it intrigues and for me personally, the more it makes me want to learn about all aspects of something I find interesting. It's hard to be a jack of all trades and know everything there is about art but (it's damn near impossible especially since there is art in everything! ) One example: I took a trip a while ago to Canterbury Cathedral in England. I was awestruck not only by it's beauty, but the more I learned about it's history and all the work that went into building the cathedral, along with measures people were taking into preserving the architectural structure - it only made me love and understand the place more. The same could probably be said if I were to ever step foot into the Sistine Chapel, the Guggenheim museum, the Palace of Versailles... etc. etc. the list goes on.

Man, I really would love to travel more!

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Old 11-14-2001, 01:14 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2live:
Don't like conservative Republicans. Its like the Nazi party. Jerry Falwell and Bob Barr (makes you want to barf). If you want to have a lot of fun, go to the CNN chats and watch so many of them have absolutely no reply to intelligent questions.
This has to be the most poorly thought out and prejudiced post in this entire thread. To lump all conservatives with the likes of Jerry Falwell and Bob Barr is completely unfair and insulting. Jerry Falwell is a disgrace to conservatives the world over. Conservative isn't even the right term for him. Idiotic, intolerant and bigotted are more appropriate terms.

I won't even dignify your idiotic comparison of conservative Republicans to the Nazi party with a response.

(just FYI, but I consider myself a moderate republican at best)
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Old 11-14-2001, 01:20 PM   #66
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Isn't Congressman Bob Barr partly black?
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Old 11-14-2001, 01:36 PM   #67
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Personally I think the slamming of any party - be it conservative or liberal, is unconstructive and hits a little too close to personal insults as some people take their political views very seriously. Someone blasts conservatism and likens it to Nazism. Someone blasts liberals and casts them all as communists. It's done all the time here, and quite frankly, it's stupid because no matter what political views we share we're all individuals and suspect to happenstance which can in turn mold and shape who we are politically. There will always be shitty people *on both sides* that will give everyone a bad rap. The worst I've seen here in the past is people blaming bad or negligent parenting on where a person stands politically. Ludicrous, imo. There are many facets to the individual and they shouldn't be restricted to one particular political stance. Personally, I'm a liberal. I don't think I'm a better or worse mother than anyone else. I'm not a 'tree hugging hippie' who's out protesting the war. I'm not a war mongerer, and I'm not a leftist sympathizer. And I'm certainly not about to label all conservatives as facists. That's narrowminded and won't help me better understand where someone with opposing views is coming from!

The picture is much deeper than that but when you boil it down it's quite simple. One platform adheres to your own set of beliefs and standards more than the other. Why lower yourself by slamming another person's character based on their party affiliation?
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Old 11-14-2001, 04:10 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ody:
See now, that is very interesting to me. Thanks for posting that btw.

*tries hard not to start another debate*

You're welcome.

Does it surprise you? I actually found it to be quite "in character" for Bono to say this.
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Old 11-14-2001, 05:12 PM   #69
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Well,that does it for me. I now stand convinced that a Republican can not be a U2 fan, so I have to give up all my U2 CDs and paraphenalia. Too bad.
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Old 11-14-2001, 05:26 PM   #70
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80s, I'll be glad to take all your U2 merchandise off your hands.
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Old 11-14-2001, 11:01 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally posted by 80sU2isBest:
Well,that does it for me. I now stand convinced that a Republican can not be a U2 fan, so I have to give up all my U2 CDs and paraphenalia. Too bad.
Hahaha! lol, 80s.
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Old 11-15-2001, 02:54 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally posted by anitram:

You're welcome.

Does it surprise you? I actually found it to be quite "in character" for Bono to say this.
Well, yes and no. And this is where I don't want to start another debate, but I think that Bono's convictions about preserving life (anti-war, anti-death penalty, pro-environment) might outweigh other convictions. But then I thought that he probably doesn't see it the same way that I do, and so I am not so surprised.

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Old 11-15-2001, 04:21 PM   #73
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I honestly want to know if there is anyone here who started liking U2 for their political views?

I highly doubt it.

~rougerum
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Old 11-15-2001, 07:24 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally posted by rougerum:
I honestly want to know if there is anyone here who started liking U2 for their political views?

I highly doubt it.

~rougerum
Excellent point..
I think what arose everyones interest inc. the critics attn. was Bono's boldness,stage prescence,showmanship,and brillant song writing..

The rest are all footnotes..the speeches and rants..his passion is what enamours us all.

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Old 11-18-2001, 10:34 PM   #75
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U2's music can appeal to anyone because they're painting outside the box, they are presenting ideas that don't necessarily fit into any party's political agenda. They are issues that appeal to the heart, that the band feels strongly about. They are from Ireland, do you think the American liberal/conservative debate concerns them? I am glad to hear an outside perspective that ignores our sides. We can all groove to the tunes and forget about our differences. And find a way to work together!

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Old 11-19-2001, 09:59 PM   #76
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Hah.. If for me to have this Proverbial 'COMPASSION' that apparently no republicans have, I have to give HUGE amounts of the salary I will make when I get out of Dental School to Welfare for a Black woman, with Seven children, each by a different father, so she Can Feed her family Filet Mignon and Roasted Red Spuds EVery night... because as she says "My Man Ain't wort Sh#t, He out wit dem hoes evry night".. or the Temptations 'papa was a rolling stone lyrics..., Then Fire your arrows at me because I regret that I could never be considered 'compassionate'.. But honestly, if all welfare was abolished.. No more babydaddy's running around cuz girls don't sleep around.. because they would'nt have any $ if they did , all the rednecks around me in the trailer parks go out and get a job, and the american society climbs up a notch And it is sad but true, that to truly be compassionate, one must be firm, and to the naked and nonintrospective eye.. Assholeish and uncompassionate.. Whatever happened to Tough Love...
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Old 11-19-2001, 10:35 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lemonite:
Hah.. If for me to have this Proverbial 'COMPASSION' that apparently no republicans have, I have to give HUGE amounts of the salary I will make when I get out of Dental School to Welfare for a Black woman, with Seven children, each by a different father, so she Can Feed her family Filet Mignon and Roasted Red Spuds EVery night... because as she says "My Man Ain't wort Sh#t, He out wit dem hoes evry night".. or the Temptations 'papa was a rolling stone lyrics..., Then Fire your arrows at me because I regret that I could never be considered 'compassionate'.. But honestly, if all welfare was abolished.. No more babydaddy's running around cuz girls don't sleep around.. because they would'nt have any $ if they did , all the rednecks around me in the trailer parks go out and get a job, and the american society climbs up a notch And it is sad but true, that to truly be compassionate, one must be firm, and to the naked and nonintrospective eye.. Assholeish and uncompassionate.. Whatever happened to Tough Love...
Could you perhaps be a bit more histrionic and stereotypical? To hell with "compassionate." Let's start with "realistic," which this statement totally lacks.

"Tough love"? Perhaps society should be a little bit more abusive...err..."tough loving" to you.

Melon

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Old 11-19-2001, 11:51 PM   #78
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How can I be a conservative and still listen to U2?

1. the music grabbed me first, my first musical remembrances are of U2, I had no idea of their politics, though even if I had I wouldnít have cared back in kindergarten.

2. I read, listen, watch a majority of things that disagree with me on every front. Because I Can enjoy them on an artistic level.

3. Most important in terms of my views, I Try to take everything in. I want to learn and understand all he arguments. In the end the arguments will either topple what I believe or, as is more often the case, I will grow stronger in my response to them. I don't understand how anyone can have an intelligent argument without listening to the other side.

What are my favorite albums?

1. Achtung Baby- I played this almost everyday for three years

2. Zooropa- The same, I feel really connected to a lot of the feelings on these two albums

3. Unforgettable Fire- creates feelings no other music has for me.

4th would be POP, and then the rest, what can I Say, I like the experimental stuff.

-------

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Quote:
The problems within the Republican Party, I think, lie in trying to unite social conservatism with political conservatism
I completely agree. Iíve watched this movement for a long while. It undermines the republican party to say we are for limits to the government and at the same time people try to use the government to push morals. The republican party is very diverse, but unfortunately it seems the moral legislators have some sort of majority at the moment. But I stay in the party, because itís the only way to change things. And letís not forget he Democrat party has itís fair share of moral legislators too.
In all honesty the only real division I See between the two parties is in economics, and I think thatís a scary thing. As a Christian and a human I Moral legislators scare the hell out of me.

-----------------
As a final note, there is a real important thing I Think we should all remember here, with the exception of a few politicians and the usual bloodsuckers, both Conservatives and Liberals want what is best for people.

All this hatred being slung back and forth is idiotic. People treat their politics like it's their religion. The people on both sides of this issue want what is best and you can't change their minds by resorting to hysterics.

And that is why most of all I Can listen to U2. When I disagree with their views or a song, which isn't very often, I know that they are doing what they think is best to help the world.

It's possible to respect opinions and still disagree with them.



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Old 11-20-2001, 06:18 AM   #79
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What a great reply, Hermes. Serious and eloquent without getting riled up. Kudos!
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Old 11-20-2001, 09:33 AM   #80
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Ah melon, True.. my statements may be stereotypical at times, but honestly, how far is it from the truth... I mean, don't ask me.. Ask the creator of 'BABY BOY'.. That movie is a materialization of my statement.. And a slow and tougher.. let people work for themselves train of thought I guarantee will get people off their asses and working, it's not the lovey handout philosophy, but there are studies that give strong evidence in that regards.. but this is a u2 post, so i'll end with teh compassionate jargon, but if you knock me for saying a perhaps somewhat stereotypical statement though with a large amount of truth in it, then please hit up 'Like someone to blame' and knock him for his stereotypical statements calling conservatives 'monsters'.. for the only monsters i am aware of are Sully and Mike wazowski hiding in my closet...
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