GOP Nominee 2012 - Who Will It Be?, Pt. 3 - Page 17 - U2 Feedback

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Old 01-12-2012, 12:33 PM   #321
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The lasting legacies of the Bush years were cutting the riches' taxes and greatly increasing defense spending. So, I think the first two things to recovery are greatly decreasing defense spending and reinstating those taxes on the top bracket.
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Old 01-12-2012, 12:59 PM   #322
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The real solution would be to streamline the tax code, and remove the loopholes. Personally I'd favor going even further than that and implementing a flat tax, but I realize that's probably impossible at the moment.
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:02 PM   #323
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Oh, foreign aid. That's another thing I'd immediately streamline and cut.
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:16 PM   #324
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caleb8844
The real solution would be to streamline the tax code, and remove the loopholes. Personally I'd favor going even further than that and implementing a flat tax, but I realize that's probably impossible at the moment.
Flat taxes don't work, never will.

Be careful about removing loopholes, the tea party is very much against that therefore most of the GOP. Reagan was against them, a part of history conservatives often forget when revisioning him.
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:19 PM   #325
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I'd be completely okay with raising taxes, maybe even significantly for a period of time, IF it was accompanied by little to no NEW spending. Not even asking the government to cut anything immediately (eventually cuts are necessary, but I understand that cuts can't always be immediate), just asking them not to add to the current spending with new programs.


what programs would you cut?

foreign aid comprises a very, very small portion of the budget.

most (i believe, like, 3/4ths) of our spending is on the following: Social Security; Medicare; Medicaid; Defense.

which goes first?
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:24 PM   #326
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Originally Posted by BVS

Flat taxes don't work, never will.

Be careful about removing loopholes, the tea party is very much against that therefore most of the GOP. Reagan was against them, a part of history conservatives often forget when revisioning him.
Why don't you think flat taxes would work?

No one should be able to get around paying taxes. No one should be able to bribe the government to put new loopholes in that allow their multimillion dollar businesses to not pay taxes. Removing all loopholes gets rid of both of these problems.

Personally, in my perfect world, we'd have a 16-20 percent flat tax on EVERYONE, with no loopholes. But I realize that's probably not attainable.
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:26 PM   #327
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Originally Posted by Irvine511

what programs would you cut?

foreign aid comprises a very, very small portion of the budget.

most (i believe, like, 3/4ths) of our spending is on the following: Social Security; Medicare; Medicaid; Defense.

which goes first?
I wouldn't force immediate program cuts. As I said, I'd only end all NEW spending immediately. All old programs could remain as they were at first.

Eventually cuts would be necessary, though.

Defense is bloated as hell, that could use quite a bit of cuts and streamlining.

Social security is a sinking ship that needs to be streamlined and restructured.

The other two could probably be streamlined as well, but it's probably necessary to keep them mostly the same.
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:36 PM   #328
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Why don't you think flat taxes would work?
They will exasperate the differences of income equality.

Think about it in simple terms of buying power, one person has a 100 and the other a thousand dollars, taking out 20 from the hundred is felt much more than taking the 200 from a thousand.
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:41 PM   #329
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do you think raising taxes on the wealthiest Americans is a good way to start to tackle the debt?
Yes. If I had ANY faith that increasing taxes would go directly to paying down the debt, rather than more spending, I'd be for it. But I'm not stupid enough to think that would actually happen, at least not from the people running the show in both parties over the last decade.


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When is debt more important than the people?
But you can also make that argument with Iraq, can't you?- Yes, it cost a couple trillion, but Saddam has been replaced with elections and oppression replaced by freedom. You can't say "debt is fine as long as it's going to things that I deem appropriate." That's how we got in this mess.
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:43 PM   #330
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But you can also make that argument with Iraq, can't you?- Yes, it cost a couple trillion, but Saddam has been replaced with elections and oppression replaced by freedom. You can't say "debt is fine as long as it's going to things that I deem appropriate." That's how we got in this mess.
What kind of threat did Iraq have on my well being again?
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:44 PM   #331
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Basically the number one issue I have with the GOP is that their overall gameplan is to keep the middle class occupied by convincing it that it is at war with the impoverished lower class, and illegal immigrants. At the same time they continue to push for tax breaks for the upper tax classes who (smartly) take that money and squirrel it away in investments when the stock market has taken a beating.
That and the fact that they've stated their main goal is to make Obama a "one-term president". That doesn't really tell me anything about how they'll solve the problems they feel Obama's helped create.

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To democrats: do you all think as anything at all should be done about the skyrocketing debt?
Absolutely. You'll get no argument from me on that.

I would say this to any politician who's bitching about Social Security, calling it a "Ponzi scheme" and such, or complaining about Medicare/Medicaid...if you think it's that horrible, then I sure hope you aren't going to collect your Social Security when the time comes, or lean on the healthcare you're automatically given because you work in the government. Don't take that stuff if you find it so abhorrent and there might actually be something left for the rest of us, especially the younger generations!

Definitely agreed on cutting defense spending. Our focus should be more on improving intelligence gathering and small-scale military operations should we need them, and less on big, dramatic, overblown military setups. I keep hearing about all these fancy new weapons, these drones and planes and whatnot, and I think it's overall a pretty pointless use of our money.

No argument Social Security and Medicare/Medicaid could use some fixing up, too, but I'm not much of an expert on how to go about doing that, really. Only thing I can think of right now is that there's a hell of a lot of red tape related to Medicare/Medicaid that could be cut down. I understand they're trying to make sure that the people who genuinely need it get it and that we don't have people trying to scam off it or whatever, but seriously, by the time you get through the seemingly endless paperwork, it hasn't really helped you, you know, get better taken care of.
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:48 PM   #332
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What kind of threat did Iraq have on my well being again?
Do you care about human rights?
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:51 PM   #333
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What kind of threat did Iraq have on my well being again?
What kind of threat do poor people, sick people, and old people have on my well being again?
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:52 PM   #334
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But you can also make that argument with Iraq, can't you?- Yes, it cost a couple trillion, but Saddam has been replaced with elections and oppression replaced by freedom.

do you think the 100,000+ dead Iraqis agree?

i don't think anyone thinks Iraq was worth the cost in blood and treasure. it was over-promised, under-sold, and predicated on the manipulation of fear and outright lies.
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:53 PM   #335
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Do you care about human rights?

was that the argument put forth in 2002?
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Old 01-12-2012, 01:54 PM   #336
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What kind of threat do poor people, sick people, and old people have on my well being again?

what if not but for the grace of God there go i?

what if you were poor, sick, and/or old? should we kick you to the curb? are you being "envious" if you don't have, say, $1500 for a colonoscopy that could detect colon cancer early when it's treatable vs. waiting until you get really sick and then die, running up the bills as you receive treatment?
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Old 01-12-2012, 02:02 PM   #337
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what if not but for the grace of God there go i?

what if you were poor, sick, and/or old? should we kick you to the curb? are you being "envious" if you don't have, say, $1500 for a colonoscopy that could detect colon cancer early when it's treatable vs. waiting until you get really sick and then die, running up the bills as you receive treatment?
Exactly. What if I were a poor iraqi, living under the tyranny of Sadam Hussein ?

I was just trying to point out to bvs that some things ARE important, even if they don't affect us directly.
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Old 01-12-2012, 02:04 PM   #338
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Do you care about human rights?
That's cute...

If it was a human rights issue than treat it, approach it, and sell it as a human rights issue. Get unified support for it...
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Old 01-12-2012, 02:05 PM   #339
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Do you care about human rights?
Are human rights violations sufficient justification for invading foreign countries?
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Old 01-12-2012, 02:05 PM   #340
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Exactly. What if I were a poor iraqi, living under the tyranny of Sadam Hussein ?

what if i were a poor dead Iraqi? or what if i were a poor Iraqi who's family had been killed by insurgents?

what about the 4m people in Congo who have been killed since 2002? why don't we care about them? because they're black? because they don't have oil?

we can say that the end of Saddam Hussein is a good thing while also saying that the way in which we went about doing it was the worst possible thing we could have done.

Bush tried to force us into an "either/or" situation. it was always much more complicated than that.
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