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Old 10-10-2011, 11:42 PM   #221
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so, at this hate group meeting (The Value Voter's Summit) over the weekend, this happened:

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At this morning’s Values Voter Summit, the American Family Association’s (AFA) Bryan Fischer argued that the Republican nominee for president must embrace conservative Christianity, reject Islam, and treat gay people as intravenous drug users. “We need a president who will treat homosexuality not as a political cause at all, but as a threat to public health,” Fischer announced:

FISCHER: Homosexual behavior represents the same threat to human health that injection drug use does. I believe we need a president who understands that neither homosexual behavior nor injection drug use represent lifestyles that any responsible government ought to normalize, legitimize, legalize, protect, sanction, or subsidize.



and to his credit, Mitt Romney said this:

Quote:
Mitt Romney condemned the American Family Association’s chief spokesperson Bryan Fischer during his speech at the Values Voter summit this morning. “We should remember that decency and civility are values too,” Romney said, before adding, “one of the speakers who will follow me today has crossed that line I think”:

ROMNEY: Poisonous language doesn’t advance our cause. It has never softened a single heart or changed a single mind. The blessings of faith carry the responsibility of civil and respectful debate. The task before us is to focus on the conservative beliefs and the values that unite us. Let no agenda narrow our vision or drive us apart. We have important work to accomplish.

Watch it:



The People for the American Way has long chronicled Fischer’s hate speech against gays, Muslims and Mormons and challenged Romney’s decision to share the stage with him.

Update

Fischer fired back at Romney after the speech, telling ThinkProgress that it was “tasteless and tawdry” for Romney to attack him on stage. “I think he allowed the New York Times, the Southern Poverty Law Center, the People for the American Way…to dictate the content of his speech,” Fischer said. “Right there, people ought to be concerned about that.”

Watch it:

good for Romney. and now time to watch the Christian-ist thugs start to beat up on the Mormon kid. it's all Perry has left.

i think Mormonism is bonkers. but i think Southern Baptism is equally as bonkers. i'd happily let them bonkers it out alone. but in a situation like this, i'm going to stand up for the Mormon kid against the thugs and the bullies because there's space for all of us, no matter how crazy, so long as we don't hurt other people.

and because this is *real* religious bigotry. what is not real religious bigotry is thinking, "wherever gays are treated normally, Christians are discriminated against." no. what is real religious bigotry is when you bash others for being different from you, and for calling others a cult, which they may well be, but then you better answer that phone, kettle, because the pot is calling you to let you know you're black.
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Old 10-10-2011, 11:47 PM   #222
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and, behold, this is why they like Cain so much:

Herman Cain on foreign policy - YouTube

how can you argue with a man who's so honest? he's like, "hell no, i don't know who the fuck is the president of Uzbekistan, and why the fuck should i?"

he's ready for 2012. so instead of, "all of 'em, Katie." we're going to get, "none of 'em, Chris."
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Old 10-11-2011, 02:08 PM   #223
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no big* surprise here

Christie To Endorse Romney Ahead Of GOP Debate | Fox News

as I was driving to the office I tuned into Limbaugh, he was going on how the Republican establishment are all for Romney, and that they want it to be over soon.

Then he follow up with that in October 2007 Gallup had McCain in 3rd and said that he was done.

He then took a caller that pleaded with him to vet all the true conservative candidates, and for him to pick the best one, and then he could push that person,
the caller then went on to say that Bachmann was out of the picture.

Limbach asked her if there was still time left,
it seems like more and more, that Romney will be the candidate that is settled for.
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Old 10-11-2011, 02:17 PM   #224
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that Romney will be the candidate that is settled for.


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Old 10-11-2011, 06:11 PM   #225
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I agree with both of them. That was disgusting and I hate that crap-no place for it whatsoever.



New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie on Tuesday blasted Rick Perry for his refusal to distance himself from the pastor who questioned Mitt Romney’s Christian credentials.

“Any campaign that associates itself with that type of conduct is beneath the office of president of the United States,” Christie said as reporters questioned him following his endorsement of former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney.

Romney, appearing with Christie for the endorsement announcement, also attacked the Texas governor over the remarks of Pastor Robert Jeffress. The Baptist pastor introduced Perry at the weekend’s Voters Value Summit by saying that Romney, as a Mormon, is not Christian and is “part of a cult.”

“Gov. Perry selected an individual to introduce him who then used religion as a basis for which he would endorse Gov. Perry and a reason to not support me. Gov. Perry then said that introduction just hit it out of the park,” Romney said.

“I just don’t believe that that kind of divisiveness based upon religion has a place in this country,” Romney said
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Old 10-11-2011, 06:14 PM   #226
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If Perry doesn't publicly apologize to Romney and Huntsman tonight during the debate I will lose a great deal of respect for him.
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Old 10-11-2011, 07:53 PM   #227
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What time's the debate for tonight? Did I miss it?
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Old 10-11-2011, 08:56 PM   #228
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Started at 8ET and just ended. It was on BloombergTV, Bloomberg.com or Wapo.com

No major headlines. Romney won as usual, Gingrich was impressive, Perry was same as always. No flubs or sharp attacks from anyone.
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Old 10-11-2011, 09:13 PM   #229
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I have it on my dvr from Bloomberg, good for BET, broadcasting it.
Will try and watch it later.

I can't believe many people watched it, I guess the spinners will decide how this plays in the polls. Sounds like one more step towards a Romney nomination.
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Old 10-11-2011, 09:16 PM   #230
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Here is a sound bite

Quote:
Michele Bachmann says if you turn Herman Cain's "9-9-9" plan upside down it becomes 6-6-6. "I think the devil is in the details,"

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics...,1112472.story
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Old 10-11-2011, 09:43 PM   #231
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Romney is quickly convincing me. Perry was boring.

My favorite line was actually by Sen Santorum about the prosperity gap between the rich and poor. He correctly linked growing poverty with growing single heads of family.
"You can't have limited government. You can't have a wealthy society if the family breaks down."

The Peter G. Peterson Foundation ads with the children explaining the debt were outstanding.
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Old 10-11-2011, 09:45 PM   #232
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He correctly linked growing poverty with growing single heads of family.
"You can't have limited government. You can't have a wealthy society if the family breaks down."

i don't disagree. i don't think anyone disagrees.

the problem is that Rick seems to think this is my fault, and that tax cuts would help more than universal health care.
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Old 10-11-2011, 09:51 PM   #233
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i don't disagree. i don't think anyone disagrees.

the problem is that Rick seems to think this is my fault, and that tax cuts would help more than universal health care.
Universal health care doesn't meet his, or my, definition of limited government.
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Old 10-11-2011, 10:38 PM   #234
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Romney is quickly convincing me. Perry was boring.

My favorite line was actually by Sen Santorum about the prosperity gap between the rich and poor. He correctly linked growing poverty with growing single heads of family.
"You can't have limited government. You can't have a wealthy society if the family breaks down."

The Peter G. Peterson Foundation ads with the children explaining the debt were outstanding.
http://americanresearchgroup.com/

If Romney comes in a strong 2nd in SC, I'd say he has this thing sowed up.

The other early contests are all looking really good for him. The GOP primaries could end early.
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Old 10-11-2011, 10:40 PM   #235
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Universal health care doesn't meet his, or my, definition of limited government.

oh, i agree. it has to be done by government.

but you're cutting off your nose to spite your face. all you're doing is adhering to ideology when it runs counter to what you actually want, which is a wealthier, healthier society.

a single mom with two kids and no live-in father is going to have a vastly easier time taking care of her kids if she has health insurance rather than being one of the 50m who can't afford it, or has to work several jobs to afford it, or who lives in fear of going bankrupt because her kid has cancer.

so, really, being pro-limited government is actually being anti-family. families, especially poor ones, need help. and individual charity isn't nearly enough to address the problem. by all means, make government better, make it less wasteful, but don't tell me you actually care about families if you're against giving mothers and fathers their most basic needs.

just don't pretend you're pro-family when you're really for lower taxes on rich people, which the right likes to call "limited government."
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Old 10-12-2011, 08:30 AM   #236
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So did Rick Perry apologize?

Huffington Post

HANOVER, N.H. -- As the Occupy Wall Street protests have gathered steam and spread across the country, gaining popular support and an increase in media attention, Republican presidential candidates who were once hostile toward the movement have begun speaking more positively about it.

Herman Cain, who initially told Americans taking to the streets to protest income inequality and joblessness that they had no one to blame but themselves, later changed his tune, arguing that the protesters should instead blame the Obama administration for the high unemployment rate.

Former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney, who at first called the protests “dangerous” and “class warfare," sounded a different note Monday at a campaign stop in New Hampshire. “I worry about the 99 percent in America," he said, before adding later in the day: "I understand how those people feel."

And on Tuesday, during a meeting at a retirement center here in Hanover, former Utah Governor Jon Huntsman expressed a measure of support for the movement as well.

"I have to say, much of what they are talking about, some of what they are talking about I think many Americans would be in some harmony with -- and that is trillions of trillions of dollars that have been spent, they have disappeared and we have seen nothing for it," Huntsman said. "We have seen no uplift in terms of economic performance. We have seen no improvement in the unemployment rate."

Speaking to The Huffington Post after his talk, Huntsman expanded on the sentiment.

"There is angst, and there is anger, and there is frustration, in large measure because of the trillions that was spent to little effect," he said. "There is a lot out there that people on all ends of politics are very angry and concerned about."

Huntsman's words hardly qualify as a full-throated endorsement of Occupy Wall Street, like the one made by Republican presidential candidate and former Louisiana Governor Buddy Roemer, who traveled from New Hampshire to New York on Tuesday to speak with the protesters gathered in lower Manhattan. But they reflect one of the most basic truths of a political campaign -- that it is better to align oneself with an increasingly popular movement than to malign it.
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Old 10-12-2011, 09:27 AM   #237
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heh. pretty accurate, imho.

Quote:
One thing I've noticed about Perry is that he seems to be able to speak plausibly about Texas, and he turned national questions into Texas questions whenever possible. On one occasion, he seemed to dismiss "policy" as an important part of having an economic plan. The likely explanation for Perry's travails is that he simply never paid much attention to national politics before.

Mitt Romney hewed to his constant strategy of turning every question into an over-the-top attack on President Obama, while limiting his exposure to unpopular policy proposals. Romney's theory is that Republican primary voters are angry but uninformed and thus that the extreme conservatism they have displayed since 2009 reflects primal rage rather than any coherent worldview. He believes he can mollify them by satisfying their emotional animus toward Obama, while continuing to advocate policies that, in many cases, are identical to the president's.

Once again, Romney defended his Massachusetts health care plan by citing its reliance on private insurance, and the way it was designed to cover the uninsured without changing health care for the already-insured. This is exactly what Obama did, too. But, of course, by describing his plan in reasonable terms, Romney realizes that Republicans will conclude it must be different from the hated Obamacare, which is based on socialism and death panels. Romney's contempt for his electorate continues to endear me to him.

From an intellectual standpoint, the debate offered a few brief moments of inadvertent clarity. Newt Gingrich filleted Romney's proposal to eliminate capital gains taxes for people earning under $250,000 a year by noting that those people, by and large, don't have capital gains. Rick Santorum pointed out that social mobility is higher in Europe than in the United States. He presented this as an indictment of Obama, but of course it undercuts the conservative claim that "socialism" destroys social mobility.

Perry Survives the Craziness of the Seventh GOP Debate -- Daily Intel
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Old 10-12-2011, 11:48 AM   #238
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Romney's theory is that Republican primary voters are angry but uninformed and thus that the extreme conservatism they have displayed since 2009 reflects primal rage rather than any coherent worldview. He believes he can mollify them by satisfying their emotional animus toward Obama, while continuing to advocate policies that, in many cases, are identical to the president's.
Shhhhh, don't ruin it for them
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Old 10-12-2011, 04:31 PM   #239
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oh, i agree. it has to be done by government.

but you're cutting off your nose to spite your face. all you're doing is adhering to ideology when it runs counter to what you actually want, which is a wealthier, healthier society.

a single mom with two kids and no live-in father is going to have a vastly easier time taking care of her kids if she has health insurance rather than being one of the 50m who can't afford it, or has to work several jobs to afford it, or who lives in fear of going bankrupt because her kid has cancer.

so, really, being pro-limited government is actually being anti-family. families, especially poor ones, need help. and individual charity isn't nearly enough to address the problem. by all means, make government better, make it less wasteful, but don't tell me you actually care about families if you're against giving mothers and fathers their most basic needs.

just don't pretend you're pro-family when you're really for lower taxes on rich people, which the right likes to call "limited government."
Again, what conservatives point to is that when the family breaks down a paternalistic government must step in to provide, not only health care, but food, housing, daycare, and welfare. And of course we already have a provided retirement and the Occupy crowd now demands a free college education as well.

A paternalistic government is not a limited government.

No one proposes abandoning the poor but can we please stop government policies and programs that exacerbate the problem?
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Old 10-12-2011, 04:54 PM   #240
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Again, what conservatives point to is that when the family breaks down a paternalistic government must step in to provide, not only health care, but food, housing, daycare, and welfare. And of course we already have a provided retirement and the Occupy crowd now demands a free college education as well.

A paternalistic government is not a limited government.

No one proposes abandoning the poor but can we please stop government policies and programs that exacerbate the problem?
I would love to have less family breakdowns.

What's that, you want abstinence-only sex ed? Oh well, guess we'll be having more single moms after all.

Oh, and maybe we could nip a few of those single-parent situations in the bud with a morning after pill or first-term abortion care? No?



Guess you get your single-parent and broken homes

Strong morals and strong fathers are definitely lacking, but that doesn't mean turning your back on everything else, does it?
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