diamond
ONE love, blood, life
agreed, supasta.
dbs
dbs
Irvine511 said:
some people desperately need the devil to exist.
nathan1977 said:But the greatest trick the devil pulled....
melon said:
...was convincing people that he was more powerful than what he really is. There's certainly been an awful lot of people killed, in the name of God, by people trying to "rid the world of Satan."
nathan1977 said:
And some people desperately wish he didn't.
But the greatest trick the devil pulled....
Irvine511 said:
show me the money.
diamond said:
Irvine,
Here go.
http://www.churchofsatan.com/home.html
Don't spend too much time there, I don't want to have to go fish you out.
dbs
The beliefs, practices and rituals of the Church of Satan have few, if any, points of similarity with the Christian or Muslim concept of Satan. The CoS' Satan is pre-Christian, and derived from the Pagan image of power, virility, sexuality and sensuality. Satan is viewed as a force of nature, not a living quasi-deity. Their Satan has nothing to do with Hell, demons, pitchforks, sadistic torture, demonic possession, and profound evil. There are references in LaVey' writings to having conducted a few Black Masses for publicity purposes, in which the Roman Catholic Mass was ridiculed. But, it is unknown whether these references were satirical or reflected actual rituals. Assuming that the black masses were fictional, all of their rituals have no connection to those of Christianity or of any other religion.
Some of their beliefs and practices are:
They do not worship a living deity.
Major emphasis is placed on the power and authority of the individual Satanist, rather than on a god or goddess.
They believe that "no redeemer liveth" - that each person is their own redeemer, fully responsible for the direction of their own life.
"Satanism respects and exalts life. Children and animals are the purest expressions of that life force, and as such are held sacred and precious..."
VintagePunk said:
diamond said:
Actually here are their tenets and they sound pretty secular to most Christians.
The Nine Satanic Statements
from The Satanic Bible, ©1969
by Anton Szandor LaVey
[français]
1. Satan represents indulgence instead of abstinence!
2. Satan represents vital existence instead of spiritual pipe dreams!
3. Satan represents undefiled wisdom instead of hypocritical self-deceit!
4. Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it instead of love wasted on ingrates!
5. Satan represents vengeance instead of turning the other cheek!
6. Satan represents responsibility to the responsible instead of concern for psychic vampires!
7. Satan represents man as just another animal, sometimes better, more often worse than those that walk on all-fours, who, because of his “divine spiritual and intellectual development,” has become the most vicious animal of all!
8. Satan represents all of the so-called sins, as they all lead to physical, mental, or emotional gratification!
9. Satan has been the best friend the Church has ever had, as He has kept it in business all these years!
diamond said:
Actually here are their tenets and they sound pretty secular to most Christians.
The Nine Satanic Statements
from The Satanic Bible, ©1969
by Anton Szandor LaVey
[français]
1. Satan represents indulgence instead of abstinence!
2. Satan represents vital existence instead of spiritual pipe dreams!
3. Satan represents undefiled wisdom instead of hypocritical self-deceit!
4. Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it instead of love wasted on ingrates!
5. Satan represents vengeance instead of turning the other cheek!
6. Satan represents responsibility to the responsible instead of concern for psychic vampires!
7. Satan represents man as just another animal, sometimes better, more often worse than those that walk on all-fours, who, because of his “divine spiritual and intellectual development,” has become the most vicious animal of all!
8. Satan represents all of the so-called sins, as they all lead to physical, mental, or emotional gratification!
9. Satan has been the best friend the Church has ever had, as He has kept it in business all these years!
TranceEnding said:
I have no real interest or attraction to the ideals of the Church of Satan, but does anyone think these beliefs are necessarily evil ??
self-indulgent hedonists..
VintagePunk said:
But my point, the relevant one, is that they by no means agree with your representation of satan, nor do they worship him, or feel it's possible for satan to "possess" someone.
TranceEnding said:
I have no real interest or attraction to the ideals of the Church of Satan, but does anyone think these beliefs are necessarily evil ??
diamond said:
I would say these are Satatnist attributes, and not helping the less fornunate, vengence not turning the other cheek.
I wouldn't say ppl of this ilk are completely "harmless".
Possession is a whole different topic of Satan tenets and beliefs.
We were talking about if Satan really existed or not, and many ppl in this thread claim he doesn't. I think a worshipping Satanist would beg to differ.
dbs
TranceEnding said:I just find this kind of topic confusing (but interesting ) I think it may be too complicated to simply slap on a good or evil label on anything
I don't really believe in the Devil/Satan as a spiritual entity and find it hard to believe that people can be 'possessed' ... however, I just thought that when people are filled with the holy spirit, or in a 'rapture' ... maybe this is a polar opposite to some sort of demonic possession?
Just rambling
Irvine511 said:if you want to give a name to the darker, more indulgent (for lack of a better word) side of human nature, and then call that Satan, by all means, go ahead.
likewise, if you want to call the belief that there is something more to existence than flesh, and call that God, by all means, go ahead.
VintagePunk said:
1) Not helping the less fortunate does not equal harming them.
2) Sounds kinda like "an eye for an eye.."
Diamond, Diamond. Sigh. Did you not read what I quoted before? Here it is again:
The CoS' Satan is pre-Christian, and derived from the Pagan image of power, virility, sexuality and sensuality. Satan is viewed as a force of nature, not a living quasi-deity. Their Satan has nothing to do with Hell, demons, pitchforks, sadistic torture, demonic possession, and profound evil.
I'm saying that to them, he doesn't exist in the way that many Christians believe, and it certainly doesn't sound like they feel he's all powerful, or has the ability to take possession of a human.
diamond said:
I think Satan probably is brilliant entity, he would have to be, based on his powers, *only* if you invite him.
diamond said:
I think it matters from what paradigm a person is dealing from.
Yes Satan has been around since the beginning of time and his attributes that are earthbound:
lust
power
control
etc
I think Satan probably is brilliant entity, he would have to be, based on his powers, *only* if you invite him.
I'm not absolutely sure of his exact nature or make up, nor do I want to be since I have no desire to meet the fellow.
Also I don't think worshipping Satnists have an exact idea of his nature, perhaps some do, but it is not my worry.
dbs
diamond said:I think the scripture is clear that you can't serve 2 masters.
dbs
BonoVoxSupastar said:
Not what I asked.
The question was what if you don't invite either one of them? You mentioned the word 'invite' it's a word that religion uses all the time. In order to be saved, you have to invite God, but you also mention that you have to invite Satan...
So what if you don't invite either
diamond said:
One will eventually havde to make up thir mind who they'll choose.
diamond said:You have the free will to choose not to know anybody, or do anything I suppose, but this isn't why God gave us life or His plan of happiness..
Also, not interacting with ppl, it doesn't seem like much of an existence though; kind of like being in solitary confinement and if I remember correctly God has encouraged us not to be idle.
I think it's part of God'd plan of happiness that we share our talents and interact with our brothers and sisters (neighbors), for us to learn some things from them, the gifts and talents that they have and we are to share our gifts and talents. I think were suppose to love our neighbors too.
Think about it, Bono could of chose to stay home that day Larry posted the invitation on the school bulletin board, and not exercised his talent(s) or suspected talents and U2 could of never been, and we would have never met here BVS.
How about that? Things happen for a reason.
Because Bono used his free will, he loved life, loved his neighbors (school mates) and used his talents and chose to share them- look what it accomplished.
dbs
BonoVoxSupastar said:
That was an analogy. I guess I should have expanded on that. I'm not saying the person is a shut in. I'm saying someone can live a life with friends and family and not ever invite satan or God into their life.
You said one will HAVE to eventually choose, and I'm questioning that, if according to you both have to be invited, well then theoretically someone can live a life without inviting either one...