Circumcision, on a grand scale? Or plucking out thine eye that offends

[80sU2isBest]

Some of you guys and gals are on a witch hunt, and the targets are conservative Christians.

Nowhere in this article does it state that Christians or conservatives were involved in any of this.

"county officials this week ordered a small section near Malibu lopped off"

The ones who ordered the change were County Officials. Does it say "Conservative Christian County Officials"? No.

And the ones who noticed it in the first place? They were just "a handful of passers-by"; no political or religious affiliation is even mentioned.

"But earlier this week, before the exhibit's official opening, a handful of passers-by working at the fairgrounds suggested that the wooden map looked a little too male."

You cannot assume that these people are conservative Christians. You can't assume political/religious affiliation in any way just from teh facts delivered in the story. In fact, if you diod assume something, you'd have to assume that the majority of the "passers-by" were not conservatives but rather liberals, based strictly on the political breakdown percentage of California voters.

 

[deep]

80s,

CA has more Conservative Christians than most any other state.

In fact, if you did assume something, you'd have to assume that the majority of the "passers-by" were not conservatives but rather liberals, based strictly on the political breakdown percentage of California voters.

so assume that.
remenber it was only " a handful of passers-by working at the fairgrounds suggested that the wooden map looked a little too male."


Would you also say that the "Intelligent Design" crowd are not the religiously -right if an article does not lable them that way?

 

[80sU2isBest]

80s,

CA has more Conservative Christians than most any other state.
the religiously -right if an article does not lable them that way?

I would think so - there are more people living in California, period.

But are there more Conservative Christians in California or non-conservative non Christians?

If there's more non, then my assumption works a whole lot better than ya'lls does.

remenber it was only " a handful of passers-by working at the fairgrounds suggested that the wooden map looked a little too male."

Would you also say that the "Intelligent Design" crowd are not the religiously -right if an article does not lable them that way?

No, of course not, because almost every intelligent designer is a Christian and all of them believe in God. However, there is no study or source that leads to the conclusion that conservative Christians "see sex" in more things than non conservative non Christians. In fact, I think it's the exact opposite.

 

[deep]

conservative Christians "see sex" in more things than non conservative non Christians. In fact, I think it's the exact opposite.

non conservative non Christians see sex in real naked bodies and real sexual images they are comfortable viewing

they do not need to worry about partial breast exposure (during nursing) in public

or Janet Jackson half-time nip-outs

or Bono's choice of adjectives

or what the outline of a map might suggest.

 

[XHendrix24]

Just to point out, this article has nothing at all to do with conservative Christianity (assuming that's what you were alluding to with the "pure of thought" reference). The decision to alter the geography was the government's, not some fundamentalist Christian group's.

Though, I know how much some of you would love to blame conservative Christianity for all of the ailments of modern society.

Originally posted by 80sU2isBest


Some of you guys and gals are on a witch hunt, and the targets are conservative Christians.

Nowhere in this article does it state that Christians or conservatives were involved in any of this.

"county officials this week ordered a small section near Malibu lopped off"

The ones who ordered the change were County Officials. Does it say "Conservative Christian County Officials"? No.

And the ones who noticed it in the first place? They were just "a handful of passers-by"; no political or religious affiliation is even mentioned.

"But earlier this week, before the exhibit's official opening, a handful of passers-by working at the fairgrounds suggested that the wooden map looked a little too male."

You cannot assume that these people are conservative Christians. You can't assume political/religious affiliation in any way just from teh facts delivered in the story. In fact, if you diod assume something, you'd have to assume that the majority of the "passers-by" were not conservatives but rather liberals, based strictly on the political breakdown percentage of California voters.

Some of these people need to get the idea through their heads that they can't blame everything on conservative Christianity. It really gets ridiculous sometimes.

 

[Irvine511]

Some of these people need to get the idea through their heads that they can't blame everything on conservative Christianity. It really gets ridiculous sometimes.

as ridiculous as seeing a penis on a map of LA.

was it an assumption? aboslutely.

an unreasonable assumption? not by a long shot.

but many people on this list do strongly feel that much of what is wrong with the US right now, especially in the political system, can be traced directly to the Republican Party's debt to "conservative Christianity" -- a debatable term, Lord knows -- and their political responsibility to certain groups of people. you know, the people who see penises on maps of Malibu are more than likely the same people who think SpongeBob and TinkyWinky are gay.

and i still think the whole thing is funny, so i'm going to continue to laugh.

 

[indra]

You can bet your (insert body part here *) that the "handful" of passersby weren't liberals of any stripe -- christian, agnostic, atheist, or other religion. Whether or not they were Christians, they certainly were conservative, because no one else would really give a crap.

A bit off the immediate topic, but still kinda fits.... I've always thought that "moral crusader" is a great job for a pervert. You get to see/hear all the dirty movies, art exhibits, magazines, maps ( ), plays, music, etc., etc. -- and yet, because after you see/hear it you pronounce it unfit for all others, you get to keep your "pillar of the community" status. Pure genius!

* yes, that pun was intended

 

[BluRmGrl]

Let me just point out that I did not directly accuse ANY particular group. I used the phrase "those supposedly "pure in thought" ', because - honestly - if it was just another run-of-the-mill lost soul who'd noticed the phallic similarity, do you really think they'd be complaining? More likely, they'd tell all their lost soul friends who'd in turn would be making a beeline down to the County Fair Penis to have their picture taken with it!!

I mean, what's next? A drape for the Washington Monument? Modesty screens for those vulgar desert cacti? Special zoning laws to prevent cucumber growers from planting too close to schools and churches?

This is a 3D map at a County Fair meant to remind Fair attendees of the topography of their area - not a live display over in the Animal Husbandry section of the dream within a dream that is Man/Goat Love.

THAT would certainly qualify as vulgar, immoral, and I'm pretty sure, sinful and I doubt you'd get much resistance if you shut that one down.

 

[XHendrix24]

Fair enough, everyone.

And yes, it's definitely funny.

 

[BluRmGrl]

And it's too late to edit my prior statement, but please substitute
"State Fair" for every occurence of "County Fair".

 

[Lemonfix]

Did these said passers-by actually complain about the shape of the map? Or did they just make comments like "hey, you know what this map kind of looks like, heh heh heh" There is always the off chance that the city officials changed the map to keep people from snickering, making jokes, and distractin from the real function of the map.

 

[BVS]

Maybe we should reshape lake Michigan and Florida to not entice anyone...

 

[indra]

Maybe we should reshape lake Michigan and Florida to not entice anyone...

What was that God guy thinking when he made those places?

God, the pornographer!

 

[BVS]

What was that God guy thinking when he made those places?

God, the pornographer!

Well he did make sex in the first place...

 

[indra]

Well he did make sex in the first place...

He did? ...and to think all this time I believed Steve Kilbey when he said he invented sex.... Now all my illusions are shattered.


(obviously SK is a cocky little bastard. )

 

[nbcrusader]

Some things never change....

There are always a small group of people who complain.

There are always government officials who never think, only react to complaints.

And FYM threads find a way to debate the evils of conservative Christians.

 

[Rono]

A smaller USA for the small minded.

 

[Irvine511]

And FYM threads find a way to debate the evils of conservative Christians.

considering how much media attention "conservative Christians" demand and occupy, and considering the entitlement many of these groups (Focus on the Family, Concerned Women for America) feel to push their social agendas into law via the Bush white house, and considering we've had a "conservative Christian" Attorney General who requested that bare breasted statues (!!!) be covered up, is it really a surprise when a thread about vocalized prudery finds its way back to these vocal minority elements?

 

[nbcrusader]

considering how much media attention "conservative Christians" demand and occupy, and considering the entitlement many of these groups (Focus on the Family, Concerned Women for America) feel to push their social agendas into law via the Bush white house, and considering we've had a "conservative Christian" Attorney General who requested that bare breasted statues (!!!) be covered up, is it really a surprise when a thread about vocalized prudery finds its way back to these vocal minority elements?

I wonder what media sources you observe. I hear more about Focus on the Family, et. al. here in FYM than anywhere else.

 

[Irvine511]

I wonder what media sources you observe. I hear more about Focus on the Family, et. al. here in FYM than anywhere else.

depends.

online: slate, salon, various bloggers from DailyKos to Andrew Sullivan to some of the people at TownHall.com, Drudge, Wonkette,

newspapers: (usually done online) NYT, LAT, WaPo, The Guardian, Sydney Morning Herald

radio: NPR, some AM straight-up news, used to listen to Rush

TV: CNN, MSNBC, Daily Show, Sunday morning talkshows, am not usually home early enough to get the Big 3 network news.

all of these sources use the terms "conservative Christian groups" or "the religious right" and the assumption that this is a political term as understood and coherent in regular discourse as any other term used to describe any other group, be it "gay activists" or "hard-line Israelis" or "islamist terrorists" or "economic conservatives." while all labels are by definition incomplete, most educated listeners know this and understand that these are groupings made for the sake of both political discourse as well as political expediency.

 

[deep]

I hear more about Focus on the Family, et. al. here in FYM than anywhere else.

really

they are a driving fource in the GOP

if you disagree with them
you are out of the mainstream in the GOP

Thousands Fill Church for 'Justice Sunday'

By BETH RUCKER, Associated Press WriterSun Aug 14, 9:19 PM ET

America's most powerful judges are "unelected, unaccountable and arrogant," Focus on the Family founder James Dobson told the thousands of people who packed a Nashville church for "Justice Sunday II," a rally televised for broadcast to churches across the country.

The goal of the rally was to educate evangelical Christians about the U.S. Supreme Court and get them talking to friends and elected officials about what they want from the justices, said organizer Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council.

Many of the speeches targeted the Supreme Court's power and what the writers of the Constitution intended the justices' role to be.

"All wisdom does not reside in nine persons in black robes," House Majority Leader Tom DeLay told the crowd. "The Constitution is clear on the point that the power to make laws is vested on Congress."

The president of The Catholic League, Bill Donahue, suggested a constitutional amendment to say that "unless a judicial vote is unanimous, you cannot overturn a law created by Congress."

The court is trying to "take the hearts and souls of our culture," he said.

Dobson evoked the framers of the Constitution, saying: "These activist, unelected judges believe they know better than the American people about the direction the country should go. The framers of our great nation did not intend for the courts to have absolute and final power over us."

Protesters were also vocal Sunday, both outside Two Rivers Baptist Church, where the rally was held, and across town, where a group of religious leaders held a separate event to counter what they saw as an extremist message.

"This is so Americans can see the 'Justice Sunday' sponsors and Tom DeLay don't have any exclusive hold on religion," said Glenn Smith, an organizer of "Community of Faith and Unity Gathering."

Rita Nakashima Brock, founder of Faith Voices for the Common Good, said "Justice Sunday II" was calling for a theocracy instead of democracy.

"Those people meeting with Tom DeLay, Chuck Colson and Jim Dobson think they own the Bible and that God speaks only to them," Brock said.

The first "Justice Sunday" event, held in April at a church in Louisville, Ky., had been aimed at stopping a potential filibuster of several nominees for the federal bench.

One of the speakers at that event, Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, had threatened to try to change Senate rules to prevent certain filibusters if Democrats persisted, a move applauded by the rally organizers. Weeks later, 14 Senate Republicans and Democrats forged a compromise. Some conservatives accused Frist of allowing it to happen.

"There will be repercussions," Perkins said at the time.

Frist, a surgeon, wasn't invited to address "Justice Sunday II" because he angered the events' organizers by voicing his support for expanded human embryonic stem cell research.

At the rally Sunday, Mike Miller, 54, of Gallatin echoed many of the speakers comments on judicial power, saying he believes Supreme Court justices try to create laws with their rulings instead of interpreting the Constitution.

"Activist justices — we're trying to find out what we can do to stop that activity," he said. "Our laws are based on the Ten Commandments."

 

[Irvine511]

"Activist justices — we're trying to find out what we can do to stop that activity," he said. "Our laws are based on the Ten Commandments."


quick question: other than thou shall not steal and murder, none of the other commandments are laws.

what gives?

 

[deep]

and breaking others is mandatory
if you want America to succeed

 

[indra]

"Activist justices — we're trying to find out what we can do to stop that activity," he said. "Our laws are based on the Ten Commandments."


quick question: other than thou shall not steal and murder, none of the other commandments are laws.

what gives?

He either can't read or can't count.

The pitiful thing is that many people who heard or read that comment will believe it's actually true.

 

[Moonlit_Angel]

Not to mention, again, this country isn't just made up of Christians. Why should we go with their religion's rules? Other religions have their own little set of rules, too, why aren't we considering those for our basis in lawmaking? Would this "Justice Sunday" group of people be okay with another religion forcing their laws on them? If not, then why do they think they can do that to non-Christians?

Anywho, James Dobson is the same guy who, in that other thread, was talking about how to tell if your child was gay and how to "change" that and make them fit into stereotypical gender roles and stuff like that, and that alone pretty much takes away any chance of something credible coming from his mouth. He's an idiot, in my humble opinion.

I would also like to state, too, that I am fully aware that it isn't just conservative Christians who cause these sorts of outcries about body parts and "offensive" artwork and things along that line in public. I don't care who it is that's doing that sort of outcry, I'm gonna disagree with them. But that's a whole other hornet's nest of a topic.

Angela

 

[nbcrusader]

Was Dobson even involved in this matter?

 

[indra]

Was Dobson even involved in this matter?

I'm pretty sure her comment about Dobson was in regard to the "Justice Sunday" crapola.

 

[deep]

Was Dobson even involved in this matter?

i only responded to your "focus on the family" remark

 

[Angela Harlem]

Some things never change....

There are always a small group of people who complain.

There are always government officials who never think, only react to complaints.

And FYM threads find a way to debate the evils of conservative Christians.

Does that concern you at all, that your religion is looked upon as bad for the reasons it is (in FYM or other)? Or do you feel that is is misunderstood and there is no basis at all for the shitting upon it receives?

If it does bother you, why. Remember back to your own days of denouncing this very institution and ask if perhaps there is cause.

If you feel there is no basis at all, how can that be? In other words, how can the honestly felt gripes of many be grandly written off as irrational or based on nonunderstanding?

 

[Angela Harlem]

Seeing as this came up twice by nbc, I'd really like to know, if you wouldn't mind answering.