Bridge collapse in Minneapolis

[LarryMullen's POPAngel]

No what's politics is trying to turn every single bad frickin' thing that happens in the world onto one person because you have a personal problem against with him.

As some of you may or may not know, that bridge was slated to be repaired or replaced. You can just go tearing them down whenever. You also in the state of MN can only work on infrastructure about 5 months out of the year.

So figure out what you're talking about before you start talking for a change.

Did either phil or myself mention this "single person" by name?

This would be an issue no matter who was president at this time.

 

[ntalwar]

No, the joke is that your statement implies that someone with budgetary control has actually said "Dang, if it weren't for that damn war, we'd have enough money to repair them bridges."

68 billion to do them all in a what, 3 trillion dollar budget? We can afford both if we wanted to.

Lets just not go crazy on this huh?

We can't afford everything - priorities need to be set.

Why is it that when money is needed for Iraq, Bush does not hesitate, but when money was needed for domestic needs like food safety, health care, and education the money is not there? Bush actually trimmed domestic spending recently in his proposed budget.

 

[redhotswami]

68 billion to do them all in a what, 3 trillion dollar budget? We can afford both if we wanted to.

then I guess the answer is we don't want to. the gulf coast doesn't look like much improvement has been made in the past 2 years. the ninth ward is a ghost town. and these are people's HOMES.

yeah that bridge was slated to be replaced...in 2020! obviously something went wrong but we don't know what yet. and i WILL hold this fed. gov't accountable for the rebuilding efforts. Fix Everything My Ass.

 

[phillyfan26]

So figure out what you're talking about before you start talking for a change.

As for the rest of your post, the bottom line is, as the secretary of transportation said, infrastructure isn't getting the funding it needs.

 

[randhail]

Funding for road building and repair is also being squeezed by the shrinking Highway Trust Fund, which gets most of its revenues from a federal tax on gasoline and diesel fuel. When first established in 1956, the 3-cent-a-gallon tax represented about 10 percent of the cost of a gallon of gasoline.

The current tax, which hasn’t been raised since 1993, is 18.4 cents a gallon, about 6 percent of the pump price. Two years ago, Congress proposed raising the tax by 4 cents a gallon, but the measure died when the White House threatened to veto any highway spending bill that included a tax increase.

The White House certainly is not doing much to fix the problems with the aging infrastructure.

 

[phillyfan26]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/08/02/bridge.infrastructure/index.html

Experts said Thursday that the problem stems from a lack of money and leadership.

...

But Stidger said states aren't getting the money they need to repair their roads and bridges. They're forced to resort to a process of "patch, patch, patch and nothing ever gets repaired," she said.

 

[Snowlock]

Snowlock, the idea that we can afford both is so 2003.

Dear lord.

 

[phillyfan26]

Dear lord.

What a coincidence. That's what I say when I read blindly conservative posts!

 

[LarryMullen's POPAngel]

What a coincidence. That's what I say when I read blindly conservative posts!

phillyfan FTW!

 

[Snowlock]

As for the rest of your post, the bottom line is, as the secretary of transportation said, infrastructure isn't getting the funding it needs.

As I'm sure the secretary of every organization will say especially after a tragedy when people are looking for people to blame; especially if it makes for an easy jab people you're not ideologically aligned with.

But here's a funny thing; in Minnesota we just passed a MASSIVE infrastructure bill.

You're forcing me to either insult your intelligence or your integrity - you're intelligence because you don't know what the heck you're talking about, or your integrity because you're trying to subvert a tragedy into a bunch of indeological or political partisan non-sense.

The bridge fell (4th in 75 years); shit happens. Don't cheapen the deaths of the victims or the courage of the rescuers by trying to turn this into yet another retread anti-bush thread. Don't be part of an ignorant mob that's going to want to crucify some paper pusher just for doing his job.

Conservative, ha. You have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[phillyfan26]

As I'm sure the secretary of every organization will say especially after a tragedy when people are looking for people to blame; especially if it makes for an easy jab people you're not ideologically aligned with.

But here's a funny thing; in Minnesota we just passed a MASSIVE infrastructure bill.

You're forcing me to either insult your intelligence or your integrity - you're intelligence because you don't know what the heck you're talking about, or your integrity because you're trying to subvert a tragedy into a bunch of indeological or political partisan non-sense.

The bridge fell (4th in 75 years); shit happens. Don't cheapen the deaths of the victims or the courage of the rescuers by trying to turn this into yet another retread anti-bush thread. Don't be part of an ignorant mob that's going to want to crucify some paper pusher just for doing his job.

Conservative, ha. You have no idea what you're talking about.

Well, I don't know if you are conservative, but that IS what I say when some of our other conservative buddies write some of the things they do.

But, how can you just brush it off as "shit happens?" That's much more insulting than any anti-Bush argument.

This isn't a partisan issue. This is a safety issue. The government as a whole has failed us. No one, until now, has made a big deal of the issue. But it's been an issue. You seem to equate them making a big deal to be an insult to their memory? It's a wake up call. This has been a problem. It's going to continue to be until we fix this. And it's much more difficult (and if you deny this, I don't know really what to say to that) with a war going on that, many, many people agree is unnecessary.

 

[Snowlock]

Well, I don't know if you are conservative, but that IS what I say when some of our other conservative buddies write some of the things they do.

But, how can you just brush it off as "shit happens?" That's much more insulting than any anti-Bush argument.

This isn't a partisan issue. This is a safety issue. The government as a whole has failed us. No one, until now, has made a big deal of the issue. But it's been an issue. You seem to equate them making a big deal to be an insult to their memory? It's a wake up call. This has been a problem. It's going to continue to be until we fix this. And it's much more difficult (and if you deny this, I don't know really what to say to that) with a war going on that, many, many people agree is unnecessary.

No, I don't cheapen the deaths of those that died. They died. That's what, matters not how. The how would matter if this were some terrible chronic problem. It's not. And while yes it's a safety issue, it's not near the safety issue the mob is going to make it out to be. As I said, it's been 4 bridge collapses in 75 years. Given the amount of people who have crossed every bridge in america over 75 years, do you realize how safe our bridges actually are? Try and calculate that.

As to the dear lord, that's what happens when someone enters a debate talking like Paris Hilton. Has nothing at all to do with a conservative or a republican. I've gone "on record" saying many times that I'm no Bush supporter. And just for the record:

ftw

dear lord.

 

[Snowlock]

Oh, and trying in some way to tie in the deaths of these people to your own dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq is rediculous. You may as well say if it weren't for the space program, we'd be able to build those bridges. That particular argument was made before and it was stupid then too.

(tyring to fix my double post)

And plus Philly, you still haven't acknowledged:

1. It was scheduled to be fixed
2. You can't just fix a bridge whenever you want
3. We only have 5 months here to fix a bridge
4. MN last year passed a massive infrastructure bill

So what are you trying to say here other than that you don't like George Bush? Don't try and hide behind the "safety issue" it wasn't an issue for the reasons above.

 

[phillyfan26]

No, I don't cheapen the deaths of those that died. They died. That's what, matters not how. The how would matter if this were some terrible chronic problem. It's not. And while yes it's a safety issue, it's not near the safety issue the mob is going to make it out to be. As I said, it's been 4 bridge collapses in 75 years. Given the amount of people who have crossed every bridge in america over 75 years, do you realize how safe our bridges actually are? Try and calculate that.

As to the dear lord, that's what happens when someone enters a debate talking like Paris Hilton. Has nothing at all to do with a conservative or a republican. I've gone "on record" saying many times that I'm no Bush supporter. And just for the record:

dear lord.

All the bridges are getting older. Very few are getting proper replacement. More people are driving cars then ever. How many of the bridges in this country were rated the same as this one? 25% or something? It's a problem that's going to grow if we don't fix it now. We have a good track record. Sure. But the bridges wear down. I mean 25% of this country's bridges were exactly the same as far as we know! That's a bit unsettling.

And for the dear Lord, I think her joking statement flew right over your head.

 

[phillyfan26]

Oh, and trying in some way to tie in the deaths of these people to your own dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq is rediculous. You may as well say if it weren't for the space program, we'd be able to build those bridges. That particular argument was made before and it was stupid then too.

(tyring to fix my double post)

I'm not blaming the War for all our problems, but to deny it's a factor is ridiculous as well.

 

[Snowlock]

All the bridges are getting older. Very few are getting proper replacement. More people are driving cars then ever. How many of the bridges in this country were rated the same as this one? 25% or something? It's a problem that's going to grow if we don't fix it now. We have a good track record. Sure. But the bridges wear down. I mean 25% of this country's bridges were exactly the same as far as we know! That's a bit unsettling.

And for the dear Lord, I think her joking statement flew right over your head.

50%. But we don't know what that even means. A retired guy from MNDOT (minnesota department of transportation) was on television and he said that this structurally deficient thing is no more than a rating system to get funding approved. We don't even know what this rating system really means yet.

Joking statement? Not a funny topic right now.

 

[LarryMullen's POPAngel]

All the bridges are getting older. Very few are getting proper replacement. More people are driving cars then ever. How many of the bridges in this country were rated the same as this one? 25% or something? It's a problem that's going to grow if we don't fix it now. We have a good track record. Sure. But the bridges wear down. I mean 25% of this country's bridges were exactly the same as far as we know! That's a bit unsettling.

And for the dear Lord, I think her joking statement flew right over your head.

It's called sarcasm, Snowlock - look into it [/sarcasm]

For the record, no one is making jokes about this tragedy. The way you perceive reality, whether in terms of sarcastic posts on a message board or facts and data concerning our countries infrastructre vs. spending on the war, is almost frightening.

 

[Snowlock]

I'm not blaming the War for all our problems, but to deny it's a factor is ridiculous as well.

Our problems? Now you're getting general. The topic was the bridge. You and others basically said if it wasn't for the war in Iraq that bridge wouldn't have fallen.

Who's being ridiculous?

 

[phillyfan26]

50%. But we don't know what that even means. A retired guy from MNDOT (minnesota department of transportation) was on television and he said that this structurally deficient thing is no more than a rating system to get funding approved. We don't even know what this rating system really means yet.

Joking statement? Not a funny topic right now.

Well, apparently a bridge with this rating can fall. Likely? No. But it can happen. And that's the problem. No one should feel unsafe on the roads when we can fix them.

And not a joke "Haha people died," it's sarcasm. The phrasing was intentionally like that.

 

[Snowlock]

It's called sarcasm, Snowlock - look into it [/sarcasm]

For the record, no one is making jokes about this tragedy. The way you perceive reality, whether in terms of sarcastic posts on a message board or facts and data concerning our countries infrastructre vs. spending on the war, is almost frightening.

I know, watching the news and collecting facts is frightening, so is using common sense. Still, I suggest you try it some time.

We're not making jokes but we're being sarcastic? Would you make up your mind here?

 

[phillyfan26]

Our problems? Now you're getting general. The topic was the bridge. You and others basically said if it wasn't for the war in Iraq that bridge wouldn't have fallen.

Who's being ridiculous?

To interpret it as such is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. I legitimately cannot believe you just typed that.

What am I saying? I'm saying, there's been concerns about this, never addressed by the government. It should have been. Now this has happened. So, they're finally acting. It's not to make a mockery of the deaths of these people, as you think. It's a wake up call. That's why this is happening.

The only thing about the Iraq War, which I didn't bring up, but I did address, is that it makes funding for important things like these more difficult. Do you deny that?

 

[Snowlock]

Well, apparently a bridge with this rating can fall. Likely? No. But it can happen. And that's the problem. No one should feel unsafe on the roads when we can fix them.

And not a joke "Haha people died," it's sarcasm. The phrasing was intentionally like that.

Someone tell me how likely though and then we can measure how big of a problem it is. Just going by your estimate, 25% of the bridges in this country have this rating. That's *alot* of bridges!! So by that standard, they should've been falling like dominos long ago. Thousands of people should be dying. But, that isn't happening. They were already on the schedule prior to the collapse to be fixed. Where's the big problem?

 

[ntalwar]

Our problems? Now you're getting general. The topic was the bridge. You and others basically said if it wasn't for the war in Iraq that bridge wouldn't have fallen.

Not quite. Now that the bridge has fallen, Bush said he would get that bridge replaced. However, no mention was made of increasing funding for other bridges that are at risk of falling nationwide.

 

[LarryMullen's POPAngel]

I know, watching the news and collecting facts is frightening, so is using common sense. Still, I suggest you try it some time.

We're not making jokes but we're being sarcastic? Would you make up your mind here?

Sarcasm directed towards posters who obviously haven't read or watched a single news item about the war and saying "haha that bridge collapsed" are so far apart in terms of everything I won't even bother trying to explain it to you. Obviously you skew things to suit your way of thinking which, from what I've seen this morning, is quite warped.

 

[phillyfan26]

Did you hear the woman in the article I posted?

But Stidger said states aren't getting the money they need to repair their roads and bridges. They're forced to resort to a process of "patch, patch, patch and nothing ever gets repaired," she said.

She likened the process to putting a Band-Aid on a broken elbow and said, "There's only so much you can do with inadequate funding."

 

[Snowlock]

To interpret it as such is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. I legitimately cannot believe you just typed that.

What am I saying? I'm saying, there's been concerns about this, never addressed by the government. It should have been. Now this has happened. So, they're finally acting. It's not to make a mockery of the deaths of these people, as you think. It's a wake up call. That's why this is happening.

The only thing about the Iraq War, which I didn't bring up, but I did address, is that it makes funding for important things like these more difficult. Do you deny that?

Yeah, it's COMPLETELY STUPID, and that's exactly why I typed it. Okay, you want to consider the bridge falling a wake up call? Fine. Pay extra taxes and fix the bridges. That way no one will ever die on a bridge again in the history of our country, I'm sure.

But to somehow even tie in our "issue" with this bridge or any bridge with the Iraq war is either completely re-frickin-tarded or totally disgustingly political.

 

[LarryMullen's POPAngel]

Did you hear the woman in the article I posted?

Let me join you at that brick wall.

 

[phillyfan26]

Yeah, it's COMPLETELY STUPID, and that's exactly why I typed it. Okay, you want to consider the bridge falling a wake up call? Fine. Pay extra taxes and fix the bridges. That way no one will ever die on a bridge again in the history of our country, I'm sure.

But to somehow even tie in our "issue" with this bridge or any bridge with the Iraq war is either completely re-frickin-tarded or totally disgustingly political.

I'm not a liberal, so that whole partisan argument of yours can fly out the window.

 

[kellyahern]

Where's the big problem?

U.S. Highway system badly in need of repair

Thousands of bridges need rebuilding, but funding hasn't kept up

 

[A_Wanderer]

Well, apparently a bridge with this rating can fall. Likely? No. But it can happen. And that's the problem. No one should feel unsafe on the roads when we can fix them.

And not a joke "Haha people died," it's sarcasm. The phrasing was intentionally like that.

There is no such thing as a bridge that can't fail.