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[A_Wanderer]

You seem to have a view towards a God that can be reconciled with reality (theistic evolution, recognising the evidence for the development of beliefs over time, seeing the flaws in religious texts as a concequence of history, historical criticism of the bible etc.).

To cut to the chase.

Do feel that you believe in God?

Are you more of a Theist or Deist?

Incidently damn right about history and philosophy being important, I am reading up on some materialistic philosophy of science stuff (Popper and Kuhn - good places to start) and it makes me think more critically about where research in a more historical science (palaeontology) sits.

[melon]

I just wanted to let you know that I've read your question, and that I will respond soon. I just don't have a lot of time to answer at this moment!

[Zoomerang96]

Originally posted by melon


Toronto, which is nice, if only because I'm not terribly far away from where I'm living right now. It should help make it a smoother transition for me.

I already go there several times a year as it is, and I quite like it there. It may not have the sheer activity of NYC, by any stretch of the imagination, but Toronto seems to do a great job of combining urban life with livability.

i always KNEW you were a loyalist, melon. i'm so happy to see you join us in our utopian society under her hrh.

soon you'll be singing god save the queen with the rest of us.

oh yes.

[melon]

Originally posted by A_Wanderer
Do feel that you believe in God?

Are you more of a Theist or Deist

I would say that I am a theist, but yet I generally feel that I have little in common with most self-described Christians. A lot of this has to do with my knowledge and understanding of Christian history, and that the beliefs that one would say are "Christian" are often a matter of time and place. I'm reminded of something rather interesting that St. Augustine of Hippo wrote once, in City of God, regarding whether there were people living in the Southern Hemisphere ("Antipodes"):

Chapter 9.—Whether We are to Believe in the Antipodes.

But as to the fable that there are Antipodes, that is to say, men on the opposite side of the earth, where the sun rises when it sets to us, men who walk with their feet opposite ours, that is on no ground credible. And, indeed, it is not affirmed that this has been learned by historical knowledge, but by scientific conjecture, on the ground that the earth is suspended within the concavity of the sky, and that it has as much room on the one side of it as on the other: hence they say that the part which is beneath must also be inhabited. But they do not remark that, although it be supposed or scientifically demonstrated that the world is of a round and spherical form, yet it does not follow that the other side of the earth is bare of water; nor even, though it be bare, does it immediately follow that it is peopled. For Scripture, which proves the truth of its historical statements by the accomplishment of its prophecies, gives no false information; and it is too absurd to say, that some men might have taken ship and traversed the whole wide ocean, and crossed from this side of the world to the other, and that thus even the inhabitants of that distant region are descended from that one first man. Wherefore let us seek if we can find the city of God that sojourns on earth among those human races who are catalogued as having been divided into seventy-two nations and as many languages. For it continued down to the deluge and the ark, and is proved to have existed still among the sons of Noah by their blessings, and chiefly in the eldest son Shem; for Japheth received this blessing, that he should dwell in the tents of Shem.

Needless to say, we now know that, during Augustine's time, there were plenty of people living in the Southern Hemisphere--not to mention the Americas, which he would never have fathomed. But such an idea was unfathomable, because it could not be reconciled with two main ideas:

1) That God would not place people where Christian missionaries could not access, thus condemning these people to Hell.

2) That, if these people did exist, Jesus could not have appeared a second time in the Antipodes, because that would contradict their understanding of Scripture.

And, because of this, as far as St. Augustine of Hippo was concerned, there were no people in the Southern Hemisphere, if, indeed, it existed at all. 1,600 years later, we know that medieval Christianity was wrong. Not only were there people living in the "Antipodes," but Jesus had not appeared to them either (again, not mentioning the fact that the future "New World" existed entirely outside of their known world).

I bring this up solely to bring up a point that there are many Christians, today, who are insistent that "true believers" believe in no shortage of nonsense, from believing in young Earth creationism or intelligent design; or that we live in a world that is "especially evil," ignoring completely the historical context that our ancestors lived through far greater "evils" of their time (incessant war, genocides, enslavement, famine, disease [Black Death, smallpox], and highly corrupt secular and religious leadership).

What makes me feel "aloof," I guess, is that I reject the notion that God would want us to believe nonsense. There are certain essentials to faith, which I think are ultimately quite narrow, when applied to the vastness of the human experience. And, undoubtedly, there is also much that we wouldn't know about God, merely because He exists beyond our physical senses. That is why, I guess, I approach my beliefs with confidence, yet tempered with humility.

[A_Wanderer]

good answer