An Olympic Boycott: would it have any effect at all?

[butter7]

Originally posted by martha


If there are any Tibetans left.

In Tibet, 95% of the population are Tibetan, the rest 5% are Han, Hui (they are muslims), Menba (One male still allow have multi-wives as an exception of the Chinese marriage law).

[deep]

Originally posted by butter7
You are welcome.

I just hope I could provide a window about what the whole thing was going on among Chinese people, since most people here can't read Chinese, and only could get information from the local media.

The whole Tibet thing really should have be solved as soon as possible. For us who enjoys discussing on the internet forum, it's only a thread, but for the people who live there, it's their families and lives.

Yes,

I think the West likes to exploit this

Even the Dali Lama does not want a "Free Tibet"

Just some autonomy.

Which does not sound like much.

Except it could be a dangerous starting point for the Chinese government.


I believe there are other groups of people in other areas that would want the same thing? Is that true?

[martha]

Originally posted by butter7


English is the compulsory subject for Chinese kids since primary school. And even kindergarten would have some program of teaching kids some basic English. What's your point about this then?

Chinese has replaced Tibetan as the official language.

http://www.freetibet.org/info/key_issues.html

[martha]

Originally posted by butter7


In Tibet, 95% of the population are Tibetan, the rest 5% are Han, Hui (they are muslims), Menba (One male still allow have multi-wives as an exception of the Chinese marriage law).

long-term Chinese settlement in Tibet has been deliberately encouraged, with the result that Tibetans are in the minority in many areas. Independent research puts the number of Chinese in the TAR at 5 5.5 million versus 4.5 million Tibetans; in Kham and Amdo, Chinese outnumber Tibetans many times over. Chinese traders are favoured by lower tax assessments and the dominant position of Chinese in government administration.

http://www.freetibet.org/info/key_issues.html

[martha]

Originally posted by deep

Even the Dali Lama does not want a "Free Tibet"

Just some autonomy.

You know this from your meetings with him?


What wrong with a little autonomy?

Why are you so hot to defend China?

[deep]

I just saw that

I wonder which number is more correct

I don't think the "Free Tibet" site is without bias


I will do some more checking when I have more time

[butter7]

Originally posted by deep


Yes,

I think the West likes to exploit this

Even the Dali Lama does not want a "Free Tibet"

Just some autonomy.

Which does not sound like much.

Except it could be a dangerous starting point for the Chinese government.


I believe there are other groups of people in other areas that would want the same thing? Is that true?

The problem about Dalai Lama's "autonomy" is that he want a "Great Tibet", which not only Tibet, but also include Sichuan Province (the largest populated province in China, over 1000 million people living in there), Gansu Province, where Han ethnic people and Hui ethinic people living as the majority. He also demand "remove all non-tibetan" from the region listed above.

These terms wouldn't even made him to the negotiation table.

[deep]

Originally posted by martha


You know this from your meetings with him?


What wrong with a little autonomy?

Why are you so hot to defend China?

I did actually hear him speak in 2004

very impressive !



but it was a recent "interview" that I heard him say that he did not want Tibet to break away, be independent from China

he said that "autonomy" was what he sought

so if you are making donations to "Free Tibet" it is not what he prefers

[martha]

I'm not donating to anyone.

[deep]

Originally posted by butter7
The problem about Dalai Lama's "autonomy" is that he want a "Great Tibet", which not only Tibet, but also include Sichuan Province (the largest populated province in China, over 1000 million people living in there), Gansu Province, where Han ethnic people and Hui ethinic people living as the majority. He also demand "remove all non-tibetan" from the region listed above.

These terms wouldn't even made him to the negotiation table.

Thank you for giving us this information

I did not think is was as simple as many think it is.

Even thought it is fun to go to a "Free Tibet" rock concert

and buy a tee- shirt

[butter7]

Originally posted by martha



http://www.freetibet.org/info/key_issues.html

martha, if my memory serves me right, the freetibet people also claim that Tibetan kids can't access to any education at all.

I was a fan of this site when I first got to Australia, beccause I couldn't open it in China. lol

But the research result was quite disappointing.

Debate about who has the more correct answer wouldn't have any result, cos we are not the profesionals of statistics. But I strongly suggest you to go to Tibet and have a look yourself. Just avoid the current events and Olympic traffic.

[butter7]

Originally posted by deep


Thank you for giving us this information

I did not think is was as simple as many think it is.

Even thought it is fun to go to a "Free Tibet" rock concert

and buy a tee- shirt

LOL, I was the proud first uploader for spreading the U2 performance on the Free-Tibet concert over the Chinese fan forum.

People said it's ironic U2 sang "One" in that concert.

[martha]

Originally posted by butter7

Debate about who has the more correct answer wouldn't have any result, cos we are not the profesionals of statistics.

I understand what you're saying, but I disagree. Giving up because statistics vary is what governments want.

Originally posted by butter7

But I strongly suggest you to go to Tibet and have a look yourself.

When I have the combination of money and time, I will.

[deep]

Originally posted by butter7


LOL, I was the proud first uploader for spreading the U2 performance on the Free-Tibet concert over the Chinese fan forum.

I thought people went to jail for doing that.

[butter7]

Originally posted by martha
I understand what you're saying, but I disagree. Giving up because statistics vary is what governments want.

When I have the combination of money and time, I will.

Tibet is a pretty place, and a lot of peole are really addicted to it. Me too saving up for a Tibet tour.

[butter7]

Originally posted by deep


I thought people went to jail for doing that.

Not really. But people would be send behind bars if they spread information for seperate the country with large public audience (like what Bjork did in Shanghai concert, she got away because she's a foreigner), or organise similar kind of campaign/movement/party...etc. It was clearly stated in the Chinese law that it's a crime would result 5 years life sentence.

As a individual, it's perfectly okay. But I did got some bashes for uploading it, some people fears that this would result a U2-ban in China. But the concern was vanished after free-tibet concert bands Sonic Youth and Rolling Stone hold their concerts sucessfully in Shanghai.

Besides, I personally don't believe the Dalai Lama loving U2 boys would ever consider hold a concert in the communist China, so, it's all okay.

[Bluer White]

Originally posted by martha
Since 1950, an estimated 1.2 million Tibetans have been killed by the Chinese.

Lack of solid demographic evidence seriously calls this claim into question. The paper I'm linking believes that the Tibetans may have overestimated their own population by 650K to 770K in the early 1950's. So naturally when a census is taken 10 or 20 years later and a bunch of people are missing, this may explain (some) of the reason why.

Page 12 & 13 are fairly digestible, and 9 & 10 are helpful as well.

http://www.case.edu/affil/tibet/book...n.in.china.pdf

[martha]

You guys are right. Nothing bad is happening in Tibet. No one is being killed, no one is losing their language, religion is safe from persecution. It's all puppies and butterflies, with the Chinese government taking a lead on human rights in the region. They're working to make the Tibetans a happy people, free from all worry.

[butter7]

In Paris.





The girl who was carring the torch was sitting on her wheelchair, she's an athlete with only one leg. The guy in the white shirt is an athlete too, and he's blind.

I guess that's the peaceful protest that Dalai Lama was referring to.

[martha]

You're clueless.