A whole family was murdered

[deep]

(CNN) -- Israel's prime minister on Sunday expressed regret over the deaths of seven members of a family at a Gaza beach on Friday that Palestinians say was caused by Israeli shelling.


Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas Saturday condemned the beach incident as
a "despicable massacre ... the Israeli artillery was aimed at children, women -- innocent children and women who were sitting on the seashore, on the sea beach having fun on a normal weekend.

"A whole family was murdered, all its members, by the Israeli Defense Forces," Abbas said.

News footage of disconsolate 7-year-old Huda Ghalya, who survived the killing of her family, reverberated across the globe. She, her mother, father and three siblings were having a beach picnic at the time.

"Over the weekend, serious events occurred in the Gaza Strip area. As a result of an incident which has yet to be fully inquired into, seven members of one family were killed on the Gaza beach.

"We have expressed our deep regret over the death of seven innocent civilians, we truly regret this. Defense Minister Amir Peretz has instructed that an inquiry be held into the exact circumstances of the event.

 

[U2takemehigher]

Today on the radio i heard that a man had been stabbed in our area when does it end?

 

[A_Wanderer]

Shades of Mohammed al-Doura perhaps

A top Israeli general says the country’s armed forces didn’t cause the explosion that killed eight Palestinians on Friday and ended the fragile ceasefire in the region.

Hamas, which leads the Palestinian Authority parliament, blamed the deaths on Tel Aviv as its military branch resumed attacks on Israel for the first time in 16 months.

But Israeli Maj.-Gen. Yoav Galant said Sunday the military can prove it wasn’t Israeli fire that hit the beach in Gaza, killing eight people.

Galant, who commands Israel’s southern command, said Israel stopped firing 15 minutes before the explosion.

link

I must say though it was a masterful stroke of propaganda using the girl like that, top points.

The Palestinian Authority will not cooperate in any investigation either

A Palestinian security source said Sunday that Hamas operatives had cleared the debris from the explosion which killed seven Palestinian civilians on Friday in order to frustrate the IDF's attempts to investigate the incident.

Defense Minister Amir Peretz set up an investigative committee, headed by Maj.-General Meir Calify of the Ground Forces Command, and ordered that it present its findings by Tuesday evening at latest.

Peretz also ordered a suspension of all artillery fire until the completion of the investigation, Israel Radio reported.

link

 

[deep]

and the Iraqis in Haditha, shot themselves in the back of the heads to make the U. S. Marines look bad, too

 

[A_Wanderer]

Wow, relevent topics make for good conversation.

There are definite cases where the Palestinian Authority has used incidences of Palestinian on Palestinian violence as propaganda against the Israelis, the press went along with it and it was only well after that the truth came out, now it is a horrifying event but an investigation with the evidence on the table is a good deal more valuable than staged footage.

 

[deep]

if anything it was to make sure there can be no negotiations, while Israel continues it's disgusting land grab
as they continue to take pieces of what the world agrees should be the Palastinian homeland

Olmert tests waters in London

By Jonathan Marcus

Diplomatic correspondent, BBC News

First Washington, then Cairo and Amman, and on Monday it is the turn of London.

Israel's new Prime Minister Ehud Olmert has taken his convergence plan on a road-tour.

He is trying to win international backing for a proposal by which - in the absence of a Palestinian partner - Israel will set de facto borders of its own making.

 

[deep]

Wow, relevent topics make for good conversation.

There are definite cases where the Palestinian Authority has used incidences of Palestinian on Palestinian violence as propaganda against the Israelis, the press went along with it and it was only well after that the truth came out, now it is a horrifying event but an investigation with the evidence on the table is a good deal more valuable than staged footage.

Israel has already accepted responsibility

and

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- The senior Marine sergeant in charge during an incident in Haditha, Iraq, last November, says there was no massacre of civilians, and there was no wrongdoing on the Marines' part, his attorney told CNN.
Puckett said there is more to the story than has been reported.

The military is investigating whether up to eight marines from Kilo company of the 3rd Battalion, 1st Marine Regiment, killed 24 Iraqi civilians in Haditha after one of their own was killed in a roadside bombing and engaged in a cover-up. Three Marines have been relieved of their duties.

None of the Marines has been charged in the incident.

and of course
there are holocaust deniers, too.

 

[A_Wanderer]

So the wipe the Jew from the face of the Earth is just joking around?

The Palestinians did not have representatives interested in peace during Arafats reign and now Hamas is in charge a mutually agreed two state solution is impossible. Unilateral disengagement is the only way (you know those land graps that involve surrendering most of the land).

 

[A_Wanderer]

there are holocaust deniers, too.

And the evidence for the holocaust is well documented and the crimes investigated for the world to see.

 

[A_Wanderer]

Israel has already accepted responsibility

Expression of regret does not equal admission of guilt.

 

[anitram]

Expression of regret does not equal admission of guilt.

"Maj.-Gen. Yoav Galant said Israeli forces stopped firing 15 minutes before the explosion, meaning Israel couldn't have been responsible."

But from the CBC:

The military has accounted for five of the six shells it fired into Gaza, and said they didn't kill the family.

But investigators aren't sure what happened to the sixth shell. It may have fallen among the Ghalia family.

...

The uncertainty about the sixth shell undermines earlier comments Sunday, when a top Israeli general said the country's Armed Forces didn't cause the explosion.

The Palestinians are obviously using the image of that girl, but at the same time, does anyone doubt her grief is insincere?

 

[AchtungBono]

if anything it was to make sure there can be no negotiations, while Israel continues it's disgusting land grab
as they continue to take pieces of what the world agrees should be the Palastinian homeland

Hello Deep,

Actually we're doing exactly the OPPOSITE of land grabs. We're actually starting to withdraw from lands we occupied in 1967.

I'll tell you what the problem is - the world does not understand that we do not target civillians. It is truly regrettable that the Hamas terrorists place their camps and hideouts in residential areas (showing a total disregard for their own people's safety), thus causing civillian casualties.

Unlike us, the Hamas terrorists actually DO target our civillians by suicide bombings, roadside shootings and making a shooting gallery out of the southern city of Sderot (which is about an hour and a half from my home).

I am deeply grieved at the senseless death of that family and my heart goes out to the little girl (even though she's being shamelessly used for propoganda purposes).

At the same time, does anyone think about the residents of Sderot who are now living in a shooting gallery with barrages of Kasam missiles raining down on them? Does the world expect Israel to sit and do nothing while the terrorists have free reign over territories we gave back, supposedly in exchange for peace?

The terrorists launch their missiles from populated areas knowing that Israel will retaliate, thus feeding their propoganda purposes when civillians get hurt or killed. They don't give a shit about their own people, because if they did they would stop hurting them with their actions.

I remember the Palestinian propaganda machine at work a few years ago when the Israeli military had a campaign against terrorists in Gaza and the TV cameras showed a body on a stretcher covered with a Palestinian flag. The mourners were wailing and moaning and then (when the cameras weren't looking) photographs from the air showed the body "miraculously" coming to life and getting off the stretcher.....I'm not making this up.

So while I sincerely grieve for the tragic loss of life, it is just another byproduct of the terrorists actions against us.

Furthermore, The fact that there is now a major humanitarian crisis in the Palestinian Authority is not Israel's fault. They brought it upon themselves by electing a terrorist government that almost the entire world abhors. Hamas is responsible for suicide bombings and the killing of hundreds of Israelis - men, women and children. How can they possibly expect the world to ignore their agenda and to embrace them as a regular government as if they DIDN'T have blood on their hands?

Israel has offerred humanitarian assistance directly to the people (bypassing the Hamas government) but this assistance was refused.

Every single action that Israel has taken has been in self defence following suicide bombings and missile attacks. You may argue that there is no justification for the killing of innocent civillians and you are right, however, as I mentioned, the terrorists purposely cause casualties on their side to serve their own twisted purposes.

We are currently investigating the true cause of this tragic event in Gaza (with no help from the Palestinian side) and believe me that we will do everything to bring the truth to light so that justice is done.

 

[A_Wanderer]

The IDF probe investigating the deaths of seven Palestinian civilians, caused by an explosion on a beach in Gaza on Friday evening, concluded that chances were slim that the accident was caused by IDF shelling.

According to Channel 2, the findings, expected to be formally released on Tuesday, showed an inconsistency between the shrapnel found in the body of one of the wounded babies and the metal used in IDF artillery. Moreover, the investigation noted the absence of a large enough crater at the site of the explosion, as would be expected if an IDF shell had landed there.

The third observation casting doubt on the possibility of IDF shelling was the gap between the time when the army shot the artillery and when the commotion on the beach began. According to the probe’s findings, several minutes past after the shelling, before the Palestinians on the beach reacted. ...

The leading theory currently entertained, suggested that an explosive charge, buried by Palestinians on the Gaza beach to prevent Israeli infiltration, was behind the explosion.

Throughout the whole investigation, army officials complained about the lack of Palestinian cooperation. Unconfirmed reports further suggested attempts by Palestinians to remove shrapnel from the bodies of the wounded, treated in Israeli hospitals, thus impeding the investigation.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1150035838991&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull

 

[deep]

I do look at the Jeruselum Post from time to time

I also look at Haaretz.com

where I read this

We came, we shelled, we killed

By Danny Rubinstein

The bloodshed on the Gaza beachfront late last week was not the result of a tragic error. It was clear to everyone that in the exchanges of fire in the narrow Gaza Strip, where the population density is among the highest in the world, it was just a matter of time before an entire family was hit. The Palestinian response was also known in advance. More and more attacks - and the number of Israeli victims that can be expected in the near future - will only be determined by luck, for better or worse.

It is a known fact that there is no military solution to the overall Palestinian-Israeli conflict. But now it is becoming increasingly clear that there is no military solution for putting an end to the Qassam rocket attacks. The Israel Defense Forces has struck at the rocket-launching crews and their commanders; it has destroyed the bridges and the roads leading to the launching areas; it has carried out what it calls "exposure" activities and has destroyed farmland; it has bombed the launching sites, over and over. The army has dispersed fliers warning the population and threatening to destroy entire neighborhoods and towns. And let us also remember the IDF's "war on the lathes" that targeted the metalworking shops in Gaza. Dozens of Palestinian lathes were bombed and destroyed due to the suspicion that they were being used to manufacture rockets.

None of this helped. On the contrary: There are many more rockets and missiles in Gaza today than in the past. The know-how, the means and the capabilities to launch them against targets in Israel have only improved and become more sophisticated. And there is no doubt that the continued deterioration of the security situation will only sharpen Palestinian martial skills and broaden their activity in this area. We can even assume that sooner or later, in the absence of a diplomatic option, the motivation, the means and the know-how for launching missiles will also reach the West Bank.

Since Mahmoud Abbas was elected Palestinian Authority chairman, a year and a half ago, barely a day has gone by during which he has not called for negotiations. It is true that he is not fighting the Hamas and terrorism with particular determination, but this is no excuse for not talking with him. It has already been four years since the Arab initiative was presented at the Beirut summit, which called for normalization with Israel. The terms are obviously difficult to meet, but Israeli statesmen have not even bothered to relate to the initiative. On the agenda now stands the so-called prisoners' document, which has met only with rejection and derogatory responses from the Prime Minister Ehud Olmert and his spokesmen. And there are also the decisions of the Hamas government to permit contacts with the Israeli government on practical matters - economics, finance, agriculture, electricity, health, tourism.

The Palestinians' demands are tough, obviously. It would have been a lot simpler if they accepted ours: for example, that greater Jerusalem in its entirety - with Ma'aleh Adumim in the east, Givat Ze'ev in the north and Betar in the south - officially become the capital, solely, of Israel. Among the Palestinians, across the board, the general view is that the Israelis know quite well that the Palestinians would never accept such a demand.



It is therefore in Israel's clear interest not to start any talks with any Palestinians - not with moderates and particularly not with the radicals. On the contrary, it is best that the Palestinians remain extremists because then no one will ask the government of Israel to negotiate with them. How do we ensure that the Palestinians remain radical? We simply strike at them, over and over, via assassinations and incessant bombings, until they drive any thought of supporting a peace policy out of their minds.

It is possible that this is mistaken, distorted thinking. However, whoever follows the mood in the territories, the press, the statements of various spokesmen and the interviews on local radio and Arab television stations - will quickly conclude that this is the overwhelming thinking among Palestinians from Rafah in southern Gaza to Jenin in the northern West Bank. And until Israel does not announce a change of policy, a desire for a complete cease-fire and a genuine willingness for dialogue - this is how the situation will continue.

 

[A_Wanderer]

Israelis and Palestinians have equal freedom to criticise the Israeli government.

 

[A_Wanderer]

JERUSALEM - Defense Minister Amir Peretz said Tuesday that
Israel was not responsible for a blast that killed eight Gaza beachgoers, rebuffing Palestinian accusations that blamed an Israeli artillery round.

An Israeli inquiry concluded the blast was caused by an explosive buried in the sand, not from Israeli shelling on the afternoon of the Palestinian family's beach picnic.

It was not clear how the explosive got there, or whether it might have been an unexploded Israeli shell from an earlier military barrage. Peretz did not address that issue in his remarks. Israel has been claiming that Hamas militants planted a device to set off against Israeli commandos.

Maher Makdad of the Palestinians'
Fatah movement rejected the Israeli claims. "I only heard lies," he said. "I also heard an insistence on continuing these practices, because if they admitted their mistake, we could understand that they are ready to change their policies."

Peretz denied all responsibility.

"We have enough findings to back up the suspicion that the intention to describe this as an Israeli event is simply not correct," Peretz said at a Tel Aviv news conference on the inquiry's findings. "The accumulating evidence proves that this incident was not due to Israeli forces."

The bloody images of dead Palestinian civilians and wailing survivors on the beach kindled anger against Israel that has swept around the world.

link

 

[deep]

Abbas accuses Israel of state terrorism

Wednesday 14 June 2006, 6:03 Makka Time, 3:03 GMT



Mahmoud Abbas, the Palestinian president, has accused Israel of engaging in state terrorism as the families of those killed in an air attack on Tuesday were mourning their dead.

Israel carried out a missile air strike on a van in Gaza carrying resistance fighters and rockets. The attack killed 11 Palestinians, nine of them civilians, and wounded about 30 in the deadliest such attack in nearly four years.

Abbas said: "What Israel is doing is called state terrorism. This state terrorism will not shake us."

 

[Macfistowannabe]

Of course Abbas would say that.

And who would have thought that any tragedy in Hamas-controlled territory would be Israel's fault?

Most everything that happens in Palestine is quickly dubbed into anti-semitic propaganda.

 

[AchtungBono]

I find that VERY funny on so many levels, but mostly at the fact that he has the nerve to say that WE commit acts of state sponsored terrorism.....

The rockets launched at Sderot were launched by the military wing of Hamas - which just happens to be the government right now....is that NOT state terrorism?

Make NO mistake - the aggression is not on our part, but rather an answer to the actions against us.

 

[nbcrusader]

The damage was done. Plenty of people will view the images and buy into the lie that the Jews were responsible for the death of the family.

 

[deep]

Israel changes tack on beach deaths

Wednesday 14 June 2006, 14:05 Makka Time, 11:05 GMT

Palestinians have called for a UN inquiry into the explosion


Israel has conceded that it may have been responsible for the Gaza beach deaths after all, having ruled out any hint of blame hours earlier.

The military said on Wednesday that old Israeli ordnance could have killed the eight Palestinians last Friday, after its previous denial of responsibility was received with scepticism by the United Nations and elsewhere.

General Meir Klifi, who is leading the Israeli military investigation, said an examination of shrapnel removed from one of the casualties proved that it did not come from a 155mm shell - the type his army was firing at the Gaza Strip last Friday.

But he told Israeli radio: "It could be from another kind of munition that we have used in the past."

He said, however, that his investigation was incomplete so his findings were not conclusive.

 

[A_Wanderer]

While sticking to its demand for the establishment of an independent inquiry into a blast on a Gaza beach 10 days ago that killed seven Palestinian civilians, the Human Rights Watch conceded Monday night for the first time since the incident that it could not contradict the IDF’s exonerating findings.

On Monday, Maj.-Gen. Meir Klifi - head of the IDF inquiry commission that cleared the IDF of responsibility for the blast - met with Marc Garlasco, a military expert from the HRW who had last week claimed that the blast was caused by an IDF artillery shell. Following the three-hour meeting, described by both sides as cordial and pleasant, Garlasco praised the IDF’s professional investigation into the blast, which he said was most likely caused by unexploded Israeli ordnance left laying on the beach, a possibility also raised by Klifi and his team. ...

Meanwhile Monday, The Post learned that the IDF was currently inspecting a second piece of shrapnel doctors had retrieved from one of the Palestinians wounded in the blast and currently being treated at Soroka Hospital in Beersheba. A first piece of shrapnel, examined by the IDF as well as by an independent academic institute in Beersheba was found to not have come from a 155 mm shell, the type used in IDF artillery attacks on Kassam launch sites in the Gaza Strip. The second piece of shrapnel, sources said, was currently being examined in an IDF lab.

Garlasco told Klifi during the meeting that he was impressed with the IDF’s system of checks and balances concerning its artillery fire in the Gaza Strip and unlike Hamas which specifically targeted civilians in its rocket attacks, the Israelis, he said, invested a great amount of resources and efforts not to harm innocent civilians. “We do not believe the Israelis were targeting civilians.” Garlasco said. “We just want to know if it was an Israeli shell that killed the Palestinians.”

Lucy Mair - head of the HRW’s Jerusalem office - said Klifi’s team had conducted a thorough and professional investigation of the incident and made “a good assessment” when ruling out the possibility that an errant IDF shell had killed the seven Palestinians on the Gaza beach.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1150355528023&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull