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Old 03-28-2004, 11:55 AM   #1
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A New Prayer for School

[Q]Now I sit me down in school
Where praying is against the rule
For this great nation under God
Finds mention of Him very odd.
If Scripture now the class recites,
It violates the Bill of Rights.
And anytime my head I bow
Becomes a Federal matter now.

Our hair can be purple, orange or green,
That's no offense; it's a freedom scene.
The law is specific, the law is precise.
Prayers spoken aloud are a serious vice.

For praying in a public hall
Might offend someone with no faith at all
In silence alone we must meditate,
God's name is prohibited by the state.

We're allowed to cuss and dress like freaks,
And pierce our noses, tongues and cheeks.
They've outlawed guns, but FIRST the Bible.
To quote the Good Book makes me liable.

We can elect a pregnant Senior Queen,
And the 'unwed daddy,' our Senior King.
It's "inappropriate" to teach right from wrong,
We're taught that such "judgments" do not belong.

We can get our condoms and birth controls,
Study witchcraft, vampires and totem poles.
But the Ten Commandments are not allowed,
No word of God must reach this crowd.
It's scary here I must confess,
When chaos reigns the school's a mess.
So, Lord, this silent plea I make:
Should I be shot; My soul please take!
Amen [/Q]

This has been circulating among the teachers in my district via email. This is the fourth time it has arrived in my email. I thought I would share it with you, the well educated and knowledgeable citizens of FYM. I thought we might say this prayer together, as one voice, in harmony with each other.

Peace
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Old 03-28-2004, 11:59 AM   #2
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I used to have a bumper sticker that said, "As long as there are tests, there will be prayer in schools." Heard that.

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Old 03-28-2004, 12:03 PM   #3
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It's a common complaint from persecuted Christians. It's getting old.
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Old 03-28-2004, 01:26 PM   #4
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I'd love to see what Christians would say if Hindus took control of a public school and forced all the Christians in the school to say prayers to Ganesh.

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Old 03-28-2004, 01:26 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sherry Darling
I used to have a bumper sticker that said, "As long as there are tests, there will be prayer in schools." Heard that.

sd
I could use that sticker. It was state testing week in the third grade
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Old 03-28-2004, 01:55 PM   #6
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Originally posted by melon
I'd love to see what Christians would say if Hindus took control of a public school and forced all the Christians in the school to say prayers to Ganesh.

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He would be an appropriate one for the schools under the current administration. He is, after all, the Remover of Obstacles.
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Old 03-28-2004, 03:38 PM   #7
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How do you balance the free speech rights of students against the prohibitation of establishment of religion? We can understand why a teacher cannot conduct the prayer - but when teachers become anti-religious expression enforcers, does this cross the line? Or is it easier to dimiss that as part of the "Christian persecution complex"?
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Old 03-28-2004, 03:56 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader
How do you balance the free speech rights of students against the prohibitation of establishment of religion? We can understand why a teacher cannot conduct the prayer - but when teachers become anti-religious expression enforcers, does this cross the line? Or is it easier to dimiss that as part of the "Christian persecution complex"?
one question at a time: as i have been told by teachers throughout high school, 'you loose your rights as you walk in the door' (meaning the constitutional rights) -->this after kids are getting suspended and/or expelled for speaking up against a teacher in class, having their lockers searched and drugs/alcohol/weapons found, handing out literature that they wrote or produced in some manner, wearing 'issue' shirts...

no, i don't know why, but it doesn't.

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Old 03-28-2004, 03:56 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader
How do you balance the free speech rights of students against the prohibitation of establishment of religion? We can understand why a teacher cannot conduct the prayer - but when teachers become anti-religious expression enforcers, does this cross the line? Or is it easier to dimiss that as part of the "Christian persecution complex"?
It depends entirely on the context.
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Old 03-28-2004, 04:51 PM   #10
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I think it's a popular myth that prayer isn't allowed in school at all. It's true that you can't lead the whole school in a prayer or that a teacher can't lead their class in prayer, but students are still allowed to pray outside of the formal class setting (and silently to themselves at any time). My public high school and middle school and University both had several extra curricular Christian and Catholic clubs. AND these groups were allowed to hold a prayer circle in the middle of campus before school where people could attend if they wanted to and had a lunch-time skit every so often. These kinds of things are allowed in public schools because they don't force everyone to listen to it the people who want to participate can go seek it out, that's why you can't pray in the class room cause you're forcing everyone to listen to it. I'm not religious and I have to problem with these kinds of clubs being around cause they're not forcing themselves on anyone, and I think that most people who are against religion being taught in class are fine with these kinds of resources being available to the kids that want them.
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Old 03-28-2004, 07:03 PM   #11
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I have quite literally seen governors of my state waste their entire terms talking about nothing but re-instituting teacher-led prayers in the schools. Our politicians (by that I mean Alabama politicians) love to use this as a political football. Too bad they don't give a damn about the actual schools.
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Old 03-29-2004, 03:21 AM   #12
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Why not rid it all and have what we used to loosley call "Scripture Class" once a week, or even every morning if it is needed, where everyone happily trots off for 15-20 minutes to their respective faiths, the non believers can go to "Non-Scripture" and all will be well.

It isn't rocket science.
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Old 03-29-2004, 09:50 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by Angela Harlem
Why not rid it all and have what we used to loosley call "Scripture Class" once a week, or even every morning if it is needed, where everyone happily trots off for 15-20 minutes to their respective faiths, the non believers can go to "Non-Scripture" and all will be well.

It isn't rocket science.
That wouldn't fly with our Constitution. Plus, my school day just isn't long enough to accomodate religious instruction. And, no one in their right mind would want me teaching their kids about religion. Although, if the government wants me too, let's go!
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Old 03-29-2004, 10:52 AM   #14
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I think this has to be the longest running and most ridiculous argument screamed out by the conservative right. I prayed throughout my whole schooling, probably the only reason I made it through. We had prayer sessions before school, after school, and personal during school. What do these people want, why do they feel the need to pray out loud and have the school sponsor it? What did Jesus say about those praying out loud? Kids wore Christian T-shirts, wore crosses, etc what else do you need to advertise? Why do you need to advertise. Jesus, the disciples they didn't wear advertisements to prove their beliefs it came through with their actions.

The other thing that disturbs me about this "prayer" is hair color, piercings, and the way people dress have nothing to do with belief. The only thing these people want is for everyone to fit in their box, they won't feel safe until they know everyone of their children's peers are just like them.
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Old 03-29-2004, 05:37 PM   #15
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I'm honestly at the point where I dont care anymore. We dont say a prayer in school. But we can if we want to. I dont care either if a teacher leads the prayer. We have done native rituals in my worl religions class and other such things. And if you didnt want to participate you didnt have to. No harm done. I like the idea of prayer because it might seem to get everyone calmer. I know today we had a moment of silence for Cecilia Zhang and after that everyone was more mellow and focused. Maybe we just need some quiet moment like that each morning for peopel to pray if the want or meditate or whatever.
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Old 03-29-2004, 05:51 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
I think this has to be the longest running and most ridiculous argument screamed out by the conservative right. I prayed throughout my whole schooling, probably the only reason I made it through. We had prayer sessions before school, after school, and personal during school. What do these people want, why do they feel the need to pray out loud and have the school sponsor it? What did Jesus say about those praying out loud? Kids wore Christian T-shirts, wore crosses, etc what else do you need to advertise? Why do you need to advertise. Jesus, the disciples they didn't wear advertisements to prove their beliefs it came through with their actions.

The other thing that disturbs me about this "prayer" is hair color, piercings, and the way people dress have nothing to do with belief. The only thing these people want is for everyone to fit in their box, they won't feel safe until they know everyone of their children's peers are just like them.
.

"We can elect a pregnant Senior Queen,
And the 'unwed daddy,' our Senior King."



Uh...yeah, 'cause we all know only non-religious teens go out and have sex and get pregnant and all that....

My dad was talking to a pastor one time, and he told me something that the pastor told him, something that I feel is very true: "I don't teach math in church, so why would I expect religion to be put in school?"

Seriously...churches were invented for a reason, and kids are only in school 6 or 7 hours a day for 5 days a week...that's about 30 to 35 hours out of a week. Do they mean to tell me that they can't possibly use all the other hundreds of hours for stuff related to their specific religion?

Angela
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Old 03-29-2004, 07:19 PM   #17
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Now that I think about it, I dont see why anyone is discussing this. I thikn the prayer is funny and not very serious. Correct me if I'm wrong though. To me it seems mockish of the whole argument about prayer in schools.
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Old 03-29-2004, 10:21 PM   #18
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Originally posted by RavenStar
Now that I think about it, I dont see why anyone is discussing this. I thikn the prayer is funny and not very serious. Correct me if I'm wrong though. To me it seems mockish of the whole argument about prayer in schools.
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I don't think so, I actually know a lot of people who would believe in this prayer wholeheartingly. But who knows?
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Old 04-01-2004, 09:59 AM   #19
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
I don't think so, I actually know a lot of people who would believe in this prayer wholeheartingly. But who knows?
Not as a prayer, but as a political statement....
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Old 04-01-2004, 10:30 AM   #20
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Not as a prayer, but as a political statement....
No, unfortunatly, to them they believe it as a prayer. I'm not kidding, I've seen prayers like this spoken with youth groups.
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