#4 - Idealism

melon · 04-21-2002, 05:17 PM

Is it silly to think that we can change the world, and, as such, we should just indulge in the hypocrisy and greed? Or is it best to continue one's idealism to the steadfast end?

Melon

------------------
"Still, I never understood the elevation of greed as a political credo. Why would anyone want to base a political programme on bottomless dissatisfaction and the impossibility of happiness? Perhaps that was its appeal: the promise of luxury that in fact promoted endless work." - Hanif Kureishi, Intimacy

Anthony · 04-21-2002, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by melon:
Is it silly to think that we can change the world, and, as such, we should just indulge in the hypocrisy and greed? Or is it best to continue one's idealism to the steadfast end?
Melon

I do not think its silly to think we can change the world, however, we shouldn't feel driven to do so, we should be more concerned with living, than with trying to make a difference. However, idealism is quite important.

I find that idealism, when allowed to take control, can be both inspirational and at the same time, destructive to the soul who can't repair disappointment, many idealists grow bitter and disillusioned with the reality of life, however, this is through no fault of idealism in itself, but their inability to reconcile realisim as a part of idealism. I think what is harder and more important to do is to merge idealism with realism, ie - let your idealism BE your reality, and be patient.

Ant.

z edge · 04-21-2002, 06:41 PM

It is silly if you try to change the world to fit your desires greed. Silly if you try to change everyone in the world, or to what extent.

My old neighbor was a religious fanatic, and would force that on me and basically implied to me that I was going to hell and he poured oil all over my porch and around the house. He was also bi-polar, and on lots of medication.

It may even be naieve to think we can make a difference, but to do our part and live with a clear conscience that we tried is a must.

[This message has been edited by z edge (edited 04-21-2002).]

sulawesigirl4 · 04-21-2002, 07:48 PM

Pragmatism not idealism.

Ok, I just got that from a Radiohead song, but to answer honestly? I don't see why it has to be all or nothing. I think you can acknowledge the fact that this world is probably not going to change in our lifetimes into a utopia, but that one should still hold onto the idealist way that things "ought" to be and do one's best to work towards that end. In the end, you are the only one that has to live with your own conscience.

80sU2isBest · 04-21-2002, 08:02 PM

Ideals? Uncouth.
fatalism needs youth
eat well, floss right
keep the hungry out of sight
save face--nip and tuck
praise yourself and pass the buck
and don't forget the best advice
everybody's get a price

Life unwinds like a cheap sweater
but since I gave up hope I feel a lot better
and the truth gets blurred like a wet letter
but since I gave up hope I feel a lot better

CannibalisticArtist · 04-21-2002, 10:36 PM

i think we need to all just ride the wave until it's done.

kobayashi · 04-22-2002, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sulawesigirl4:
Pragmatism not idealism.

like a pig
in a cage
on antibiotics.

you have to try your very best to make this world better, but don't be consumed by it. live life well and you are certain to change at least some part of our world
.
.
.
what's living life well? i have no idea.

Spiral_Staircase · 04-22-2002, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Anthony (with similar ideas from kobesan):
I do not think its silly to think we can change the world, however, we shouldn't feel driven to do so, we should be more concerned with living, than with trying to make a difference.

I don't know if I can answer this question myself, so I'll ask you guys....Why not? Why not be driven? Why not be consumed by it?

Peaseblossom · 04-22-2002, 11:49 AM

When I look back on all the people that have made a significant impact on my life- I hope I can do the same for someone else. I don't want to change the world, but if I can make one person's life better, I feel as though I've been successful.

80sU2isBest · 04-22-2002, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Peaseblossom:
When I look back on all the people that have made a significant impact on my life- I hope I can do the same for someone else. I don't want to change the world, but if I can make one person's life better, I feel as though I've been successful.

That's very good!

kobayashi · 04-23-2002, 02:13 AM

i would call that changing the world. a change in the world doesn't have to be something global, you change one persons life and it will continue on, they will 'pay it forward' so to speak

04-21-2002, 05:17 PM	#1
melon ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Ásgarðr Posts: 11,789 Local Time: 11:33 PM	#4 - Idealism Is it silly to think that we can change the world, and, as such, we should just indulge in the hypocrisy and greed? Or is it best to continue one's idealism to the steadfast end? Melon ------------------ "Still, I never understood the elevation of greed as a political credo. Why would anyone want to base a political programme on bottomless dissatisfaction and the impossibility of happiness? Perhaps that was its appeal: the promise of luxury that in fact promoted endless work." - Hanif Kureishi, Intimacy __________________

04-23-2002, 02:13 AM	#11
kobayashi Rock n' Roll Doggie VIP PASS Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: the ether Posts: 5,142 Local Time: 11:33 PM	i would call that changing the world. a change in the world doesn't have to be something global, you change one persons life and it will continue on, they will 'pay it forward' so to speak __________________

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04-21-2002, 06:41 PM	#3
z edge I serve MacPhisto Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: the HORROR Posts: 4,022 Local Time: 09:33 PM	It is silly if you try to change the world to fit your desires greed. Silly if you try to change everyone in the world, or to what extent. My old neighbor was a religious fanatic, and would force that on me and basically implied to me that I was going to hell and he poured oil all over my porch and around the house. He was also bi-polar, and on lots of medication. It may even be naieve to think we can make a difference, but to do our part and live with a clear conscience that we tried is a must. [This message has been edited by z edge (edited 04-21-2002).]

04-21-2002, 07:48 PM	#4
sulawesigirl4 Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Virginia Posts: 7,415 Local Time: 10:33 PM	Pragmatism not idealism. Ok, I just got that from a Radiohead song, but to answer honestly? I don't see why it has to be all or nothing. I think you can acknowledge the fact that this world is probably not going to change in our lifetimes into a utopia, but that one should still hold onto the idealist way that things "ought" to be and do one's best to work towards that end. In the end, you are the only one that has to live with your own conscience.

04-21-2002, 08:02 PM	#5
80sU2isBest Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid Join Date: Nov 2000 Posts: 4,970 Local Time: 10:33 PM	Ideals? Uncouth. fatalism needs youth eat well, floss right keep the hungry out of sight save face--nip and tuck praise yourself and pass the buck and don't forget the best advice everybody's get a price Life unwinds like a cheap sweater but since I gave up hope I feel a lot better and the truth gets blurred like a wet letter but since I gave up hope I feel a lot better

04-21-2002, 10:36 PM	#6
CannibalisticArtist War Child Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: West Coast babyeee Posts: 511 Local Time: 07:33 PM	i think we need to all just ride the wave until it's done.

04-22-2002, 11:49 AM	#9
Peaseblossom War Child Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Laker Country Posts: 576 Local Time: 03:33 AM	When I look back on all the people that have made a significant impact on my life- I hope I can do the same for someone else. I don't want to change the world, but if I can make one person's life better, I feel as though I've been successful.