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Old 05-20-2008, 05:11 PM   #21
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Originally posted by MaxFisher


no one has denied the strong correlation between cancer and smoking.
Don't be so sure of that... there are quite a few that deny the correlation, some post here.
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Old 05-20-2008, 05:17 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by MaxFisher


not sure what you're getting at here. no one has denied the strong correlation between cancer and smoking.
at one time 32,000* scientists did





* or some other industry, pro business, anti-government interference, number of scientists did
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Old 05-20-2008, 05:23 PM   #23
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Originally posted by deep


at one time 32,000* scientists did





* or some other industry, pro business, anti-government interference, number of scientists did
and they were wrong. but that doesn't mean this other group is.
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Old 05-20-2008, 05:36 PM   #24
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MaxFisher,

I'm with you on this one.


Here's the Petition Project Site:
http://www.petitionproject.org/
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Old 05-20-2008, 05:44 PM   #25
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Wow, that website makes this whole thing pretty laughable.

According to this website I would be a "scientist" being that I have a Bachelor in Science.

What a joke...
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Old 05-20-2008, 06:31 PM   #26
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Now that's a joke.
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Old 05-20-2008, 07:58 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by MaxFisher
according to this logic then Al Gore should not be counted as a credible source when it comes to this debate.
Is Al Gore forming original research? Or is he merely playing the role of a journalist; that is, presenting what credible climate science has theorized? I think, by all accounts, it's the latter, rather than the former.

Secondly, if most of these "scientists" are not in the field of climatology or similar scientific disciplines, that's obviously a problem. A "scientist" is not a blanket expert on all disciplines, including ones that they did not study.

(Of course, good luck telling "Dr. Laura" that a Ph.D in physiology--the study of mechanical, biological, and biochemical functions of living organisms--does not mean she's qualified to be a psychologist, but that's another story.)

Finally, as I've stated repeatedly in FYM, a good number of conservatives have rightly realized that the solutions to most leftist concerns about global warming are also solutions to right-wing concerns about national security. That is, a dramatic shift away from oil consumption means that we emit much less carbon dioxide into the atmosphere, solving many concerns about global warming, and it means that we also are far less reliant on unsavory OPEC nations, many of whom have little regard for Western values of freedom, human rights and democracy, and some of whom are (suspected) state sponsors of terrorism. Do we not think that the money we spend every day on oil won't find its way back to the same enemies we are trying to fight against? We're fooling ourselves to think that drilling in ANWR will somehow make us self-sufficient in oil. By every realistic estimate, it will take 20 years for a single drop of oil to ever make it out of there for our consumption, even if all legislative hurdles against oil exploration and drilling there were solved today. By that time, we could have moved onto a different source of fuel.

So rather than wasting time with the usual partisan bickering, let's move forward and kill potentially two concerns simultaneously.
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Old 05-20-2008, 10:04 PM   #28
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Originally posted by melon

Finally, as I've stated repeatedly in FYM, a good number of conservatives have rightly realized that the solutions to most leftist concerns about global warming are also solutions to right-wing concerns about national security. That is, a dramatic shift away from oil consumption means that we emit much less carbon dioxide into the atmosphere, solving many concerns about global warming, and it means that we also are far less reliant on unsavory OPEC nations, many of whom have little regard for Western values of freedom, human rights and democracy, and some of whom are (suspected) state sponsors of terrorism. Do we not think that the money we spend every day on oil won't find its way back to the same enemies we are trying to fight against? We're fooling ourselves to think that drilling in ANWR will somehow make us self-sufficient in oil. By every realistic estimate, it will take 20 years for a single drop of oil to ever make it out of there for our consumption, even if all legislative hurdles against oil exploration and drilling there were solved today. By that time, we could have moved onto a different source of fuel.

So rather than wasting time with the usual partisan bickering, let's move forward and kill potentially two concerns simultaneously.


accurate as this is, it still won't allow us to put troops into harm's way in order to scare up some votes.
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Old 05-21-2008, 12:23 AM   #29
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both my mother's parents were heavy smokers.

and neither of them died from cancer.
This just goes to show how hard it is to conclusively prove any theory. We can have strong evidence, however. In my opinion, it would be pretty stupid to ignore what evidence we do currently have on man-made global warming, even though this evidence is by no means conclusive.
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Old 05-24-2008, 04:42 PM   #30
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The petition website says that only 9000 of those "scientists" have PhDs. They seem to be counting anyone as a scientist who claims to have even a bachelor's degree in science.
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Old 05-25-2008, 09:50 PM   #31
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Well, it's nice we have some discussion going on.
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Old 05-26-2008, 02:24 PM   #32
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there are just too many people living on this planet
well, given the available natural resources there are

since i do think even those 32,000 scientists would agree with this
the question doesn't seem to be whether we are fucking up this planet but whether actually anything can be done
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Old 05-26-2008, 07:06 PM   #33
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Why is it that as I am approaching 40 I am finding that I agree with Deep more and more. HAHA
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Old 05-26-2008, 08:03 PM   #34
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because I have had the benefit of reading thoughtful posters, like yourself

and also, I making just a 'little' more effort in explaining my opinions
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Old 05-27-2008, 07:31 PM   #35
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I'm not one of the 32,000 scientists but al gore should give back his nobel peace prize. Thanks al for alarming all the liberals into believing that global warming is real. Actually...
Sorry to ruin the fun, but an ice age cometh | The Australian the planet is cooling. check it out
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Old 05-27-2008, 07:41 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by tim722 View Post
I'm not one of the 32,000 scientists but al gore should give back his nobel peace prize. Thanks al for alarming all the liberals into believing that global warming is real. Actually...
Sorry to ruin the fun, but an ice age cometh | The Australian the planet is cooling. check it out
If the planet is really cooling, then that is the best news I've heard in a long time and I look forward to the extended winters with lots of snow - but I have my doubts :Pray:
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Old 05-27-2008, 07:46 PM   #37
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If the planet is really cooling, then that is the best news I've heard in a long time and I look forward to the extended winters with lots of snow - but I have my doubts :Pray:
How is that good news? Reduced crop yields, longer transport times, floods and frosts; global cooling is no paradise.
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Old 05-27-2008, 08:04 PM   #38
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How is that good news? Reduced crop yields, longer transport times, floods and frosts; global cooling is no paradise.
Good news for skiers that like snow and are sick of the shortening winters.
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Old 05-27-2008, 09:47 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by tim722 View Post
I'm not one of the 32,000 scientists but al gore should give back his nobel peace prize. Thanks al for alarming all the liberals into believing that global warming is real. Actually...
Sorry to ruin the fun, but an ice age cometh | The Australian the planet is cooling. check it out
It's funny what conservatives consider a "source" these days...

truly pathetic.
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Old 05-27-2008, 09:50 PM   #40
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How is a geophysicist and astronaut being published in a major Australian paper not legitimate? I would give more credit than Al Gore, and a lost less than a peer reviewed article, or a series of rebuttal's to an article.

Your stock standard assumption is presumably that he is some liberty university hack, that really doesn't seem to be the case.

Philip K. Chapman
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