2016 US Presidential Election Thread - VIII

[BEAL]

Originally Posted by Irvine511

Sanders might win the general. But at this time in 2008 no one had ever heard of Jeremiah Wright. Or William Ayers.

Yup. There are always skeletons, both faux outrage and real, that come out in the general election.

At this time we know basically everything about Clinton. We know very little about Bernie.

Curious to see what comes out about Trump that hasn't been used by the GOP


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[Bluer White]

Originally Posted by BEAL

Curious to see what comes out about Trump that hasn't been used by the GOP


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Hope springs eternal.

[Oregoropa]

Originally Posted by Irvine511

But at this time in 2008 no one had ever heard of Jeremiah Wright. Or William Ayers.

Only if you watched-listened to Hannity

[BVS]

Originally Posted by Bluer White

Hope springs eternal.

Actually, it should be interesting. There's been whisperings on certain right wing websites. Nothing would matter to his base; he is not conservative, he is not Christian, and at one time or another he is everything they railed against in 2008. They like that he's white and hates the right people, this will not change. BUT in the general election it will be huge; his moral skeletons will spook off all the "christian" right folks that aren't in his corner, and the right skeleton if it exists would destroy what's left of his independent "crossover".


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[deep]

Bernie Sanders said today he will consider the Democratic Party's convention "contested," unless his opponent Hillary Clinton gets enough pledged delegates to win nomination without super delegates.

The Vermont senator essentially vowed to fight to win over those coveted party elites -- the super delegates -- until they formally vote in July.

"She will need super delegates to take her over the top of the convention in Philadelphia. In other words, the convention will be a contested contest," he said during a press conference in Washington, D.C. Sanders' top brass has been arguing this point for weeks, but this was the most direct statement the senator has made about his outlook on the remaining portion of the nominating process.

Bernie is right!

The super delegates should be released..

[Headache in a Suitcase]

That's not how this works. That's not how any of this works.

[BEAL]

It was all fine and dandy till now. Never seen so much whining....except from Trump

Bernie is a super delegate too. Maybe he should step down or not vote since they are all establishment


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[deep]

A tainted candidate, a shame the Dems didn't let Biden run.

[BigMacPhisto]

Originally Posted by BEAL

but the more research, the more I learned about Bernie.....I consider him a bit of a fraud. He has shown no record of implementing his ideas in congress, and no sign of a compromise to try and maybe get SOMETHING of his passed. I get the impression he's more of a lone wolf, and always wanting to be against the establishment...

That's just not true whatsoever. Bernie was known as the amendment king for attaching things he believed in to various bills before they were passed. Yes, his record is about the same as Clinton's in terms of getting major legislation they introduced passed...which would appear to be ineffective at first glance. But you have to remember that Republicans controlled the House for almost the entire time that Sanders was in there and the only time there's been truly complete party control while Sanders was in the Senate was from 2009 to the time that Scott Brown was elected. Sanders and Clinton being stonewalled by the Republican party doesn't really say much about the quality of their own agendas and it's certainly unfair to call Sanders a "fraud" when Clinton has been even less effective while a member of Congress.

And again, this thread stills has a lot of posters with a warped view of "compromise"...look, I know what you mean and we're pretty much all in agreement on that, but there's two sorts of compromise. The first is agreeing to get things done for the good of government...letting justices be nominated, passing a budget, etc. That's the kind of compromise that hasn't even existed lately thanks to Republican intransigence.

But when it comes to major bills, you are never, ever, ever, ever going to get the Republicans to agree on health care changes (of which they want none), abortion rights (of which they want none) and climate change (of which they don't believe). It's never going to happen unless that party suddenly changes its tune. Sanders isn't "my way or the highway" on this as he'd be willing to take any step in the right direction as was Clinton. Problem is, the GOP won't budge an inch. This sort of "compromise" discussion posted in here relentlessly is concerning something illusory that will never happen. Clinton is going to be just as useless as Sanders would be in this regard, and if Republicans keep up their tactics in delaying the essential functioning of government, Sanders or Clinton would be faced with the exact same situation that Obama has suffered through.

[BigMacPhisto]

Originally Posted by deep

Bernie is right!

The super delegates should be released..

Yep. If only for this one issue alone, he should stick out to the convention. Drop the super delegates for good, Clinton automatically wins the nomination and we can get on with our lives knowing the Democratic primary results will now entirely depend on the voters.

[deep]

I also think she gets the nomination with primary voters. It just looks illegit if super delegates put her over, and adds fuel to the fire of insider fixing it.

[BigMacPhisto]

Originally Posted by BEAL

At this time we know basically everything about Clinton. We know very little about Bernie.

I'd argue the exact opposite. Sanders has been an elected political figure for far longer. He has held consistent positions for decades unlike Clinton. He doesn't have millions of dollars in speaking fees and hundreds of millions of dollars in a global fund along with thousands of contacts around the world with which he's had closed door meetings.

And I'm not trying to throw together some Clinton conspiracy theories here. I'm just saying that Sanders has been the same guy for decades while Clinton has tons of involvement in things that aren't remotely transparent including her State department work.

Had Sanders been the nominee, I think there's nothing in his personal or political past that Republicans really could have used against the guy. It would have just been a lot of smear tactics and calling him a Socialist a lot. Whether or not you think Clinton is shady, it's certainly extremely easy to paint her as such.

[BigMacPhisto]

Originally Posted by deep

I also think she gets the nomination with primary voters. It just looks illegit if super delegates put her over, and adds fuel to the fire of insider fixing it.

She's the legitimate nominee if she has a pledged delegate majority though. I mean, that's enough to say she won the voters because it entails that she did in fact with with the voters.

I think the big cart-before-the-horse problem with Sanders campaigners was all of that calling of the super delegates and such. It's completely a non-issue until the minute Sanders earns the undisputed pledge delegate majority, then we're left with a situation where roughly 300 Democratic big wigs could tilt it all to Clinton. Instead, we had tons of young people calling up these Super Delegates (most of whom could really give two shits about what the voters in their area support given that they all tripped over each other to announce their Clinton endorsements, even when their states overwhelmingly voted for Sanders) and essentially whining about something that was going to have no effect on the outcome of all of this given that Sanders was trailing by 200-300 delegates at the time.

[BigMacPhisto]

Originally Posted by BEAL

It was all fine and dandy till now. Never seen so much whining....except from Trump

I recall plenty of whining in 2008 from a campaign that went so far as to use race baiting tactics...

[deep]

Trump: Even I would have helped Fiorina up
By NOLAN D. MCCASKILL 05/02/16 05:23 PM EDT

Carly Fiorina went down hard when she fell Sunday during a Ted Cruz event. But unlike the Texas senator, who didn’t come to the aid of his vice presidential pick, Donald Trump would have helped her up.
“Carly’s perfectly nice,” Trump said Monday during a rally in Carmel, Indiana. “By the way, she fell off the stage the other day. Did anybody see that? And Cruz didn’t do anything. Even I would have helped her, OK?”
It’s true, insisted Trump, who noted that his staff showed him the video before he kicked off his rally. Video of the incident shows Fiorina abruptly descending after introducing Cruz at a campaign event in Lafayette, Indiana, and Heidi Cruz quickly coming to help her up.
“They just showed it to me coming in. I said, ‘No, I didn’t see it.’ They just showed it to me and I said, ‘Wow, that’s really cruel,’” Trump said. “She fell off — she just went down. She went down a long way, right?”
Ted Cruz, however, continued engaging supporters as his wife helped Fiorina to her feet, although the incident occurred in front of him. In Trump’s summation, it was a weird situation.
“She went down right in front of him and he was talking,” Trump said. “He kept talking. He didn’t even look like — that was a weird deal. Man. And then they were both talking. She was talking from the back and he was talking from there. They’re both talking. No, it was weird.”



Read more: Trump: Even I would have helped Fiorina up - POLITICO
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How can you not smile at this.?

[Axver]

In summary,

Fuck Ted Cruz.

[deep]

Glenn Beck: Fast 1 day for God to help U.S.

The Lord has been petitioned
we will see what he decides


I think I know his answer

 

Fuck Ted Cruz.

[phanan]

I've never seen so much whining about super delegates before, especially since the end result would remain unchanged.

But because it's Clinton this year...

Yeah.

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Originally Posted by deep

Glenn Beck: Fast 1 day for God to help U.S.

The Lord has been petitioned
we will see what he decides


I think I know his answer

 

Fuck Ted Cruz.

I'll eat a steak instead.

[Irvine511]

Originally Posted by phanan

I've never seen so much whining about super delegates before, especially since the end result would remain unchanged.

But because it's Clinton this year...

Yeah.

To be fair, she is a woman. It's difficult for many men -- especially older men -- to accept the legitimacy of a more powerful and accomplished woman. They often act as if she isn't there, and try to go above her head or behind her back and never afford her the courtesy and respect she'd be given if she were a man in her position.

And if she pushes back, if she were to respond aggressively as any man would in her position, well, what a bitch. Just like that man hater Lena Dunham.