2016 US Presidential Election Thread Part V - Page 29 - U2 Feedback

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Old 02-20-2016, 08:38 AM   #561
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It's the equivalent to the FBI demanding a master key to every American house's front door lock and publicly announcing where they keep it. It's stupid and blindingly unconstitutional, and Apple would be insane to agree to it. It would instantly kill their entire enterprise business (no company is going to buy iPhones for their employees if they have zero security).

This is not quite true. Codes more complicated that four-digit numbers would still be essentially impossible to break.

Breaking the encryption is NP-complete, which basically means that there's no way to do it (barring proof that P=NP, which nobody thinks to be true) other than literally trying every combination. iPhones only let you try ten combinations before destroying the encrypted data; that function is that the FBI is asking Apple to disable. And only for this phone, although maybe that could arguably be used more commonly in the future.

But the brute-forcing thing is important, because iPhone PINs don't have to be four-digit numbers. There are only 10^4 = 10,000 possible combinations for a four digit code, and it won't take the FBI very long to get the right one. Say they can try ten per second, it'll take 1,000 seconds = 17 minutes.

iPhone passcodes can also be much more complicated. An eight digit numerical code would have 10^8 = 100,000,000 combinations, taking 10,000,000 seconds, or about 115 days. Still doable for a determined FBI, I guess, but less likely to be worth their time. And every number you add doubles the time.

Or you can do as I do, a 15 digit code with letters (capital and lowercase), numbers, and symbols. Each character can be one of roughly 80 options, meaning that there are ~80^15 possible combinations. That's about 35,184,372,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 combinations (to as much precision as Google will give me). Or about 111,568,910,000,000,000,000 years at ten tries per second. Which is about 8,073,003,762 times the age of the universe.

So, the moral of the story is that iPhone data can still be effectively encrypted with a longer/more complicated passcode, which would be for all intents and purposes impossible for the FBI to break, even with the patch that they're asking for.


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Old 02-20-2016, 08:48 AM   #562
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I don't know how, legally, if they have a warrant/court order to look at the phone, that Apple has any leg to stand on.
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Old 02-20-2016, 09:42 AM   #563
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The thing is... Apple can do it... but what happens the next time the FBI comes knocking on the door with another phone? "Just this one time" is a super weak argument.
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Old 02-20-2016, 10:30 AM   #564
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Old 02-20-2016, 10:45 AM   #565
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Please tell me someone already mentioned this:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...ty-tricks.html
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Old 02-20-2016, 10:47 AM   #566
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The thing is... Apple can do it... but what happens the next time the FBI comes knocking on the door with another phone? "Just this one time" is a super weak argument.
Writing the special software may not be easy for Apple (for iOS 8/9). In the past, Apple complied with requests 70 times (for prior iOS versions) with weaker encryption. The Electronic Frontier Foundation has a good technical write-up.

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2016/0...le-iphone-case

A couple of points that were under-reported are that it was a work cell phone (the personal one was destroyed), and that the passcode was changed sometime after the government had the phone in its possession.

I agree that the FBI and foreign governments could request the same backdoor, even as a condition for selling phones in their countries.

Regarding the legal issues, the ACLU is on Apple's side:
https://www.aclu.org/news/aclu-comme...-unlock-iphone
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Old 02-20-2016, 12:20 PM   #567
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Of course I'm going to be grossed out by maggots on meat!


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Well if you're not grossed out by maggots you might be tricked into voting for one The Trump campaign ran a similar poll prior to running to make sure he could find enough minions.


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Old 02-20-2016, 12:23 PM   #568
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The thing is... Apple can do it... but what happens the next time the FBI comes knocking on the door with another phone? "Just this one time" is a super weak argument.
As I understand it they aren't even asking for "just this one time". They're asking for software to be written to be able to access any iPhone whenever, without having to go through Apple anymore.

That's a bad enough idea in the FBI's hands, what are less scrupulous governments going to do with access to their citizens' data like that? Like I said, once the back door is built in it's going to be cracked more or less immediately.
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Old 02-20-2016, 12:33 PM   #569
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As I understand it they aren't even asking for "just this one time". They're asking for software to be written to be able to access any iPhone whenever, without having to go through Apple anymore.



That's a bad enough idea in the FBI's hands, what are less scrupulous governments going to do with access to their citizens' data like that? Like I said, once the back door is built in it's going to be cracked more or less immediately.

That was initially the case, but news updates suggest the FBI has "settled," so to say. Where they basically want apple to write the firmware for just ONE phone and then Apple can keep the software and not distribute it.
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Old 02-20-2016, 12:48 PM   #570
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Old 02-20-2016, 01:16 PM   #571
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I agree that the FBI and foreign governments could request the same backdoor, even as a condition for selling phones in their countries.
How is this different than foreign governments imposing all sorts of regulations as a matter of a business operating or making sales of products in their countries? And why should they not be allowed to do so?
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Old 02-20-2016, 02:25 PM   #572
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Trump would water board Tim Cook to get the data.


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Old 02-20-2016, 02:52 PM   #573
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The thing is... Apple can do it... but what happens the next time the FBI comes knocking on the door with another phone? "Just this one time" is a super weak argument.
I'll guess Apple finds a smart way to accommodate the courts. Probably reasonable that they do here.

In the meantime, I'd slow-walk and shamelessly take advantage of the free advertising for the company's gadgets.

"The best of the FBI has had access to an iPhone for over two months. They have no clue how to break into it."
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Old 02-20-2016, 04:21 PM   #574
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Hilary won in Nevada, or at least expected to be. oh well.
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Old 02-20-2016, 04:38 PM   #575
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Old 02-20-2016, 04:44 PM   #576
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How is this different than foreign governments imposing all sorts of regulations as a matter of a business operating or making sales of products in their countries? And why should they not be allowed to do so?
Products like cellphones/smartphones are different from cars and clothes. I'm sure the Saudis have imprisoned (or worse) people for messages they found on phones (e.g. for acts illegal there but legal here). I doubt Apple would cave to the Saudis, but it's unfortunate RIM did.
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Old 02-20-2016, 06:28 PM   #577
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Trump projected to win SC. Whee!
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Old 02-20-2016, 07:45 PM   #578
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Jeb dropping out now. Giving speech on live TV.


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Old 02-20-2016, 08:01 PM   #579
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Surprised he didn't see it through. I figure he will support John Kasich.
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Old 02-20-2016, 08:06 PM   #580
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finally i don't have to refer to him as Jeb!
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