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Old 10-23-2008, 06:46 PM   #1
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2008 U.S. Presidential Campaign Discussion Thread-Part 11

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Who is Al Qaeda supporting for President this time?
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Old 10-23-2008, 06:50 PM   #2
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I have never heard so many normally apolitical people express so much fear about the impending "socialism" and yet when asked about specifically what they are afraid of be so totally clueless. And this is in firmly blue state California, albeit in red-state-like-South-Orange-County.

I wish Barack would go on the offensive more........the scare tactics and bullshit rhetoric (combined with a sadly lacking and misinformed/badly educated general public) are definitely making inroads.
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Old 10-23-2008, 06:58 PM   #3
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Political Punch

Who is Al Qaeda supporting for President this time?
Hey Diamond, looks like you have your big-name endorser !

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Old 10-23-2008, 07:02 PM   #4
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I have never heard so many normally apolitical people express so much fear about the impending "socialism" and yet when asked about specifically what they are afraid of be so totally clueless.

They read it in an email. It must be true!!1!!
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Old 10-23-2008, 07:16 PM   #5
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PALIN: Oh, I guess just people who think that they're better than anyone else. And-- John McCain and I are so committed to serving every American. Hard-working, middle-class Americans who are so desiring of this economy getting put back on the right track. And winning these wars. And America's starting to reach her potential. And that is opportunity and hope provided everyone equally. So anyone who thinks that they are-- I guess-- better than anyone else, that's-- that's my definition of elitism.
You know my definition of elitism?

Spending $150,000 on clothes in a month.
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Old 10-23-2008, 07:17 PM   #6
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From the old Palin thread (this really belongs here), purpleoscar posted this from McCain's spending plan:

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The McCain administration would reserve all savings from victory in the Iraq and Afghanistan operations in the fight against Islamic extremists for reducing the deficit. Since all their costs were financed with deficit spending, all their savings must go to deficit reduction.
Has anyone heard a load of shit like this before?

Savings from victory? What the hell does that mean?
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Old 10-23-2008, 07:26 PM   #7
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Scott McClellan Endorses Obama

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Former White House press secretary Scott McClellan, who angered many Republicans earlier this year with a memoir criticizing President Bush, said today that he's voting for Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama.

McClellan told CNN that Obama's message "is very similar to the one that Governor Bush ran on in 2000," apparently referring to the current president's early pitch as a reformer and a moderate.

"From the very beginning I have said I am going to support the candidate that has the best chance for changing the way Washington works and getting things done and I will be voting for Barack Obama," McClellan said during the interview, which was taped for the Saturday broadcast of a new CNN show, "D.L. Hughley Breaks the News."

McClellan's endorsement marks the latest prominent Republican to defect to Obama. Former secretary of state Colin Powell last Sunday threw his endorsement behind the Illinois senator while sharply criticizing the campaign tactics of GOP candidate John McCain and his running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin.
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Old 10-23-2008, 07:27 PM   #8
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The funny thing about their ‘elite’ definition is that they’re the only ones actually talking down to and dismissing a massive part of the country by calling them not ‘real’ Americans. I’m yet to see Obama or Biden refer to McCain/Palin supporters at all (aside from addressing the tone of their rallies when asked about it), let alone in a negative way, nor have I heard or read of them claiming their supporters or base are better than McCain/Palins, yet McCain/Palin do it all the time. It’s seems to be about 30% of their total rallying cry. I think it’s hilarious that their supporters fall for that shit hook, line and sinker.
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Old 10-23-2008, 07:55 PM   #9
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Old 10-23-2008, 08:13 PM   #10
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Old 10-23-2008, 08:37 PM   #11
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Political Dashboard - 2008 Presidential Election on Yahoo! News
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Old 10-23-2008, 08:47 PM   #12
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Has anyone heard a load of shit like this before?

There's a lot he says that I haven't heard before.
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Old 10-23-2008, 08:49 PM   #13
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Step 1. "win" in Iraq.

Step 2. ?????????

Step 3. PROFIT!!!!!!
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Old 10-23-2008, 09:05 PM   #14
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Ha! Underpants Gnomes!
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Old 10-23-2008, 09:06 PM   #15
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Step 3. PROFIT!!!!!!

C'mon now. In all fairness, Cheney and Haliburton are already at step 3.
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Old 10-23-2008, 09:12 PM   #16
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They read it in an email. It must be true!!1!!
I don't mind people voting for anyone as long as they know what the hell what their candidate stands for, and if you vote against Obama because he's 'socialist' then yes, you ARE an idiot. At least know what the word means, and ask yourself, would Bernanke, Powell, McLellan et al really endorse a socialist ? Really ?

I'm beginning to think "elitist" really means "anyone who puts more than 2 seconds into looking closely at the candidates and their policies rather than just take our word for it that he's an un-american commie muslim terrorist, well, we didn't say that but if you want to think it go right ahead we won't argue with you"
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Old 10-23-2008, 09:26 PM   #17
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C'mon now. In all fairness, Cheney and Haliburton are already at step 3.

I can just see Cheney sitting back smirking, saying, "Now! he gets it".
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Old 10-23-2008, 09:29 PM   #18
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Blame game: GOP forms circular firing squad

A fascinating look at how the party is imploding, while some are publicly performing campaign postmortems.

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With despair rising even among many of John McCain’s own advisors, influential Republicans inside and outside his campaign are engaged in an intense round of blame-casting and rear-covering—-much of it virtually conceding that an Election Day rout is likely.

A McCain interview published Thursday in the Washington Times sparked the latest and most nasty round of Washington finger-pointing, with senior GOP hands close to President Bush and top congressional aides denouncing the candidate for what they said was an unfocused message and poorly executed campaign.

McCain told the Times that the administration “let things get completely out of hand” through eight years of bad decisions about Iraq, global warming, and big spending.

The candidate’s strategists in recent days have become increasingly vocal in interviews and conference calls about what they call unfair news media coverage and Barack Obama’s wide financial advantage — both complaints laying down a post-election storyline for why their own efforts proved ineffectual.

These public comments offer a whiff of an increasingly acrid behind-the-scenes GOP meltdown—a blame game played out through not-for-attribution comments to reporters that operatives know will find their way into circulation.

Top Republican officials have let it be known they are distressed about McCain’s organization. Coordination between the McCain campaign and Republican National Committee, always uneven, is now nearly dysfunctional, with little high-level contact and intelligence-sharing between the two.

“There is no communication,” lamented one top Republican. “It drives you crazy.”

At his Northern Virginia headquarters, some McCain aides are already speaking of the campaign in the past tense. Morale, even among some of the heartiest and most loyal staffers, has plummeted. And many past and current McCain advisors are warring with each other over who led the candidate astray.

One well-connected Republican in the private sector was shocked to get calls and resumes in the past few days from what he said were senior McCain aides – a breach of custom for even the worst-off campaigns.

“It’s not an extraordinarily happy place to be right now,” said one senior McCain aide. “I’m not gonna lie. It’s just unfortunate.”

“If you really want to see what ‘going negative’ is in politics, just watch the back-stabbing and blame game that we’re starting to see,” said Mark McKinnon, the ad man who left the campaign after McCain wrapped up the GOP primary. “And there’s one common theme: Everyone who wasn’t part of the campaign could have done better.”

“The cake is baked,” agreed a former McCain strategist. “We’re entering the finger-pointing and positioning-for-history part of the campaign. It’s every man for himself now.”

A circular firing squad is among the most familiar political rituals of a campaign when things aren’t going well. But it is rare for campaign aides to be so openly participating in it well before Election Day.

One current senior campaign official gave voice to this “Law of the Jungle” ethic, defending the campaign against second-guessers who say it was a mistake to throw away his experience message in an attempt to match Obama’s “change” mantra.

“Everybody agreed with the strategy,” said this official. “We were unlikely to be successful without being aggressive and taking risks.”

Running as a steady hand and basing a campaign on Obama’s sparse resume was a political loser, it was decided.

“The pollsters and the entire senior leadership of campaign believe that experience versus change was not a winning message and formulation, the same way it was no winning formula with Hillary Clinton.”

Beyond the obvious reputation-burnishing—much of it by professional operatives whose financial livelihoods depend on ensuring that they are not blamed for a bad campaign—there is a more substantive dimension. Barring a big McCain comeback, and a turnabout in numerous congressional races where the party is in trouble, the GOP is on the brink of a soul-searching debate about what to do to reclaim power. Much of that debate will hinge on appraisals of what McCain could have done differently.

That is why his criticisms of Bush hit such an exposed nerve Thursday. Was McCain hobbled by party label at a time when the incumbent president is so unpopular? Or did his uneven response to the financial rescue—and endorsement of such non-conservative ideas as a massive government purchase of homeowner mortgages—seal his fate?

Dan Schnur, a McCain communications advisor during his 2000 run and now a political analyst at the University of Southern California, said McCain should step in to halt the defeatism and self-serving leaks—an epidemic of incontinence—on his own team.

“It’s a natural and human reaction when you’re struggling to make up ground, but that doesn’t make it right,” Schnur said. “As long as the campaign is still potentially winnable, these are an unnecessary distraction. This looks like it’s reached a point where the candidate has to step in himself and crack some heads to remind everyone why they came to work for him in the first place.”

Offered a chance to respond to the suggestion that the McCain campaign is awash in defeatism, a McCain official delivered a decidedly measured appraisal: “We have a real chance in Pennsylvania. We are in trouble in Colorado, Nevada and Virginia. We have lost Iowa and New Mexico. We are OK in Missouri, Ohio and Florida. Our voter intensity is good and we can match their buy dollar for dollar starting today till the election. It’s a long shot but it’s worth fighting for.”

Earlier this week, campaign manager Rick Davis complained to reporters in a conference call that reporters refuse to call out Obama for alleged shady fund-raising tactics, but in the process revealed no small amount of envy about the Democratic financial advantage. "Now, I'd love to have that $4 million right now to put into Pennsylvania,” he said. “It'd be a good thing for our campaign. I think it's a game-changer if I can slap all of that right on Philadelphia media market. It's an expensive place. And, yet, Barack Obama gets away with raising illegitimate money and spending it.”

A New York Times Sunday magazine piece chronicling McCain’s campaign featured numerous not-for-attribution McCain staffers participating in what amounted to a campaign autopsy. One aide told writer Robert Draper, “For better or worse our campaign has been fought from tactic to tactic,” and one criticized McCain’s debate performance.

Long-time McCain alter ego Mark Salter gave an interview to Atlantic writer Jeffrey Goldberg criticizing everything from the news media to the vagaries of fate: “Iraq was supposed to be the issue of the campaign. We assumed it was our biggest challenge. Funny how things work.”

Many conservative commentators likewise have been writing of McCain’s campaign in a valedictory tone. Among this group there is an emerging debate—one with the potential to last for a long time about the role of vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin.

One school—including syndicated columnist Kathleen Parker and Peggy Noonan of the Wall Street Journal—called her a drag on the ticket and implicitly rebuked McCain’s judgment in picking her. Another school believes she is the future of the party, a view backed by Fred Barnes of the Weekly Standard: “Whether they know it or not, Republicans have a huge stake in Palin. If, after the election, they let her slip into political obscurity, they’ll be making a huge mistake.”

In The Week, former Bush speechwriter David Frum wrote of McCain’s travails in a way that seemed to take defeat for granted and warned the GOP faces a long road back. “That’s not a failure of campaign tactics. It’s not even a failure of strategy. It’s a failure of the Republican Party and conservative movement to adapt to the times.”

While Frum was focused on the long view of history, many Republicans in Washington are much more in the moment—and much harsher in their denunciation of McCain and his team.

A senior Republican strategist, speaking with authority about the view of the party’s establishment, issued a wide-ranging critique of the McCain high command: “Lashing out at past Republican Congresses, … echoing your opponent's attacks on you instead of attacking your opponent, and spending 150,000 hard dollars on designer clothes when congressional Republicans are struggling for money, and when your senior campaign staff are blaming each other for the loss in The New York Times [Magazine] 10 days before the election, you’re not doing much to energize your supporters.

“The fact is, when you’re the party standard-bearer, you have an obligation to fight to the finish,” this strategist continued. “I think they can still win. But if they don’t think that, they need to look at how Bob Dole finished out his campaign in 1996 and not try to take down as many Republicans with them as they can. Instead of campaigning in Electoral College states, Dole was campaigning in places he knew he didn’t have a chance to beat Clinton, but where he could energize key House and Senate races.”

A House Republican leadership aide in an e-mail was no more complimentary: “The staff has been remarkably undisciplined, too eager to point fingers, unable to craft any coherent long term strategy. The handling of Palin (not her performances, but her rollout and availability) has been nothing short of political malpractice. I understand the candidate might have other opinions and might be dictating some aspects of the campaign to staff – but the lack of discipline and ability to draft and stick to a coherent message is unreal. You have half of the campaign saying Ayers is a major issue, and then the candidate out there saying he doesn’t care about a washed up terrorist. You have McCain one day echoing Milton Friedman and the next day echoing FDR.”
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Old 10-23-2008, 09:40 PM   #19
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McClellan told CNN that Obama's message "is very similar to the one that Governor Bush ran on in 2000," apparently referring to the current president's early pitch as a reformer and a moderate.

"From the very beginning I have said I am going to support the candidate that has the best chance for changing the way Washington works and getting things done and I will be voting for Barack Obama," McClellan said during the interview, which was taped for the Saturday broadcast of a new CNN show, "D.L. Hughley Breaks the News."

McCellan get's a thumbs ups from FYMers

and I got a scolding when I compared Obama 2008 to Bush 2000
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Old 10-23-2008, 09:59 PM   #20
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McCellan get's a thumbs ups from FYMers

and I got a scolding when I compared Obama 2008 to Bush 2000
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McClellan told CNN that Obama's message "is very similar to the one that Governor Bush ran on in 2000," apparently referring to the current president's early pitch as a reformer and a moderate.

"From the very beginning I have said I am going to support the candidate that has the best chance for changing the way Washington works and getting things done and I will be voting for Barack Obama," McClellan said during the interview, which was taped for the Saturday broadcast of a new CNN show, "D.L. Hughley Breaks the News."

And rightly so.

And what he says is that the message is very similar to the early Bush campaign. Your remarks were more about the person Obama and the person Bush and their similarities.
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