2008 U.S. Presidential Campaign Discussion Thread-Part 10.

[maycocksean]

I don't think McCain had any racist intentions in his comment about "whipping Obama's you-know-what" BUT. . .it was the first comment I've heard in this campaign that brought a visceral response from me. It may not have been intentionally racist but it felt racist to me. That kind of phrasing is reminiscent of the kinds of things I've heard when someone wanted to "send a message."

I didn't get that sense from the "that one" comment in the debate, but this statement--yeah, there was the familiar mix of anxiety and sick-at-your-stomach that comes when someone makes a racist statement.

[maycocksean]

Oh and this from my spokesman:

"maycocksean would like to express his severe disapproval of the idea that Bush is a terrorist. As a so-called 'left-leaning' poster on FYM he categorically rejects any such extreme suggestions about President Bush."

Hope that is satisfactory.

[A_Wanderer]

That sounds like terrorist talk to me

[hiphop]

Lol, its amusing how everyone is always so dead serious in contradicting Strongbows messages while he just brings up another twist/topic that everyone jumps on!

[Irvine511]

Originally Posted by Earnie Shavers

It's a U2 forum? It's not just FYM. If you put the Election Poll out there in every sub-forum from Lemonade Stand to PLEBA and everything in between, I think it was balance a little more, but not much more. Obama would still dominate.

much how Obama is dominating this election.

perhaps the reason why there are so many Obama supporters in here is because there are so many Obama supporters out there.

[MrsSpringsteen]

Virginia Beach yesterday

[MrsSpringsteen]

YouTube - McCain Declines To Condemn Obama-Osama Comparison

[U2democrat]

Ah, the good ol' Virginia GOP. They're going to get a rude awakening on my birthday...November 5th. When the rest of the country has moved on they'll be left in the dust wondering what happened.

[diamond]

ayers was more than "just a guy in the neighborhood"

we on the Right are just looking for a little:

Peace,
Love
and
Honesty.


The Left isn't oppose to that- now are they?

<>

[MrsSpringsteen]

Yes it's all so peace loving and honest Makes me want to sing Kumbaya

[Zoomerang96]

its easy to rag on mccain, but i actually like him a bit more after reading this and seeing a few clips of him on tv where he does his bit to quell comparisons to him to a terrorist.

McCain tussles with Palin over whipping up a mob mentality - Times Online

palin is the one who's gone absolutely mental, on the other hand.

[diamond]

Why is ACORN, one of Obama's affiliates registering "people" like Mickey Mouse to vote?

Mickey Mouse Tries to Register to Vote - FOXNews.com Elections

Voter Fraud anyone?

ACORN GROUP SUPPLIED NEARLY 4,000 FAKE VOTER REGISTRATIONS IN CLEVELAND AREA - New York Post

What's so funny bout

Peace Love and Honesty?

<>

[Utoo]

Originally Posted by diamond

ayers was more than "just a guy in the neighborhood"

we on the Right are just looking for a little:

Peace,
Love
and
Honesty.


The Left isn't oppose to that- now are they?

<>

Shouldn't "Honesty" include understanding context and true meaning? Republicans seem to love taking a phrase, twisting it, and then playing that phrase as if it's the essence of what someone has said. Look at Palin---she took the one line of the Troopergate report that said it was within her power to fire the guy, and she's touting that line to say that she's cleared of all charges---while the report ALSO said that she's guilty of violating ethics law, which was the point of the report in the first place.

The FULL Obama quote from the debate in which he talked about Ayers in his neighborhood:

STEPHANOPOULOS:Can you explain that relationship for the voters and explain to Democrats why it won't be a problem?

OBAMA: George, but this is an example of what I'm talking about. This is a guy who lives in my neighborhood, who's a professor of English in Chicago who I know and who I have not received some official endorsement from. He's not somebody who I exchange ideas from on a regular basis.

Saying "he's just a guy in my neighborhood" would imply that he has no relationship with him whatsoever outside of living near him. Instead, Obama never used the brush-off word "just," and did say that he knows him. In other interviews and appearances, he has detailed more of what he's done with the guy.

You're so full of spin, it's sickening.

Again, if we're really going to assume that Obama and Ayers shared anti-American ideas and philosophies because they sat on the same educational board together, then we must also assume that:

1). John McCain believed in the philosophies of the Apartheid
2). John McCain believes in eugenics
3). John McCain believes in white supremacy
4). John McCain applauds those who shoot abortion-performing doctors

Riddle me this.

YouTube - Countdown: McCain's Guilt By Association

[Irvine511]

the True Believers are having a collective nervous breakdown:

Worst Case Scenario
What an Obama administration and a heavily Democratic Congress would accomplish.
by Fred Barnes
10/14/2008 12:00:00 AM


John McCain trails Barack Obama and shows no signs, at the moment anyway, of propelling himself into the lead. Democrats lead in eight Senate seats currently held by Republicans and are close in three others. In the House, Republicans once thought they'd lose only 5 to 10 seats. Now things look worse.

Thanks particularly to the month-long financial crisis, Republicans are in extremely poor shape with the election three weeks away. This means the worst case scenario is now a distinct possibility: a Democrat in the White House, a Democratic Senate with a filibuster-proof majority, and a Democratic House with a bolstered majority.

If this scenario unfolds, Washington would become a solidly liberal town again for the first time in decades. And the prospects of passing the liberal agenda--nearly all of it--would be bright. Enacting major parts of it would be even brighter. You can forget about bipartisanship.

Start with "card check." It would permit organized labor to unionize the private sector without winning a certification election by secret ballot. It's easy to get workers to sign cards saying they want a union, but it's hard to get them to vote that way when labor organizers aren't hounding them. Card check is labor's last hope for more dues-paying union members.

Unions simply aren't popular and neither is card check. But it passed the House last year, only to be blocked in the Senate by a Republican filibuster. In 2009, with Washington controlled by Democrats, it would sail through Congress and President Obama would sign it. After all, neither Obama nor congressional Democrats have bucked organized labor even once.

Then Democrats might go after a longstanding target of big labor, section 14(b) of the Taft-Hartley Act. It allows states to enact right-to-work laws, which bar workers from being forced to join a union. Twenty-two states have right-to-work laws.

The liberal scheme for killing conservative talk radio--the so-called fairness doctrine--would stand an excellent chance of becoming law. It would require radio stations to offer equal time, for free, to anyone seeking to reply to broadcasts featuring political opinion. To remain profitable, many stations would have to drop conservative talk shows, a major medium for communicating conservative ideas, rather than give up hours of free time. Obama has said he opposes the fairness doctrine. But would he veto it? Not likely.

Obama would nominate liberals to fill Supreme Court vacancies--no doubt about that--with the strong likelihood they'd be confirmed. As a senator, he voted against John Roberts and Sam Alito. And free trade agreements would become a thing of the past, given liberal and labor opposition.

What about Obama's health care plan? He's described it as step or two away from a single payer, government-run health system like Canada's. While expensive, its chances of passage would be quite good.

A bad economy, however, might keep Obama and his allies in Congress from passing his entire package of tax increases and his "cap and trade" proposal for curbing the emission of greenhouse gases. Obama has called for increasing the tax rate on capital gains, dividends, and the income of top earners, and raising the cap on payroll taxes. But tax hikes would worsen, not stimulate, a weak economy. So that might make Democrats balk--except they might not. For liberals, requiring the well-to-do to pay higher taxes is a matter of ideology.

So is cap and trade. It would drive up the cost of energy, another downer for the economy, but Democrats believe it's necessary to save the planet. Besides, the environmental lobby would demand cap and trade's enactment. And environmentalists have as tight a grip on Democrats as labor does. Obama has never crossed environmentalists.

As for foreign and national security policy, there'd be nothing stopping President Obama from doing what he wanted in a liberal-dominated Washington, including a quick troop exit from Iraq and presidential-level talks with anti-American dictators. Congress would go along. The media would cheer.

But who knows? Maybe McCain and Republicans will rally their forces and keep the worst from happening--the worst, that is, from a conservative standpoint. The campaign has changed direction twice in less than two months, first when McCain picked Sarah Palin as his running mate, then when the financial panic hit. There could be a third game changer.

If not, we face the liberal deluge.

ultimately, they have only Bush to blame.

though Obama's brilliant campaign deserves some of that too.

[U2isthebest]

Originally Posted by Irvine511

the True Believers are having a collective nervous breakdown:






ultimately, they have only Bush to blame.

though Obama's brilliant campaign deserves some of that too.

I feel so glad to live in a state that already has two awesome Democratic senators. Debbie Stabenow, and my man Carl Levin. The man is just awesome.

[Lila64]

I think I've caught up now

Commentary: So what if Obama were a Muslim or an Arab? - CNN.com

By Campbell Brown
CNN

Editor's note: Campbell Brown anchors CNN's "Campbell Brown: Election Center" at 8 p.m. ET Mondays through Fridays. She delivered this commentary during the "Cutting through the Bull" segment of Monday night's broadcast.

Campbell Brown says it's on the record that Sen. Barack Obama is a Christian, but why should that matter?


NEW YORK (CNN) -- You may find it hard to believe that this remains an issue in this campaign, but it does.

The candidates, both candidates, are still getting questions about Barack Obama's ethnicity and religion. If you are even semi-informed, then by now you already know that of course, Barack Obama is an American.

Of course, Barack Obama is a Christian. Yet just a few days ago, there was a woman at a rally for John McCain incorrectly calling Obama an Arab:

Woman at rally: I don't trust Obama. I have read about him and he's an Arab.

Sen. John McCain: No ma'am, no ma'am. He's a decent family man, citizen that I just happen to have disagreements with on fundamental issues. That's what this campaign is all about. He's not, thank you.

Now, I commend Sen. McCain for correcting that woman, for setting the record straight. But I do have one question -- so what if he was?

So what if Obama was Arab or Muslim? So what if John McCain was Arab or Muslim? Would it matter?

When did that become a disqualifier for higher office in our country? When did Arab and Muslim become dirty words? The equivalent of dishonorable or radical?

Whenever this gets raised, the implication is that there is something wrong with being an Arab-American or a Muslim. And the media is complicit here, too.

We've all been too quick to accept the idea that calling someone Muslim is a slur.

I feel like I am stating the obvious here, but apparently it needs to be said: There is a difference between radical Muslims who support jihad against America and Muslims who want to practice their religion freely and have normal lives like anyone else.

There are more than 1.2 million Arab-Americans and about 7 million Muslim-Americans, former Cabinet secretaries, members of Congress, successful business people, normal average Americans from all walks of life.

These are the people being maligned here, and we can only imagine how this conversation plays in the Muslim world. We can't tolerate this ignorance -- not in the media, not on the campaign trail.


Of course, he's not an Arab. Of course, he's not a Muslim. But honestly, it shouldn't matter.

[U2isthebest]

I agree completely with that article. It's ridiculous that in a country that hangs by the thread of the Constitution, which apparently most Americans aren't acquainted with,(they've been too busy falling off turnip trucks, I'm guessing) someone's race, religion, gender, sexual orientation, etc. is a factor in determining their qualification to be president. It's a slap in the face to the democracy and equality that is supposed to be embedded in the fabric of our country.

[Lila64]

[U2isthebest]

On a side note, I usually can't stand Campbell Brown. She's too Diana Christensen a la 'Network', but she's really been on top of things lately.

[Strongbow]

Originally Posted by Diemen

1)Being a pacifist is not a prerequisite to holding a generally liberal world view. Nor is it necessarily indicative of conservative world view.

Its a view that essentially only liberals have, those on the far left. Many U2 fans especially in here have mistakenly believed that U2 shared their views on that issue. Its been confirmed multiple times that they are wrong in this belief.

2)So you found several quotes. And then there's the bulk of their interviews where it is clear that their world view is mostly liberal.

Quotes that were actually on controversial political issues! The bulk of U2's interviews are actually not political and often don't involve stances that can be construed as taking "right" or "left" stance on a political issue.

Even if they generally lean more to the left than the right, there are many things that are simply unknown about their political views. Many Republicans would be considered socially liberal when it comes to social issues, but on economics and security, they are definitely not liberal.

I'm sure if U2 took the politicalcompass.org test, they would test somewhere in the liberal quadrant. But, guess what, so did I. But I don't consider myself to be a liberal.

The reality is that much of U2's political views are unknown and they have views than range from being liberal to conservative.