MERGED--> the problem with HTDAAB + no driffent track order can change the fact

[TheFlyOnTheWall]

Re: Re: the problem with HTDAAB

Moreover, what moves you may not move you and visa versa. October has an incredible impact on me, but not on many others.
/B]

But somethings move everyone. Well, almost. Like WOWY or One or AIWIY - they're all great songs, no one can say they aren't and that's how it is.

 

[neutral]

Expect nothing, then you're never disappointed.

Joke, but we're not going to be seeing any more Joshua Trees or Achtung Babys anytime soon.

I really hope not since they're 18 and 14 years old.

But somethings move everyone. Well, almost. Like WOWY or One or AIWIY - they're all great songs, no one can say they aren't and that's how it is.

Yes, they can say that if that is their opinion. (and no, opinions cannot be "wrong' ). Music is subjective, there's no "how it is" or truth or fact etc.

 

[dandy]

I really hope not since they're 18 and 14 years old.

damn, i'm getting old.

 

[neutral]

I know, that was the first thing I thought too.

 

[Zoots]

I agree with most of the original post. The album sounds good but not great... which is not a crime, agreed. BUT every single album before ATYCLB sounded great, in my opinion. The lyrics were just better, the music was more challenging. Bono is human too, you can't expect genius lyrics from him forever.

GREAT: Boy, October, War, Unforgettable Fire, Joshua Tree, Rattle And Hum, Achtung Baby, Zooropa, Pop

GOOD: ATYCLB, HTDAAB

It's the long ass titles, I tell ya.

 

[vivacolombia]

GREAT: Boy, October, War, Unforgettable Fire, Joshua Tree, Rattle And Hum, Achtung Baby, Zooropa, Pop

GOOD: ATYCLB, HTDAAB

I agree

 

[roy]

Re: the problem with HTDAAB

This album contains several good rock and pop songs, which you could get from any good band...but from u2 you'd expect more.

I totally disagree:

Vertigo,
Miracle Drug,
Sometimes,
LPOE,
COBL,
Crumbs &
Original of The Species...

These are all great Pop/Rock songs that lack nothing IMO. You could not get these songs from just any 'good' band.

 

[U2girl]

I expect good songs from U2.
They always deliver, apart from Pop.

 

[Val]

HTDAAB is a very emotional album. I guess I'm just not getting what your saying. And as for POP...it's a very good album. I enjoy them all! Thanks U2!

 

[TheFlyOnTheWall]

They always deliver, apart from Pop.

Now you're bringing your own opinion into this. Pop is a great album, sure not the best, but like Zooropa, it brought much of the new stuff with tons of great songs and experimentations which has to be more valued than HTDAAB. Objectively.

 

[neutral]

So you can bring your own opinion into it but she can't?

 

[roy]

Now you're bringing your own opinion into this. Pop is a great album, sure not the best, but like Zooropa, it brought much of the new stuff with tons of great songs and experimentations which has to be more valued than HTDAAB. Objectively.

Experimentation like:

Babyface,
Somedays Are Better than Others,
The First Time,
Playboy Mansion,
If God Will Send His Angels....

If I want experimentation, I'll listen to Joy Divison's Closer.

 

[Zoots]

Experimentation like:

Babyface,
Somedays Are Better than Others,
The First Time,
Playboy Mansion,
If God Will Send His Angels....

If I want experimentation, I'll listen to Joy Divison's Closer.

Oh sure! Pick the non-experimental songs instead of stuff like Numb, Mofo and Miami. Nobody said that they made any albums that are completely experimental from start to finish.

 

[roy]

So you can bring your own opinion into it but she can't?

I only just noticed that aswell.

 

[TheFlyOnTheWall]

So you can bring your own opinion into it but she can't?

It's only your opinion that that's my opinion. And my opinion about yours is that it's wrong.

 

[U2girl]

Now you're bringing your own opinion into this. Pop is a great album, sure not the best, but like Zooropa, it brought much of the new stuff with tons of great songs and experimentations which has to be more valued than HTDAAB. Objectively.

And what you posted isn't an opinion? Nice try.

Objectively? Most fans would agree Pop is NOT a great album, as would the critics.
Want even more objectively? The band themselves said it was unfinished.

 

[roy]

Oh sure! Pick the non-experimental songs instead of stuff like Numb, Mofo and Miami. Nobody said that they made any albums that are completely experimental from start to finish.

How exactly can Miami be classed as 'experimental'? Are we talking about ground breaking music here or just U2 badly attempting to be hip?

 

[Zoots]

How exactly can Miami be classed as 'experimental'? Are we talking about ground breaking music here or just U2 badly attempting to be hip?

Don't change the subject! The point still is that you picked non-experimental tracks to state your case.

 

[TheFlyOnTheWall]

And what you posted isn't an opinion? Nice try.

Objectively? Most fans would agree Pop is NOT a great album, as would the critics.
Want even more objectively? The band themselves said it was unfinished.

Ok, you're right. I went in the wrong direction in that post. Sorry.

 

[LeafsNation]

Re: Re: Re: the problem with HTDAAB

But somethings move everyone. Well, almost. Like WOWY or One or AIWIY - they're all great songs, no one can say they aren't and that's how it is.

When I was growing up, I knew lots of "original" U2 fans who hated JT...after War and UF, they saw it as a commericial "sell-out". So not everyone was moved by JT.

As for One...throughout much of the mid to late nineties, One was usually not even close to the top ten in many radio and critics lists of the top songs (of all time, nineties, etc.). I always looked because I always thought One was their greates and felt it should have been near the top. (Other U2 songs like WOWY, NYD and Pride were often ahead of One) It's only more recently, after people have had time to look at the song from a distance, that it seems to be almost everybody's choice for top U2 song (ex. Planet Rock, BBC etc.) Who knows what the future will bring for "later" U2 songs like Beautiful Day and SYCMIOYO>

 

[roy]

Don't change the subject! The point still is that you picked non-experimental tracks to state your case.

But I just stated that I don't count Miami as experimental, same goes for Mofo. These are the sounds of U2 desperately trying to remain cool without being very original.

Experimental? I think not...

 

[TheFlyOnTheWall]

But I just stated that I don't count Miami as experimental, same goes for Mofo. These are the sounds of U2 desperately trying to remain cool without being very original.

Experimental? I think not...

What would be experimental for you then?

 

[roy]

What would be experimental for you then?

I would define experimental as something ground breaking like JD's Closer. I certainly wouldn't define it as cynically jumping on a musical bandwagon in the hope of winning new fans...

 

[TheFlyOnTheWall]

I would define experimental as something ground breaking like JD's Closer. I certainly wouldn't define it as cynically jumping on a musical bandwagon in the hope of winning new fans...

What can I say... You are entitled to that!

 

[Zoots]

I don't think they jumped on any bandwagon. They did something that nobody expected them to do! Unpredictable = Interesting. Their 90s records sound so much unlike what people expected and the actual lyrics buried underneath all the effects of songs like If God..Angels, Staring At The Sun, Gone, Please and Wake Up Dead Man were the most personal and revealing yet upto that point.

 

[doctorwho]

I abhor comparisons to JT and AB.

First, I don't think JT is "all that".

Second, JT has been with us for nearly 18 years! AB has been with us for over 13 years! To compare HTDAAB - an album that's only been around for 3 short months - to those two albums is ridiculous. Those albums are considered classics because not only did they perform magnificently upon their release - as HTDAAB is doing - but because they have remained in our collective memories for over a decade. Will HTDAAB do so? Many will say "no", but hey, let's give it a decade and find out!

When JT was released, some thought that it would sell around 3 million copies in the U.S. That is a grand sum, but few thought it would become the monstrous album it became. Likewise, when AB was released, initially it wasn't that impressive. "The Fly" performed poorly in the U.S. (as a lead-off single) and while the album had a #1 debut, it was a weak one. However, second and third singles from AB cemented the album's status.

ATYCLB and HTDAAB clearly focus more on the song than on album themes. UF, JT and R&H were definitely thematic. AB and "Zooropa" had more song focus, but again, themes ran throughout the albums. As U2 have explored themes for 5 albums (and arguably more with The Passengers and even the more techno-sounds of "Pop"), they have shifted to a new style: the song.

Focusing on the song doesn't mean U2 is abandoning the album. Even Bono feels that the album is still better than each song. However, because the shift is on songs, it's little wonder that the overall feeling you had with JT and AB aren't the same.

Is this a bad thing? Maybe in your mind, but I consider it yet another transition. U2 have explored themes - quite well. There's no need to do that again. Instead, U2 have shifted how they write songs. It's very possible the next album will be a shift again. Clearly what inspires them at that time will play a significant role.

My ultimate point is that many keep comparing present U2 to past U2 and that's not necessarily a good thing. U2 have already written their "Sunday Bloody Sundays" and thematic albums. They've experimented with ambient sounds and techno sounds. These last two albums are clearly more focused on pop song structure. As a result, this may not be for everyone. But to say that the current U2 isn't as good as the past U2 is not only ridiculously subjective, but perhaps even erroneous. Do you really want U2 to make songs like they did? What's the point? They've already done that - time to move on.

 

[akhan01]

AMAAW is Fantastic

it's so ridiculous that people think this song isn't good. it's one of my favorite tracks on the album.

 

[Marr]

I would define experimental as something ground breaking like JD's Closer. I certainly wouldn't define it as cynically jumping on a musical bandwagon in the hope of winning new fans...

so ten years of U2 history is nothing, but a cynical attempt to win new fans?
U2 was one of the most exciting and experimental artists in the 90, along with Faith No More and Jane's Addiction...
I cannot underdtand all those people who say that "all U2 records are great, expect of POP"....
POP is one of U2's best records, I started listening to U2 becaouse of you...Tell me, is there a song as powerful as "Mofo" on HTAAB? A riff as catchy as "Discotheque"? Lyrics as good as "Please" or "Wake Up Dead Man", something really experimental and fresh to U2 like "Do You Feel Loved" ?
All those songs on POP were great, all had great lyrics, Bono was SINGING, not talking like on HTDAAB, the band could still surprise musicly, right now when i hear HTDAAB i feel it i've heard it all before...no new sounds, shapes, colours...but something like "Vertigo" is just perfect for heavy-rotation on the radio and MTV...heh, that's the price you pay. You have to compromise, if you want be on the radio or MTV or whatever....

You know what's the difference between POP and HTDAAB? That POP was just called POP sarasticly and HTDAAB is a true pop record.

 

[Zoots]

You have to compromise, if you want be on the radio or MTV or whatever....

You know what's the difference between POP and HTDAAB? That POP was just called POP sarasticly and HTDAAB is a true pop record.

Truer words than these have rarely been spoken.

 

[U2girl]

Yes, Sometimes and One step closer are both stronger than Mofo. (effects and blips don't make a song)

Vertigo and All because of you have riffs just as catchy as Discotheque (which to me is just a variation of The fly's riff).

Sometimes and One step closer have very strong lyrics.
You want new sounds for U2? How about Love and peace or All because of you or A man and a woman or Original of the species or Fast cars?

Wow, even most avid Pop fans must admit that this wasn't Bono's best singing time. He does very little singing, but lots of talking on exactly that album.

Right, and U2 wasn't trying to be on MTV and radio with jumping on the techno/dance bandwagon with Pop and with that horrible "cool" look they had.