Check this out....

[Aardvark747]

My gf is a big Rammstein fan (german industrial metal act) and she found this thread on the forum!

http://herzeleid.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=15953

 

[ponkine]

Despite I don´t like that music style, I like Rammstein attitude and words, specially on "Living In Amerika" a song U2 aren´t dare to write because they´re afraid of George Bush and U.S foreing Policy, and they know it´s better to be quiet, because they can sell more copies in the U.S... remember Bullet The Blue Sky ???

That was the REAL U2...

 

[U2Kitten]

I never knew Bullet was about the US until 2001. I am sorry I ever did. In the 80's, Communism spreading onto this continent was a real fear (we had no crystal ball to know it would fall soon) So our gov't helped the rebel factions fighting off the Commies in Nicaragua and El Salvador. NO US copters flown by US servicemen strafed anyone, it may have been our helicopter, but it was a rebel at the controls. And would he rather the Communists took those countries? What would happen to the women and children in the mud huts then? Makes me

 

[bedouin fire]

I never knew Bullet was about the US until 2001.

Well... the lines "outside is america" and "we run into the arms of america" are there since the song was released in 1987.

 

[Sleep Over Jack]

hahahaha

 

[U2@NYC]

I checked out the Rammstein board and it seems like 50% / 50% split for and against U2.

However, it is unacceptable that someone thought they were a Spanish band...

 

[yimou]

Funny reading,,, Whinny Bono ???,,,The guy who makes a list of cool 80´s music, seem to forget its a completely different style of music than U2´s, hehehehe...

Fun, fun, fun

 

[U2girl]

"Who is U2?" It seems Rammstein fans aren't that familiar with music.

Good to know most of them have nice things to say about U2.

Have you heard Crumbs from your table, ponkine? Not exactly a huge pro-West song is it?
You know U2 can't full on roar anti-US songs, not just because of Bono's activism, but also they're not the same people they were when they wrote Joshua Tree. The message is only more subtle.

*edit* Bono knows he can achieve more by working with the people who have the power - which would be harder if he'd be mouthing off against America.

 

[U2Kitten]

Well... the lines "outside is america" and "we run into the arms of america" are there since the song was released in 1987.

I mean, I never heard its Central America political implications until then.

 

[U2Kitten]

:

Have you heard Crumbs from your table, ponkine? Not exactly a huge pro-West song is it?

Is there an anti-US message in that too? I don't like Crumbs because it sounds like it's trying to be too many songs at once, but I never knew that. I know some have made comments that the 'where you live' part is about Africa, but most of it seems to be about a woman. Is that 'woman' really America?

 

[U2@NYC]

I thought that the band members were drunk when they wrote Crumbs, and that they had acknowledged that...

 

[bsp77]

How did this become a discussion of the Cold War? Both sides were guilty of horrible things in that war. We both tried to force our beliefs on others.

Anyway, I was impressed by the number of Rammstein fans that truly respect U2.

 

[U2girl]

Is there an anti-US message in that too? I don't like Crumbs because it sounds like it's trying to be too many songs at once, but I never knew that. I know some have made comments that the 'where you live' part is about Africa, but most of it seems to be about a woman. Is that 'woman' really America?

Not necessarily anti-US but more like anti-West in general - not doing enough for Africa/AIDS fight.

"Would you deny from others what you demand for yourself?" in particular - a stab at America, Europe...anyone in power not doing enough about Africa/AIDS.

"I would believe, if I was able, but I'm waiting on the crumbs from your table" - he's waiting for the West's crumbs on Africa's table.

I'm not sure who he means with "you had so much to offer why did you offer your soul" and the whole "your face caught up with your psichology" verse. The West again?

"where you live" part is also rallying against apathy towards Third world problems.

 

[U2Kitten]

Not necessarily anti-US but more like anti-West in general - not doing enough for Africa/AIDS fight.

"Would you deny from others what you demand for yourself" in particular - a stab at America, Europe...anyone in power not doing enough.

Now that you mention it, knowing Bono I guess he'd do that.

 

[Aardvark747]

How did this become a discussion of the Cold War?

Indeed!

 

[U2girl]

Now that you mention it, knowing Bono I guess he'd do that.

On the other hand, he does work with the world leaders, including Bush - so he has not lost hope. He just wants more action from them.

 

[biff]

In the recent Hot Press interview, Bono says that Crumbs in an attack on the church. He's very specific about that.

 

[80sU2isBest]

Not necessarily anti-US but more like anti-West in general - not doing enough for Africa/AIDS fight.

"Would you deny from others what you demand for yourself?" in particular - a stab at America, Europe...anyone in power not doing enough about Africa/AIDS.

"I would believe, if I was able, but I'm waiting on the crumbs from your table" - he's waiting for the West's crumbs on Africa's table.

I'm not sure who he means with "you had so much to offer why did you offer your soul" and the whole "your face caught up with your psichology" verse. The West again?

"where you live" part is also rallying against apathy towards Third world problems.

I don't buy "Crumbs..." as an anti-USA or even anti-west song at all. The "crumbs from the table" is a reference to a verse in the Bible.

I am very convinced this song is Bono pleading with the Christian church to get more involved in feeding the hungry. The church IS very involved in feeding the hungry, but I believe that's what the song is about anyway.

 

[U2girl]

From Hot press, here is Bono commenting on Crumbs:

(“Full of spleen about the church and its refusal to hear God’s voice on the AIDS emergency.”)

I don't know...I have heard of that particular story from the Bible, to me it seems like it's about West not doing enough about Africa/AIDS.


*edit* Was Bono talking with Church representatives or the members of conservative party when he made that comment that getting help for AIDS/Africa was like "getting blood from a stone"?

 

[80sU2isBest]

From Hot press, here is Bono commenting on Crumbs:

(“Full of spleen about the church and its refusal to hear God’s voice on the AIDS emergency.”)

I love Bono, but I don't agree with him in this stance.

People always rant about the church "judging" people, but then people make statements like this. The truth is that the Church has a history of incredible generosity when it comes to pouring money and people into charitable work. For Bono to come down so hard upon the church is akin to him saying "Yes, I know you give all this money to this charity and that charity, but darn your heads for not giving to my cause, also".

I understand that AIDS is his God-given cause. I think it's a great work that he's doing. But how can he judge the church for not giving to his cause when they do give money and lives to so many other causes?

 

[uwwedoogie]

i dont understand ramstein "AHHHHHHHHHH URRRRRRRRRRHHHHHHHHHHH AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH URRRRRRRRRRRRRRRHHHHHHHHHHHHHGENHOWARD"

U2 spanish..? spanish?????

 

[kobayashi]

I understand that AIDS is his God-given cause. I think it's a great work that he's doing. But how can he judge the church for not giving to his cause when they do give money and lives to so many other causes?

perhaps a combination of the pertinence of the cause and the justifications for not helping.

 

[tlt29]

When Bono said it's about the church, it definitely made more sense, especially:

"You speak of signs and wonders
But I need something other
I would believe if I was able"

America doesn't "speak of signs and wonders" - the church does.

 

[Jamila]

Back to the topic of this thread - I found it amusing and a bit unnerving.

The ignorance of some people in our world of world events and of the world's various musics (like U2) is something that I don't understand.

Maybe I'm living in a different world than others. But like the B-man has said "I'm not coming down".

Is U2 Spanish? The funniest thing I've heard in awhile!

Thanks for the thread.

THE GOAL IS SOUL....

 

[80sU2isBest]

perhaps a combination of the pertinence of the cause and the justifications for not helping.

I don't know about justifications, but as far as perinence goes, I would say feeding the hungry is as pertinent as the AIDS crisis, and the church is super at that.

My point is that if Person A gives to the AIDS crisis, and Person B gives money to fight cancer and Person C feeds the hungry, none of them have a right to criticize the other. As long as each person gives in the way God leads them, then there is no problem.

 

[GDopplerXT]

I love Bono, but I don't agree with him in this stance.

People always rant about the church "judging" people, but then people make statements like this. The truth is that the Church has a history of incredible generosity when it comes to pouring money and people into charitable work. For Bono to come down so hard upon the church is akin to him saying "Yes, I know you give all this money to this charity and that charity, but darn your heads for not giving to my cause, also".

I understand that AIDS is his God-given cause. I think it's a great work that he's doing. But how can he judge the church for not giving to his cause when they do give money and lives to so many other causes?

Just to balance the argument here, the Church also has a history of killing (or condoning the killing of) people who do not rank among its followers. (That's not a cheap shot, just the facts of history.)

If Crumbs is indeed about the Church, I'd bet that Bono is not upset about the church's money, although he would gladly welcome it. I'm guessing it's things like the fact that the Church does not accept the use of condoms which are highly effective in preventing the spread of Aids. They are also highly effective in preventing pregnancy, and therefore the Church does not approve of condom usage.

 

[80sU2isBest]

Just to balance the argument here, the Church also has a history of killing (or condoning the killing of) people who do not rank among its followers. (That's not a cheap shot, just the facts of history.)

If Crumbs is indeed about the Church, I'd bet that Bono is not upset about the church's money, although he would gladly welcome it. I'm guessing it's things like the fact that the Church does not accept the use of condoms which are highly effective in preventing the spread of Aids. They are also highly effective in preventing pregnancy, and therefore the Church does not approve of condom usage.

Seems to me that you are taking one denomination and calling it "The Church". Roman Catholicism doesn't believe in condoms, but that is just one denomination. Protestants aren't against them.

"The Church" is the body of Christ (all believers), not just one denomination.

 

[GDopplerXT]

Seems to me that you are taking one denomination and calling it "The Church". Roman Catholicism doesn't believe in condoms, but that is just one denomination. Protestants aren't against them.

"The Church" is the body of Christ (all believers), not just one denomination.

Fair point. I did assume we were talking about the Catholic Church.

 

[thrillme]

I thought that the band members were drunk when they wrote Crumbs, and that they had acknowledged that...

Guess this means only Adam has a clear memory about that song? *he's sober now*.

 

[ultrraviolette]

Wow that thread was one of the funniest and disturbing things I have ever read