7 reasons of why Elevation ....

[Aygo]

Did you see it as an opener live, or just footage? I guess it has to better being there, but footage of it, my lord, what a snoozer. I caught for the first time over the weekend the U2 Entourage episode, and I couldn't believe how lacklustre it was. Even more so than the Chicago DVD. The friend I was watching it with, who has never ever heard COBL before, turned to me and said "This has to be the worst U2 song I've ever heard." I didn't try and defend it, even though it is by no means the worst U2 song, that was just a craptastic opening, as it is on the Chicago DVD.

Well, I saw both situations. The Lisbon show with Vertigo opening (but thankfully... not closing too) was a better show but I admit that I liked better COBL opening the show in Brasil... It's another energy, the opening emotion before you listen to Vertigo. Vertigo works well as an opener, but not as good as COBL, Mofo or Zoo Station that are far superior in that function.

 

[toscano]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 7 reasons of why Elevation ....

I wonder if you've missed my point. I'm not saying it wasn't independent from JT in song selection, stage setup, and all that.

No, I didn't miss it, I'm just agreeing to disagree with you on it. It ended up being a 100% different animal than JT, so I'm treating it as such.

Itinerary isn't the issue, the issue was that the original poster thought Elevation weak and one of the reasons was that it didn't go to his country, or yours. My point here is that regardless of how many dates the tour has, ultimately it's th econtent that defines if it was weak or not. Lovetown was awesome from what I've seen, and because the content was so radically different, it has to be placed up there as a stand-alone entity, and not as a step-sister to JT.

 

[phillyfan26]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 7 reasons of why Elevation ....

No, I didn't miss it, I'm just agreeing to disagree with you on it. It ended up being a 100% different animal than JT, so I'm treating it as such.

Itinerary isn't the issue, the issue was that the original poster thought Elevation weak and one of the reasons was that it didn't go to his country, or yours. My point here is that regardless of how many dates the tour has, ultimately it's th econtent that defines if it was weak or not. Lovetown was awesome from what I've seen, and because the content was so radically different, it has to be placed up there as a stand-alone entity, and not as a step-sister to JT.

And it's a 100% different animal from Elevation. It's comparing apples and oranges. We're not following a tight code here. The circumstances were different. Thus, you can argue that the shortness of Elevation was a problem while it wasn't for LoveTown.

 

[mikal]

i sometimes wonder how much enjoyment is lost by our need to compare all the time.

 

[toscano]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 7 reasons of why Elevation ....

And it's a 100% different animal from Elevation. It's comparing apples and oranges. We're not following a tight code here. The circumstances were different. Thus, you can argue that the shortness of Elevation was a problem while it wasn't for LoveTown.

The problem being it didn't hit the poster's country, just as Lovetown didn't hit mine !

 

[toscano]

i sometimes wonder how much enjoyment is lost by our need to compare all the time.

If anything, I feel enjoyment is lost just by having sites like this and instant communication. In the old days you maybe might know what they're going to play, what the stage looks like, etc. You certainly didn't have every setlist and and every show recorded and available within 12 hours of the show, you were lucky if you got that within 12 months. The element of surprise is gone.

 

[phillyfan26]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 7 reasons of why Elevation ....

The problem being it didn't hit the poster's country, just as Lovetown didn't hit mine !

I think LoveTown's length made sense, and Elevation's didn't. So, to each his own.

 

[Axver]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 7 reasons of why Elevation ....

I think LoveTown's length made sense, and Elevation's didn't. So, to each his own.

Right, I agree. I've not too much trouble with Lovetown's length.* North America, the UK, and most of Europe were covered on the JT Tour. But with Elevation, there was no immediately subsequent tour to cover for Australia, South America, New Zealand, etc.

*Despite appearances, I do think Lovetown was a bit too short. I think a few shows should have been played in South America, as was intended to happen in February 1988. However, I support Lovetown not going to North America.

Also, toscano, just to make sure there's no false impressions, I'm not ignoring your posts. I see your point and I think we agree on most stuff and agree to disagree on the rest.

 

[toscano]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 7 reasons of why Elevation ..

Right, I agree. I've not too much trouble with Lovetown's length.* North America, the UK, and most of Europe were covered on the JT Tour. But with Elevation, there was no immediately subsequent tour to cover for Australia, South America, New Zealand, etc.

*Despite appearances, I do think Lovetown was a bit too short. I think a few shows should have been played in South America, as was intended to happen in February 1988. However, I support Lovetown not going to North America.

Also, toscano, just to make sure there's no false impressions, I'm not ignoring your posts. I see your point and I think we agree on most stuff and agree to disagree on the rest.

fair enough, cheers, enjoy Vertigo

 

[toscano]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 7 reasons of why Elevation ..

with Elevation, there was no immediately subsequent tour to cover for Australia, South America, New Zealand, etc.
I see your point and I think we agree on most stuff and agree to disagree on the rest.

one last nit-picky point then I'm off to take drugs for a huge toothache, i smell root canal so I'm grumpy: "immediately subsequent" ? It was almost 2 years in between tours !

ok, codeine........

 

[Screwtape2]

What do you kids generally think of the City of Blinding Lights opener?

Not very exciting but Elevation was worse in my opinion. I always felt that Vertigo should have started all the shows on Vertigo because COBL didn't have a cool entry for the band and was pretty stale until it hit the chorus.

This brings up a bigger problem with Elevation and with Vertigo. The band's last two albums don't contain alot of stellar live material. Look at the songs that were amazing live from AB, Pop and Zooropa. On Elevation, Stuck seemed to kill the energy and Kite was better suited to be played later in the show. Beautiful Day seems too tame to be played as the show's second track. There really wasn't a song that was as good as some past openers. Elevation was the worst tour U2 had ever done because they broke the golden rule of making a record that could be played live.

 

[Axver]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 7 reasons of why Elevatio

one last nit-picky point then I'm off to take drugs for a huge toothache, i smell root canal so I'm grumpy: "immediately subsequent" ? It was almost 2 years in between tours !

ok, codeine........

You know, that's something I've never quite understood. I can understand taking off 1988 to record and promote RAH, that makes sense, but it surprises me that Lovetown didn't take place in early 1989, straight after the release of RAH. Maybe Adam's drug possession case caused problems with the timing? I don't know precisely when that took place, but I know it was between JT and Lovetown.

 

[An Cat Gav]

ATYCLB was crap.
Elevation tour was crap.
I can't wait for a "ATYCLB has the worst cd booklet ever made" thread.

The title of "worse CD booklet ever" must go to HTDAAB

 

[bono_man2002]

6- Too drastic early mood changes , in the indoor shows for example , after End of the world , Stuck and Kite right next ? It kinda doesn't exactly work the best way

New Year's Day usually followed UTEOTW.

 

[bono_man2002]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 7 reasons of why Elev

Maybe Adam's drug possession case caused problems with the timing? I don't know precisely when that took place, but I know it was between JT and Lovetown.

I believe that is the reason, I dont know when Lovetown was due to start...but i remember reading that Adam was unable to get a Visa or something due to the case.

 

[guill]

The band's last two albums don't contain alot of stellar live material. Look at the songs that were amazing live from AB, Pop and Zooropa.

There was so much stellar material on Pop and Zooropa that U2 played (almost) nothing from these albums during the last tour..

Achtung Baby had stellar material but Zooropa and Pop....... gimme a break.

 

[u2wildhoney]

Re: Re: 7 reasons of why Elevation ....

1) OK, it was a really short tour. But what does the length of it to do with the quality? Take Lovetown, the shortest of all U2 tours.

2) Interesting point. U2 played Discotheque, Gone, SATS, Please and WUDM on Elevation. That's 5 songs off the last album.

3) UTEOTW, Gone, NY. Not rocking enough in the early set?

4) Matter of taste.

5) There were Elevation shows with 22, 23 songs too.

6) Some transitions work better than others. This can be said of any tour.

7) I like all Flys, personally. Bullet I feel was better on Elevation. Can't see much of a difference in NYD.

As for most forgettable of past 5 tours? Popmart for me.

I absolutely agree, for me the most "forgettable" U2-tour was Popmart, too! There were so much hype about Popmart, and we could learn another face of U2 in these concerts, and I didn't really like it.... Some say Popmart was just a joke, a huge joke, but I can't help feeling that I had enough of this Popmart -thing...

 

[Bones58]

The Elevation stage was very dull, although the heart was excellent. I'll usually give any bootleg a download but if its Elevation. I just go meh - next. Back to basics? Back to boredom more like. SBS is so bad on that tour, so slow and dreary and whats with the guitar riff being played lower than usual? Although streets was probably better on Elevation than on Vertigo. Likely because it didn't have those annoying African flags and awful African chanting during the intro.

 

[schnumi]

There was so much stellar material on Pop and Zooropa that U2 played (almost) nothing from these albums during the last tour..

Achtung Baby had stellar material but Zooropa and Pop....... gimme a break.

You have missed out on something.

Stay, daddy's gonna pay for your crashed car, the first time are all great songs from Zooropa live. (numb as well maybe).

Pop contains so many great live songs, in fact the whole album is better live!

Last night on earth will blow you off the stage, Please is just rock and roll heaving, Wake up dead man is great, discotheque is fun, even Miami get's better live, and what about Gone? Or MOFO?

POP actually has a whole album full of great live songs. It annoys me that U2 doesnt play any of them anymore.

I absolutely agree, for me the most "forgettable" U2-tour was Popmart, too! There were so much hype about Popmart, and we could learn another face of U2 in these concerts, and I didn't really like it.... Some say Popmart was just a joke, a huge joke, but I can't help feeling that I had enough of this Popmart -thing...

It's a love or hate thing i guess. I loved it just like Zoo tour.

I just loved the whole greatnes off the set, the huge screen, the lemon etc you name it. Everything was larger then life, even U2 themselfs.

 

[Salome]

do the people who reckon that Elevation is back to basic also agree that POPMart is just ZOOTV part 2 + 1 lemon?

or does adding a Mc D arch really have such a huge influence on it all?

 

[schnumi]

Yes Popmart was a sort of Zoo 2. Just with a different message and a bigger stage.

That's why i liked it.

 

[J_NP]

do the people who reckon that Elevation is back to basic also agree that POPMart is just ZOOTV part 2 + 1 lemon?

Well kinda quick answer coz in minutes I 'm having classes , but if u look at the perfomances of elevation , particular the old songs , Sunday , NYD , and I Will follow are played as original .......... That's a point

But if u compare Popmart and Zootv , as popmart being zootv part 2 ???? Well that can't be said at least bout the way the songs were done

- While Bad was done over and over on Zoo , AIWIY was the choice of Pop , and a different perfomance from all previous
-I will follow rarely played on zoo , and had a totally different aproach
-Bullet idem
-WOWY was also different from the 2 ZOO Tv versions

Very Different setlists , different approaches

So how exactly would Popmart , be Zoo part II ?

Anyway for me in a lot of ways , and this means musically speaking , the way the songs were played , Popmart topped zoo

 

[Aygo]

The title of "worse CD booklet ever" must go to HTDAAB

Don't say that... the booklet pics were shot in Lisbon suburban areas...
Those areas are beautiful...

 

[Aygo]

Not very exciting but Elevation was worse in my opinion. I always felt that Vertigo should have started all the shows on Vertigo because COBL didn't have a cool entry for the band and was pretty stale until it hit the chorus.

This brings up a bigger problem with Elevation and with Vertigo. The band's last two albums don't contain alot of stellar live material. Look at the songs that were amazing live from AB, Pop and Zooropa. On Elevation, Stuck seemed to kill the energy and Kite was better suited to be played later in the show. Beautiful Day seems too tame to be played as the show's second track. There really wasn't a song that was as good as some past openers. Elevation was the worst tour U2 had ever done because they broke the golden rule of making a record that could be played live.

I agree that "Elevation" is not a perfect opener, neither is "Vertigo" (despite I enjoyed it), but... what about LAPOE??? And COBL was made to open a show...

 

[Aygo]

do the people who reckon that Elevation is back to basic also agree that POPMart is just ZOOTV part 2 + 1 lemon?
or does adding a Mc D arch really have such a huge influence on it all?

Yes Popmart was a sort of Zoo 2. Just with a different message and a bigger stage. That's why I liked it

Oh... come on!!!
The message is not exactily the same, despite it converges in similar subjects.
In Popmart you didn't have a TV Channel Station and the same kind of playing characters (that were not as relevant as in ZooTV). In the other hand, ZooTV didn't have the biggest screan ever in a tour and the techno-feel provided by some acts.
Then, ZooTv setlists were more static, Popmart was a bit more dynamic even switching Pop songs by old hits.

 

[schnumi]

like i said: the message isnt the same.

For sure the setlist during Popmart was better (in my eyes) and different but i was more talking about the stages.

Zoo was big and Popmart went beyond big.

 

[U2girl]

This brings up a bigger problem with Elevation and with Vertigo. The band's last two albums don't contain alot of stellar live material. Look at the songs that were amazing live from AB, Pop and Zooropa. On Elevation, Stuck seemed to kill the energy and Kite was better suited to be played later in the show. Beautiful Day seems too tame to be played as the show's second track. There really wasn't a song that was as good as some past openers. Elevation was the worst tour U2 had ever done because they broke the golden rule of making a record that could be played live.

The problem is after AB U2 went from essentially a live band that struggled in the studio to becoming better in the studio and having more problems live.

I think last four albums (and AB on a song or two) had their share of good and bad live songs (Zooropa being a prime example of a studio album not working live).

 

[Aygo]

The problem is after AB U2 went from essentially a live band that struggled in the studio to becoming better in the studio and having more problems live.

I think last four albums (and AB on a song or two) had their share of good and bad live songs (Zooropa being a prime example of a studio album not working live).

Well, you shouldn't claim that. Zooropa is an album thinking about studio, production and studio effects. The songs were not thought to be live anthems, and remember that 4 years ago the band had been touring songs with a country and folk-rock style... There's a difference with go on the studio and make spetacular songs and bringing them in the stage in front of thousands of people.

And well, all U2 albums have good and not-so-good live songs. "So Cruel" and "Who's Gonna Ride Your Wild Horses" are examples of songs that are better in studio than live.
The same situation goes for the other albums...
Pop has the live hightlights such as "Mofo", "Gone" (that are great too in studio), "Please" (don't even compare studio to live), but "Staring at the sun" and "If god will send His angels" never made it good.
ATYCLB has "Walk On" and "Kite" that sound even better live than on the record for example...
HTDAAB has LAPOE, COBL and Vertigo that throw the studio versions in the trash can but you have ABOY that never got the same emotion on the record and why to play Yahweh in a stripped version...

I don't think the band struggled in studio and got worse live. That makes part of the process, sometimes better, sometimes not.
Popmart was huge in Europe, it probably had some of the biggest shows played in some cities.
In Elevation Bono's voice seems degradated, but the it looked like the first time (as in Vertigo) that the band looks comfortable playing the songs. That didn't happen a few times in Popmart or ZooTv.

 

[J_NP]

Pop has the live hightlights such as "Mofo", "Gone" (that are great too in studio), "Please" (don't even compare studio to live), but "Staring at the sun" and "If god will send His angels" never made it good.

HTDAAB has LAPOE, COBL and Vertigo that throw the studio versions in the trash can but you have ABOY that never got the same emotion on the record and why to play Yahweh in a stripped version...


Popmart was huge in Europe

Discotheque and LNOE should be remembered as well , specially the last

Am i The only lover of ABOY live ? Jesus , I absolutely find fantastic the ones of the 2 first nights , the one from brooklyn bridge as well ...... And even the chicago version which I find it grat , I sorta discovered , there I was surfing the itunes , then I came across in a european store of the digital release of it , and hearing it with a headphone .......... wow Just do this , go to itunes UK story , and listen to the preview of it , even u already own the dvd , and see if that doesn't sound great ..... It's curious , I love it live , think it's better , it's such a joy hear all the riffs and all ....... I see it It's one of the best works by edge

Don't forget South America

 

[Salome]

Well kinda quick answer coz in minutes I 'm having classes , but if u look at the perfomances of elevation , particular the old songs , Sunday , NYD , and I Will follow are played as original .......... That's a point

But if u compare Popmart and Zootv , as popmart being zootv part 2 ???? Well that can't be said at least bout the way the songs were done

- While Bad was done over and over on Zoo , AIWIY was the choice of Pop , and a different perfomance from all previous
-I will follow rarely played on zoo , and had a totally different aproach
-Bullet idem
-WOWY was also different from the 2 ZOO Tv versions

Very Different setlists , different approaches

So how exactly would Popmart , be Zoo part II ?

Anyway for me in a lot of ways , and this means musically speaking , the way the songs were played , Popmart topped zoo

my point wasn't so much that POPMart = ZOOTV 2
because not even I think that

my point is that the differences you name between ZOO TV and POPMart are as big as the differences between Elevation and the pre ZOO TV tours

so in my view the people who call Elevation a "back to basics" tour probably also consider POPMart nothing more than a ZOO TV 2 tour