Random Music Thread LXXVII: We'll Be Careful, Cobbler Will Be Dead

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I interviewed an American today. Spent three years trying to make it in AFL and is now back playing basketball.

Every American I've ever interviewed has been extremely good to speak to. Long, eloquent, quotable answers. A lot of Aussies have been good to but with many it's like drawing blood out of a stone.
 
cobl04 said:
I've always found genre tags a massive bore. I couldn't care less to be honest. I don't understand how talking about genre is even interesting. They're usually so broad and have so much crossover it's pointless bringing them up. I've hidden genre in iTunes.
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This. They're completely useless to try to describe a band when in one album, you need 5 or 6 micro-genre tags to cover each different song.

Also, I'm marking this date down in my calendar. The next time genre wankery comes up, I'll know exactly how long an interference cycle is!
 
Jive Turkey said:
This. They're completely useless to try to describe a band when in one album, you need 5 or 6 micro-genre tags to cover each different song.

Also, I'm marking this date down in my calendar. The next time genre wankery comes up, I'll know exactly how long an interference cycle is!
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I really just can't disagree more, honestly. If I see a band listed as:

Dream Pop, Ethereal Wave

I pretty much know exactly what it's going to sound like.

It's not perfect, but for people who take the time to learn the descriptions behind the tags (which I have because I nerd it up on Rate Your Music A LOT), it's super useful.

The problem is, like I said, stupidly unhelpful tags like "indie alternative"
 
I was in Target this evening and I noticed that Imagine Dragons has released a deluxe version of their debut album. Between the deluxe version, iTunes, and Spotify, they have released a total of 21 tracks for one album. They are practically guaranteed a sophomore slump.
 
It's wankery. Why the sudden need to micro manage? Popular music existed for decades without the need for it. I don't buy the argument that there are more kinds of music these days and it requires it. What ends of happening is people take albums like Team Dream and Bloom, or Forget and Confess, and claim that they're different genres. When really, there's so much overlap that it's completely pointless to slap different labels on them. I use those examples because I've seen it happen here. It seems like people are more interested in making up cool sounding names than anything else
 
bono_212 said:
Dream Pop, Ethereal Wave
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Like this. Why do you need those two different labels? Is there that much difference between the two? "Ugh! Dream Pop?!?! I thought you said these guys were Ethereal Wave??" (Ethereal Wave sounds like it was made in a joke genre generator). It's become a parody of itself
 
I agree that "ethereal wave" tells me more about an act than "they sound like Cocteau Twins" because there's a 98% chance that they don't sound all that much like Cocteau Twins; I'm likely to be disappointed in that case. The characteristics are much narrower and less likely to be accurate with a band-to-band comparison than if you use an entire scene to describe the band.

Whether or not genre tags are "wanky" is an entirely different matter. It's up to you how precise you want to be without looking like a total douche. But it is factually correct that you get more information out of multiple genre tags than "they sound like ______." I know this because I've been offered both many, many times.

And yeah, Forget and Confess belong to two different genres. One is a dream pop/chillwave release and the other is a new wave album, straight up. Sounds like Blondie almost. If you were to say Twin Shadow's sound hadn't changed between the two, you would be misleading whoever you were talking to. Bloom and Teen Dream are definitely both dream pop.
 
Jive Turkey said:
It's wankery. Why the sudden need to micro manage? Popular music existed for decades without the need for it. I don't buy the argument that there are more kinds of music these days and it requires it. What ends of happening is people take albums like Team Dream and Bloom, or Forget and Confess, and claim that they're different genres. When really, there's so much overlap that it's completely pointless to slap different labels on them. I use those examples because I've seen it happen here. It seems like people are more interested in making up cool sounding names than anything else
Click to expand...

Jive Turkey said:
Like this. Why do you need those two different labels? Is there that much difference between the two? "Ugh! Dream Pop?!?! I thought you said these guys were Ethereal Wave??" (Ethereal Wave sounds like it was made in a joke genre generator). It's become a parody of itself
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Travis just proved my point, he didn't know it, but those were the genre tags for Cocteau twins' Heaven Or Las Vegas.

It's not exclusive to new albums either.

Take a look at the differences in folk genres from the 60s alone
 
Jive Turkey said:
It's wankery. Why the sudden need to micro manage? Popular music existed for decades without the need for it. I don't buy the argument that there are more kinds of music these days and it requires it. What ends of happening is people take albums like Team Dream and Bloom, or Forget and Confess, and claim that they're different genres. When really, there's so much overlap that it's completely pointless to slap different labels on them. I use those examples because I've seen it happen here. It seems like people are more interested in making up cool sounding names than anything else
Click to expand...

Jive Turkey said:
Like this. Why do you need those two different labels? Is there that much difference between the two? "Ugh! Dream Pop?!?! I thought you said these guys were Ethereal Wave??" (Ethereal Wave sounds like it was made in a joke genre generator). It's become a parody of itself
Click to expand...

Totally, totally agree. Well said :up:

LemonMelon said:
And yeah, Forget and Confess belong to two different genres. One is a dream pop/chillwave release and the other is a new wave album, straight up.
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See to me this sort of talk is extremely boring. If someone asked me what sort of music Twin Shadow is, or what it sounds like, I'd just say "synth pop" and then play them some.

Like when Within and Without came out. 90% of the talk about that album was about whether chillwave was dead. I mean what the fuck. Just enjoy the music y'know?
 
No, I don't know, because I enjoy musically differently than you, I suppose. I like genre tags, that's my point. I personally find them useful.

Synth pop is almost as bad as indie pop. It kind of meant something at one point, but you can't sit here and tell me that saying a band is synth pop means anything. The Killers are "synth pop" and they don't sound much like Twin Shadow (most of the time).

I'm not trying to have a pedantic argument here, I'm just saying that I certainly do find genre tags useful and I use them often (not on this board because it seems that the consensus find them stupid).
 
cobl04 said:
See to me this sort of talk is extremely boring.
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That's cool, but it's not what we're discussing. Genre tags aren't a source of entertainment for me. They're a utility. They prevent me from wasting 45 minutes listening to something I don't want to hear at that moment.
 
This argument appears to have reached mutual disagreement. I think we can move on :)

It did inspire me to listen to Confess though. Golden Light and Five Seconds are so good.
 
Confess pissed me off because it starts out so good and sort of fizzles from there. Forget is the better album but, uh yeah, people seem to have forgotten about it because it lacked a single like Five Seconds.
 
bono_212 said:
Kinda like how Axver hates it whenever something remotely shoegazy gets the, "It sounds like My Bloody Valentine" treatment.
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Oh bloody hell yes.

bono_212 said:
Synth pop is almost as bad as indie pop.
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I wouldn't quite go that far, in that I find it is still pretty useful, but it is rather annoying how synth pop and electropop, despite ostensibly being distinct, are typically used interchangeably. On RYM, it seems whether or not an album gets tagged with synth pop or electropop is entirely on the basis of what the first genre tagger proposes.

LemonMelon said:
That's cool, but it's not what we're discussing. Genre tags aren't a source of entertainment for me. They're a utility. They prevent me from wasting 45 minutes listening to something I don't want to hear at that moment.
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Yes, this, and I completely agree with Ashley too. Genre tags are very useful, and I like subgenres/microgenres. The more the merrier. I find them the most convenient way to know roughly how an album sounds - informative yet very quick. It's rare that I see an album tagged as, say, chillwave and think "gee that wasn't what I expected at all, what a waste of my time". But when somebody says "this sounds like Washed Out", well, that just creates artificial expectations.
 
I'd like to ask a sincere question, if I may. For those who have moved out of home to a place where they don't know many people (but not college), what's the best way to get out and about, meet people, have fun? I plan on joining some local sports clubs, taking up Italian again, if I can afford it. My housemates are good people but they just aren't all that exciting/outgoing.

I'd love to join Couchsurfing but I think you have to be actually travelling to do that, or at least hosting travellers at your place.
 
Just wear the donko suit all the time and you'll meet people. :wink:

Seriously, just what you said. I met a good friend here in a Pilates class, so joining classes that you're interested in is a great way to meet people. When I moved to NYC after college I continued studying French, and later Italian, and made some friends. Most lasting new friendships came through work, though.

Here there's a dog park that is a mad social scene so if you have a dog you might find a good place to take him where you might make friends.

Be a regular at a cool coffee bar that plays good music.
 
Haha. I do live in a kooky area, so it wouldn't be tooooo weird :p

Thanks, though, I appreciate the advice. I've got a friend moving here in a few weeks who is super outgoing so that'll be good. Just a bit different being 40 minutes away from the friends I've hung out with every weekend for the past few years.

Sadly my dog remains at home :( and I don't drink coffee... might have to change that.
 
cobl04 said:
I don't drink coffee... might have to change that.
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Nobody gives a shit if you order hot chocolate rather than coffee at a cafe, and I can give you pointers on quality hot chocolate in Brunswick (I recommend Miss Marmalade in particular).

I don't know why you're worried though, since I presume you'd have gone to the city with mates/work colleagues anyway? It's not like anybody's that far away. The people I usually hang out with are scattered all over this city of ours. I'm used to them or me travelling 30-60 minutes to get to where we're meeting.
 
Cool. We should definitely go to the Spotted Mallard next week by the way. They do awesome duck and chips.

It's more the fact that several nights a week I was travelling five minutes to go to a mate's place to play darts, or the 64, for beers, whatever. Whereas at the moment (I've only been here 11 days) I don't know anyone well enough to do that. I'm sure it'll be fine though. There's so much good stuff around.
 
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