Is Kanye West the greatest?

[AtomicBono]

The point I was going to make is kinda linked to the above. There are dozens of hip hop acts that project a greater message than Kanye. Plenty that are more politicaly/socially aware and intelligent. Plenty that are positive. Plenty of better lyricists and rappers. But none have any real mass public appeal - not even close. On the flipside, those that do hog the public spotlight generally don't exactly have the positive image, or any real depth to their message or music at all.

Kanye is a fantastic mix that will hopefully act as a gateway to pop hip hop listeners who have been given a steady diet of shit for years. He's the point where a fan of the very commercially popular 50 Cent and a fan of the very intellectually astute Blackalicious can actually meet and agree.

If you think Kanye is hip hop at it's smartest, you are very wrong. If you think Kanye is the only rapper out there projecting a positive image, with some belief behind the lyrics, you are very wrong. Hopefully though he is appealing to those who thought those things didn't actually exist, simply because they'd never been exposed to it, and from there they'll dig deeper for more. If he can achieve anything it could be a move away from the gangsta shit that has dominated commercial hip hop for years now, and there are plenty of ridiculously talented, positive, intelligent hip hop acts out there creating great music, better than Kanyes, who haven't got the commercial clout to break through, but should and maybe could.

I think Kanye is great, but also overrated - but better him getting this kind of praise than Notorious B.I.G. with their lyrically brilliant "Nasty Girl"

cee-lo...

 

[bollox]

I think Kanye is great, but also overrated - but better him getting this kind of praise than Notorious B.I.G. with their lyrically brilliant "Nasty Girl"

nigga please. biggie's corpse shits all over kanye.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

We're comparing this guy to Bono now?

why would we do something like that? young artist who apeals to a wide audience, and despite being in a genre that has turned into decadence with nothing but partying and bangin' chicks getting played on the radio actually writes songs about, God, religion, political beliefs? My word... he sounds nothing like U2 in the 80's, you're right.


people even think that he thinks to highly of himself, just like they did with bono.

if one can put aside, just for a moment, their complete dislike of all things rap and just look at this objectively, one can make a lot of comparisons between Kanye and a young Bono.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

rap = retards atempting poetry and thats my view!!!!

such an open minded, highly intelligent view you have there.

 

[Chizip]

while i like kanye i dont think he is as "revolutionary" as some people say *cough*headache*cough*

he isn't the first popular rapper to have a message, and his musical style isn't exactly something that hasn't been done before either

his style reminds me a lot of Jay-Z actually

so id say arrested development or public enemy's socially conscious lyrics + jay-z's style = kanye west

edit - ok with further research i see that kanye helped produce jay-z's blueprint, which is probably why the styles are similiar

 

[Numb1075]

I like what I've heard from Kanye....but I can't contribute much here as I only know a couple of his tunes.

Did see him on Oprah last week and he was in a terrible car accident a few years back, complete w/ fractured jaw etc.

For my $, I go w/ Jay Z !

 

[WildHoneyAlways]

If he can achieve anything it could be a move away from the gangsta shit that has dominated commercial hip hop for years now, and there are plenty of ridiculously talented, positive, intelligent hip hop acts out there creating great music, better than Kanyes, who haven't got the commercial clout to break through, but should and maybe could.

Honestly, I think the days of acts like Will Smith and Jazzy Jeff are long gone. (despite what everyone may think of them , might actually be "revolutionary" ) I'm not sure if commercial clout would be enought to break through today hip hop/urban culture being what it is.

edit: I don't claim to be an expert on culture here. I can only go off of what I'm exposed to by my profession.

 

[JCOSTER]

2 kw

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

while i like kanye i dont think he is as "revolutionary" as some people say *cough*headache*cough*

he isn't the first popular rapper to have a message, and his musical style isn't exactly something that hasn't been done before either

his style reminds me a lot of Jay-Z actually

so id say arrested development or public enemy's socially conscious lyrics + jay-z's style = kanye west

edit - ok with further research i see that kanye helped produce jay-z's blueprint, which is probably why the styles are similiar

but ya see, that's why he is revolutionary in the rap world... the social message of public enemy, arrested development, grand master flash and the furious five, etc. etc. while having the overall mass appeal to fans of all genres, people of all races like a jay-z. i mean shit... It Takes A Nation of Millions To Hold Us Back sold a million copies since it's release in 1988. Late Registration sold 900,000 copies in it's first week alone.

think about that

public enemy - it takes a nation of millions to hold us back... 1 million copies sold over 17 years.

kanye west- late registration... 900,000 copies sold over 7 days.

 

[Chizip]

but ya see, that's why he is revolutionary in the rap world... the social message of public enemy, arrested development, grand master flash and the furious five, etc. etc. while having the overall mass appeal to fans of all genres, people of all races like a jay-z. i mean shit... It Takes A Nation of Millions To Hold Us Back sold a million copies since it's release in 1988. Late Registration sold 900,000 copies in it's first week alone.

think about that

public enemy - it takes a nation of millions to hold us back... 1 million copies sold over 17 years.

kanye west- late registration... 900,000 copies sold over 7 days.

but see arrested development had mass appeal. the group won a Grammy Award for Best Rap Album and Best New Artist, and were also Band of the Year by Rolling Stone magazine.

so i dont know, its been done. im not saying its not good, and a nice change of pace from the current scene, i just dont see it as anything super revolutionary.

 

[redkat]

We're comparing this guy to Bono now?

Yes!

If Bono does so can I

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

but see arrested development had mass appeal. the group won a Grammy Award for Best Rap Album and Best New Artist, and were also Band of the Year by Rolling Stone magazine.

so i dont know, its been done. im not saying its not good, and a nice change of pace from the current scene, i just dont see it as anything super revolutionary.

and after one album they were gone from the mainstream.

 

[intedomine]

kanye is revolutionary... a hip hop artist with a real message and mass public appeal and a positive influence to boot.

Is that it?

He's revolutionary only because he has a "real message" and a "positive influence" and is respected in many circles.

Is that all it takes to qualify some chap as revolutionary?

Going by that logic, it seems that almost every artist is revolutionary....

For christ's sake, Britney Spears is more revolutionary.... think about all the artists she has inspired....

Westie is just another rapper to me....

That he "raps" a positive message, doesn't make his music any more different from the rest of the Hip Hop out there...

I have to see this Westie bloke support U2 next year. I was hoping to see a decent up and coming rock and roll band support U2, but I'm gonna be standing there falling asleep while this "artist" is on stage....

Gold Digger shits me, and it sounds like the rest of the garbage out there....

Nothing against Hip Hop as a genre, but there is a lot of underground, progressive and obscure Hip Hop out there which is a LOT more revolutionary than the "music" Westie is churning out...


Westie just got lucky...

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Is that it?

He's revolutionary only because he has a "real message" and a "positive influence" and is respected in many circles.

Is that all it takes to qualify some chap as revolutionary?

Going by that logic, it seems that almost every artist is revolutionary....

For christ's sake, Britney Spears is more revolutionary.... think about all the artists she has inspired....

Westie is just another rapper to me....

That he "raps" a positive message, doesn't make his music any more different from the rest of the Hip Hop out there...

I have to see this Westie bloke support U2 next year. I was hoping to see a decent up and coming rock and roll band support U2, but I'm gonna be standing there falling asleep while this "artist" is on stage....

Gold Digger shits me, and it sounds like the rest of the garbage out there....

Nothing against Hip Hop as a genre, but there is a lot of underground, progressive and obscure Hip Hop out there which is a LOT more revolutionary than the "music" Westie is churning out...


Westie just got lucky...

yea you really sound like an impartial rap enthusiast there. and if you're so upset about having to see "westie," why in the hell you call him that, then by all means, give your ticket to someone else so that you don't have to sit through the insuferable opening act.

it's very tough to have this debate with the close minded who think anything rap sucks... i would imagine it was sort of like how it was back in the 50s and 60s when parents would complain about rock and roll not being real music.

 

[LMP]

Kanye is alright, but nothing special I think

on the list of rappers I know, I list Flava Flav above him

when you're listed below Flava Flav, there's a problem

 

[intedomine]

yea you really sound like an impartial rap enthusiast there. and if you're so upset about having to see "westie," why in the hell you call him that, then by all means, give your ticket to someone else so that you don't have to sit through the insuferable opening act.

it's very tough to have this debate with the close minded who think anything rap sucks... i would imagine it was sort of like how it was back in the 50s and 60s when parents would complain about rock and roll not being real music.

I don't have much time for Hip Hop, I honestly feel that it is a sub standard genre compared with Classical, Rock and Roll, Jazz, Techno/Trance and even Country. It is possible however that I could like some Hip Hop artists, like some of these lesser known Aussie artists such as the Hilltop Hoods and 1200 techniques, who seem much more revolutionary and ambitious than Westie...

Westie to me however, seems like just another 50 cent or Jay Z...


Bring back 2pac and Ginuwine...



(And I like the band who Westie is supporting more than I dislike Westie's music, so there's no chance I'm gonna sell my ticket, but rather, stand there with my thumbs pointed down and a bored look upon my face while Westie shows off his "creative" flair)

 

[RademR]

Ok....what is this thread??? Is this serious?

He's not even the greatest rapper of all time. Not even in the top 20 of all time.

HES HAD TWO ALBUMS!!!!

If Jay-Z comes out of retirement, kanye will be a distant second, if that. Did people forget about Nas?

btw, i did like his first two albums. didnt love them but they were good

 

[yertle-the-turtle]

Ok....what is this thread??? Is this serious?

no

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Kanye is alright, but nothing special I think

on the list of rappers I know, I list Flava Flav above him

when you're listed below Flava Flav, there's a problem

flava flav doesn't even rap.

 

[redkat]

(And I like the band who Westie is supporting more than I dislike Westie's music, so there's no chance I'm gonna sell my ticket, but rather, stand there with my thumbs pointed down and a bored look upon my face while Westie shows off his "creative" flair)

Do yourself a favor and at least go with an open mind. You might be suprised he puts on a good show.

 

[yertle-the-turtle]

Look, mate.

Bloody Dream Theater are coming to Singapore with their ridiculous seven minute guitar solos masquerading as musical entertainment.

Kanye at least writes actual songs. It could be worse. Most 'proper rock n' roll' bands these days are unbearably shite.

 

[LMP]

flava flav doesn't even rap.

he still wins because he's Flava Flav

 

[intedomine]

Do yourself a favor and at least go with an open mind. You might be suprised he puts on a good show.

What? A good show in which he stands around, poncing around the stage like he owns the place, blurting out "songs" that don't do a thing for me...

It's hard to go in with an open mind after hearing the sad excuse for a song "gold digger" being played on every radio station you tune into. Boring!

 

[nurse chrissi]

Do yourself a favor and at least go with an open mind. You might be suprised he puts on a good show.

I didn't really care either way about West but then I saw him live and it was a really great show (didn't hurt that Bono came out before to introduce West).

 

[Earnie Shavers]

The thread is half serious. It was started in sarcasm, but at some point about half the posts turned serious.

I think revolutionary is too strong a word, as he's not actually doing anything new. He's just a very good mix of a few very good things.

What? A good show in which he stands around, poncing around the stage like he owns the place, blurting out "songs" that don't do a thing for me...

It's hard to go in with an open mind after hearing the sad excuse for a song "gold digger" being played on every radio station you tune into. Boring!

Trade "Gold Digger" for "Vertigo" in the above post. Leave the rest the same. Catchy pop hit. Overplayed. Outspoken, some would say cocky/arrogant performer....

And yes, rock and it's retro-rehash love affair hasn't produced anywhere near the exciting music that has come from hip hop and it's closely related genre cousins so far this decade. I don't care if someone doesn't like Kanye West and doesn't really care for seeing/hearing him as a support act (just count your blessings - a lot of people got stuck with Keane, if you want to hear music with the creativity meter stuck firmly on zero...) but when you say you wanted to see an up and coming rock act, you come across as if you are writing off the hip hop genre, not the artist. But then you measure 'revolutionary' against acts like Hilltop Hoods and 1200 Techniques, who are both great in their way as fun little Australian acts, but are most definitely, most certainly, not doing a single thing that hasn't been done a thousand times over a long time ago.

Remember, it could have been Keane.

 

[intedomine]

And yes, rock and it's retro-rehash love affair hasn't produced anywhere near the exciting music that has come from hip hop and it's closely related genre cousins so far this decade. I don't care if someone doesn't like Kanye West and doesn't really care for seeing/hearing him as a support act (just count your blessings - a lot of people got stuck with Keane, if you want to hear music with the creativity meter stuck firmly on zero...) but when you say you wanted to see an up and coming rock act, you come across as if you are writing off the hip hop genre, not the artist. But then you measure 'revolutionary' against acts like Hilltop Hoods and 1200 Techniques, who are both great in their way as fun little Australian acts, but are most definitely, most certainly, not doing a single thing that hasn't been done a thousand times over a long time ago.

Remember, it could have been Keane.

I'd rather Keane than Kanye... I find Keane exciting, exhillarating and enchanting compared with the yawnworthy material Westie is churning out...


You reiterate the disgraceful sentiments that are frequently expressed by elitist music fans on this forum...

This same ol' idea that a band or an artist ONLY has credibility if they try and reinvent or redefine a genre....

It doesn't matter if the artist writes what is undeniably a cool little tune. It doesn't matter if they've slaved away in the studio for hours trying to write a song that is better than "Strawberry Fields Forever." Even if they achieved this goal, the music elite will knock 'em down immediately, and should this artist reap some kind of commercial success.....well, the artist is not worth mentioning are they? They are dismissed as irrelevant, or "sell outs".

How dare they make the music they want to make!
How dare they not write something as revolutionary as Revolver or Kid A!
How dare they not use the F-word in the song title!
How dare an artist have an idol!

If the above sentiments are what music is all about, than what happens to the sheer enjoyment of listening to and making music? Must every artist attempt to be the next Radiohead, Pink Floyd or Beatles? Or, quite preposterously, the next Kanye?


If Keane are enjoying making the music they want to make, and if they are enchanting the thousands of fans who have enjoyed their records, than surely they are relevant, and surely they are exciting to the many people who listen to them....


Just because an artist is not revolutionary or groundbreaking, does not mean they are not exciting....

I feel sorry for those who cannot listen to music for the sheer enjoyment of doing so, and also for thosebitter and twisted music "fans" who battle that inner demon that instills a sense of prejudice towards any artist who might simply be fulfilling their musical ambitions and enjoying it at the same time...

 

[MrBrau1]

If white dudes on a U2 board are debating whether he's "the greatest"... he's not the greatest.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

the new Rolling Stone

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

he still wins because he's Flava Flav

point.

and today's useless fact that doesn't really matter but i'm gonna say it anyway, flava flav and previously mentioned dream theater are both from long island.

just more useless information to knock out some little morsal of useful knoweldge in your mind

 

[#1bonofan]

I may be out of the norm, but I can't stand Kanye West. I think he's an annoying little prick who has no reason to be that cocky. But that's just my opinion.