NBA 2021-22: Ben Simmons and Kyrie Walk Into A Bar While Talking About The Lakers

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Boston's going to have to take it - Golden State won't put up a stinker in a close out game.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Steph didn't make a 3 for the first time in 233 games, the Celtics went to the free throw line 16 more times than Golden State... and the Warriors won going away.

That. That's not good.

 

[Hewson]

The first quarter start killed them. They had to expend too much energy to battle back in the 3rd and were gassed in the 4th. No contribution whatsoever from the bench.
Starting to think maybe taking Pritchard out of the rotation and inserting Nesmith for 10 minutes might be worth a look. He can at least defend the perimeter. Pritchard has been useless.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

I see two major problems for Boston, and they both center around Marcus Smart.

1) They don't have a real point guard to settle things down when the turnovers start getting out of control. The closest thing they have to a vet who can settle things down is Average Al.

2) Flops don't work in the playoffs. They really don't work in the finals. He's taking it too far.

I get he's the heart of that team - but right now he's hurting them.

 

[Hewson]

2) Flops don't work in the playoffs. .

Unless you're The Mitten. He got away with 2 brutal flops last night.

 

[DaveC]

2) Flops don't work in the playoffs. They really don't work in the finals.

 

[LuckyNumber7]

Yeah idk I saw some gnarly flops

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

caveat - flops work if the other team has two star players go down with brutal season ending injuries.

 

[DaveC]

oh right i forgot that games 5 and 6 were the only two games in that series.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

no the raptors definitely would have won if golden state was healthy.

 

[DaveC]

i hope you stay this salty about the raptors title forever

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

i am salty about many things.

the raptors are not one of those things in any shape or form.

 

[DaveC]

literally every time that championship gets mentioned you always toss in a "yeah but" or "caveat" or some other attempt to discredit it, but sure, no salt there at all. lol

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

i don't think statement of fact is being salty - but whatever floats your boat.

i'm salty about plaxico burress shooting himself in the leg when the giants were defending champs, 11-1, and had already beaten the teams that would become the four conference finalists - three of them on the road.

i'm salty about PJ Brown suplexing charlie ward into the front row.

i'm salty over pat riley faxing his resignation (even though i've accepted it as the right professional move on his part).

i'm salty over 7 game lead with 17 to play.

i'm salty over a few gambling bad beats.

i'm not salty over the toronto raptors taking advantage of the opportunity given them. the warriors suffering two catastrophic titles doesn't mean the raptors title has an asterisk. the lakers bubble fraud title... that has an asterisk. hey - we're talking lakers again.

i actually try my best to not even mention the raptors in anything other than broad, generic terms so as not to devolve into, well, this - so consider this a momentary slip, never to happen again.

 

[DaveC]

i'm only being semi-serious anyways. it's a slow work day and i'm bored.

 

[mikal]

If it makes you guys feel any better, I've hardly watched a lick of the Finals and Conference Finals because I'm still sulking about the Bucks losing.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

yea well the bucks only won a title because kevin durant wears sneakers half a size too big

 

[Hewson]

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Giannis Asteriskokumpo

 

[mikal]

yea well the bucks only won a title because kevin durant wears sneakers half a size too big

This narrative might actually go down as one of the most face palming arguments I've ever seen though. His toe would have still been on the line if he had worn 1 size smaller. He probably would have needed to wear a show about 5-6 sizes smaller for him to be behind the line.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Sounds like somebody's salty

 

[mikal]

Sounds like somebody's salty

Well when you read the Songs of Surrender thread, it's tough to not think about salt constantly.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Songs of Sustenance

 

[iron yuppie]

Something I have a hard time understanding is the persistent cult around Kobe Bryant, with hordes of people insisting he is a top 5 or even top 3 player all time, and players like Tatum citing him as an idol of sorts.

Seems to me he is the epitome of a volume scorer, but maybe I'm missing something. Or maybe the whole Black Mamba marketing scheme has just been wildly effective over time.

 

[LuckyNumber7]

People value championships over anything else in basketball. Once you’re great, that becomes the measure.

Oh also don’t be a million years old, sorry Bill Russell.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Something I have a hard time understanding is the persistent cult around Kobe Bryant, with hordes of people insisting he is a top 5 or even top 3 player all time, and players like Tatum citing him as an idol of sorts.

Seems to me he is the epitome of a volume scorer, but maybe I'm missing something. Or maybe the whole Black Mamba marketing scheme has just been wildly effective over time.

There's a lot.... A LOT... of revisionist history when it comes to Kobe.

First being that he was somehow better than Shaq when they played together which, i mean, come on. That's an absurd argument and only shows you were probably too young to have actually seen those titles.

Kobe is not the greatest player of his generation. That's Tim Duncan. The advanced stats are fairly clear on this. There's even legit debate about whether or not Kobe was ever the best player in the league at any given time.

but kobe stans gonna kobe stan.

 

[iron yuppie]

I can't believe I'm citing Reddit, but I found something there that I thought was interesting in terms of advanced metrics on his scoring: "A stat that adjusts efficiency across all eras is TS Add. Kobe had a career TS Add of 1122.3 in 1346 games, meaning that he scored 1122.3 points more than someone would if they shot league average TS% on the same amount of attempts. That's pretty good, but it doesn't compare to some of the greatest scorers of all time, especially when you consider longevity. Jordan had a career TS Add of 1943.8 in 1072 games, LeBron 2631.7 in 1265, KD 2607.7 in 849, Wilt 3587.0 in 1045 and Kareem 4718.8 in 1560. Even someone like Reggie Miller (3449.8 in 1389) does substantially better in this category." From r/nbadiscussion.

Anyway, it seems pretty clear his cultural perception outstrips his statistical performance. A significant percentage of the population seems to perceive monomania toward one's craft as an admirable characteristic, hence the persistence of "mamba mentality." Similar to how any Youtube video on Breaking Bad will have a bunch of people fawning over Walter White.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

He is simultaneously an all time great player and also incredibly overrated.

It's an impressive feat

 

[Hewson]

He is simultaneously an all time great player and also incredibly overrated.

It's an impressive feat

Yep.
And one thing Kobe did have is that killer instinct that guys like Jordan and Bird had, and that goes a long way in enhancing the reputation, especially when looking back. He was the lead dog for the last 2 of the 5 titles he won, but as you mentioned above, he was definitely Robin to Shaq's Batman in the 3 they won together.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

If anything Kobe cost the Shaq Lakers a 4th ring - and Larry Brown will vouch for that.