Bono's Solace

[BVS]

It's close-minded to think one religion couldn't! Mine is no splinter.

They knew God and they HAD regulations and they BROKE one of them.

His true church is where He's laid it out. In the scriptures He's laid it out, which prophesies of His true church and which His true church definitely reflects.

Now, I won't get into the discussion of religion because I know...*snap*....how people's minds get. And I know *snap*, what a goat of a will I have.

What is my definition of religion? Religion is different than having the true church. Religion is a general thing...it's worship. It's a certain style of worship, I guess. A church is a structure, a set of rules, that hopefully holds up the truth. It's how the truth is spread, taught, it is order. Religion is more shapeless than that.

There isn't going to be any witch hunt here in the usual petty and catty way.

Good day.

So then by your definition of religion can't you see where Bono is coming from? You say religion is a style of worship, a set of rules. Yes hopefully they hold up the truth, but often they distract people from the truth. Rules that tell people you have to say this word 7 times, don't drink, don't dance, pray at this time of the day, etc. they don't come from God they come from man. Man decided this is what God wants.

There is no witch hunt. If you got that impression than I apologize, but I'm trying to understand your point of view.

I'm not going to ask you what denomination of what organized religion you worship, but it's hard for me to believe it's the only one that holds the entire truth. I have yet to find one religion on this planet that hasn't splintered or morphed from another. Not one.

 

[Katey]

wow lots of movement on this topic lately .. I guess I have a similar view as Bono's I think you know he is like I said walking through it like the rest of us..I think it was Johhny Cash who said I believe what I say but that does not neccesarily make it right.

Just like some people take the Bible to literally sometimes they take Bono to literally.. I come from a irish.protestant background similar to Bono .. and that can be tough I know I walk into certain parts of Ireland and be damned if they dont pin a label on me and try to make me fit into some kind of model of being catholic or protesant.. thats where for me I think wow .. how small the minds as well.
it's not religion that tears people apart it's what people make out of that religion or the power they give it..in part it a bit of ignorance to not accepting other peoples religion.. to falling into a trap and one idea of what religion or faith or who God is and whose idea is right..

And yes the Church from my experince has alot of things wrong with it's why the only truth I know and believe is God.
When I look at the church stand still for so many years on this HIV AIDS crisis and sit and judge and do nothing to help thy neighbour ..I expect the church to take a moral high ground on this and be a leader be compassionate not turn there backs and telling me someone is not living christian . the message that I get from that is not undconditional love and compassion but that this life does not deserve our help.. where is god message in that how is that christian

Do I think Bono has it wrong ..no .. because none of us know if we have it right. we have our own faith and we should all be doing our best to live up to that and at the same time to respect others right to be different..

I think what I understand from what Bono is saying is okay leave me alone to find my solace let God be my guide and let me figure this out.. dont throw this rules on me and narrow my perspective
let me see it all and figure it out for myself.. Don't preach to me one thing and turn around and do another .. don't try to teach me rules.. Show me through action Gods love..the power of the human spirit and grace , that is what sets my soul on fire , sets free my mind and imagination to the awesome gift we have been given .

For all I know God could be upthere going Kate you are getting this all wrong. But like everyone else I'm trying in my own way

 

[biff]

"And yes the Church from my experince has alot of things wrong with it's why the only truth I know and believe is God. "


Yes, Katey. As Bono said, "Religion is the perversion of faith." That pretty well sums it up for me.

 

[BVS]

wow lots of movement on this topic lately .. I guess I have a similar view as Bono's I think you know he is like I said walking through it like the rest of us..I think it was Johhny Cash who said I believe what I say but that does not neccesarily make it right.

Just like some people take the Bible to literally sometimes they take Bono to literally.. I come from a irish.protestant background similar to Bono .. and that can be tough I know I walk into certain parts of Ireland and be damned if they dont pin a label on me and try to make me fit into some kind of model of being catholic or protesant.. thats where for me I think wow .. how small the minds as well.
it's not religion that tears people apart it's what people make out of that religion or the power they give it..in part it a bit of ignorance to not accepting other peoples religion.. to falling into a trap and one idea of what religion or faith or who God is and whose idea is right..

And yes the Church from my experince has alot of things wrong with it's why the only truth I know and believe is God.
When I look at the church stand still for so many years on this HIV AIDS crisis and sit and judge and do nothing to help thy neighbour ..I expect the church to take a moral high ground on this and be a leader be compassionate not turn there backs and telling me someone is not living christian . the message that I get from that is not undconditional love and compassion but that this life does not deserve our help.. where is god message in that how is that christian

Do I think Bono has it wrong ..no .. because none of us know if we have it right. we have our own faith and we should all be doing our best to live up to that and at the same time to respect others right to be different..

I think what I understand from what Bono is saying is okay leave me alone to find my solace let God be my guide and let me figure this out.. dont throw this rules on me and narrow my perspective
let me see it all and figure it out for myself.. Don't preach to me one thing and turn around and do another .. don't try to teach me rules.. Show me through action Gods love..the power of the human spirit and grace , that is what sets my soul on fire , sets free my mind and imagination to the awesome gift we have been given .

For all I know God could be upthere going Kate you are getting this all wrong. But like everyone else I'm trying in my own way

Well said.

 

[Moonlit_Angel]

Very well said, Katey and BVS. . And thanks, biff. .

I can understand your reservations...but if you know something is true, then you don't have the reservations about saying it.

Agreed. But when it comes to religion, with every faith, there is a group of people that always claim theirs is the true one, and each one claims they have the proof for it, so when I encounter groups from tons of faiths that keep telling me theirs is the right one, and I should join that faith, I have no clue who to believe in regards to that.

Originally posted by Soul Always
You can prove the truth.

Depends on the issue.

Angela

 

[Soul Always]

Well, now I feel like people are coming at me from every which direction. I can't keep up, and so I won't try.

 

[BVS]

Well, now I feel like people are coming at me from every which direction. I can't keep up, and so I won't try.

I don't think anyone was trying to overwhelm you, I think it's just that when someone claims to have the truth others are interested. People seek the truth and you claimed you have it, yet you didn't share any.

 

[nbcrusader]

Agreed. But when it comes to religion, with every faith, there is a group of people that always claim theirs is the true one, and each one claims they have the proof for it, so when I encounter groups from tons of faiths that keep telling me theirs is the right one, and I should join that faith, I have no clue who to believe in regards to that.

So, does this negate the fact that one of the posed religions has The Truth?

 

[Soul Always]

I don't think anyone was trying to overwhelm you, I think it's just that when someone claims to have the truth others are interested. People seek the truth and you claimed you have it, yet you didn't share any.

The problem is that you can have all the truth in the world but if nobody is willing to listen to you then it does no good to talk.

 

[biff]

The problem is that you can have all the truth in the world but if nobody is willing to listen to you then it does no good to talk.

Who here has demonstrated that we are not "willing to listen"? We are all willing to listen to you, so talk, please. If it is really "the truth" that you espouse, then why are you so reluctant to share?

 

[Soul Always]

Who here has demonstrated that we are not "willing to listen"? We are all willing to listen to you, so talk, please. If it is really "the truth" that you espouse, then why are you so reluctant to share?

Lots of sad experience.

 

[biff]

That's just plain insulting.

I am adding to this because otherwise my post will make no sense. What the previous post said really WAS insulting, but it was almost immediately changed, and I suspect no one else was awake to read it.

 

[Soul Always]

That's just plain insulting.

I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.

 

[biff]

I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.

Yes, I know that. I remember you from another site. What's the point?

 

[Soul Always]

Yes, I know that. I remember you from another site. What's the point?

Ah. You remember me from another site. What's the point? If you want the truth you can find it there. It's amazing how many people say they want the truth but really don't want it.

 

[biff]

If you have a profound conviction of this truth, then you will want to share it with everyone throughout this forum.

 

[Soul Always]

If you have a profound conviction of this truth, then you will want to share it with everyone throughout this forum.

I think I do regularly. Everything I say is a reflection of what I believe.

 

[biff]

 

[Soul Always]

We don't Bible bash, debate, stuff things in people's faces, protest other religions, get aggressive...sorry.

 

[BVS]

Soul Always, don't take this the wrong way, you said Bono has a lot to learn, but I believe you have a lot to learn about sharing your beliefs. Insults and judgements are not the way to get people to listen. Even if you did have the truth no one would ever know because these insults would negate anything you said.

 

[Soul Always]

Soul Always, don't take this the wrong way, you said Bono has a lot to learn, but I believe you have a lot to learn about sharing your beliefs. Insults and judgements are not the way to get people to listen. Even if you did have the truth no one would ever know because these insults would negate anything you said.

Don't assume I don't know how to share my beliefs. 1. This isn't the right medium for this type of discussion. 2. You need to be face to face. 3. You learn through the Spirit, or you don't learn the truth at all. Believe me. No amount of brainy conversation will ever convince you of the truth.

4. I am always right about how thing will turn out when I open my mouth and say I know something. People call me insulting, arrogant, and on and on - and insult me.

 

[Katey]

I think the truth is only something I can figure out for myself.. theonly thing I ever get concerned about is when people try to push there version of the truth on me or there religion on me and tell me it's the right way.. I respect the right of each of us to believe something different .. And I like learning about other peoples beliefs and their thoughts..it gives my a broader spectrum of understanding..My faith in god is very very strong and it is not easily bent or waivered by opinions of others.. I expect alot of myself and the way I life my life and that way is based on my faith... it might be right or it might wrong.. but what is great is that it is mine and if I am getting it wrong I have no one to blame but myself.This started out with Bono's quote on finding solace , and it is a favourite of mine becasue I to find my own solace in so many different places .. I'venever though it my place to say hey you should believe in God.. cause if they dont have that already that belief I'm not sure I am the one that can or should be giving it to them.. it's always something you have to feel yourself..

i think getting it from someone else it just kinda of like cheatin on a math exam or something you know I kinda think if you get it that way ..it's kind of a way that won't last if you have nothing to back it up..it's superficial. I'ts like my parents telling me my whole life i am a chrisitian.. when the truth is I was not a chrisitan until the dayI felt it

 

[Moonlit_Angel]

Once again, Katey, very nicely said .

Originally posted by nbcrusader
So, does this negate the fact that one of the posed religions has The Truth?

That's the thing, though, we can't say for sure that it's a fact that one of the posed religions has the truth, because we don't know which one, if any, has it.

As for wanting truth and all that-look, if, when I'm discussing a particular religion's beliefs with someone who is of that religion, that person presents sufficient enough evidence to convince me that their religion is the right one for me to be a part of (and does so in a way that doesn't appear as though they're shoving it down my throat), I'll gladly join up. But so far, not a single faith has given me sufficient enough proof that their religion is the right one. When I'm looking at religion in general with more questions than answers, I dunno, I think that tells me something. I'm still trying to figure out everything in regards to the few religious beliefs I do have, so add that in to all the other questions out there about other faiths, and I'm left very confused by it all.

I mean no offense to anybody here who is more religious, by the way. You've all found what works best for you, and more power to ya. This is just my personal view of the whole thing.

Angela

 

[Katey]

thanks Angela nicely said on your part as well

 

[Soul Always]

I think the truth is only something I can figure out for myself.. theonly thing I ever get concerned about is when people try to push there version of the truth on me or there religion on me and tell me it's the right way.. I respect the right of each of us to believe something different .. And I like learning about other peoples beliefs and their thoughts..it gives my a broader spectrum of understanding..My faith in god is very very strong and it is not easily bent or waivered by opinions of others.. I expect alot of myself and the way I life my life and that way is based on my faith... it might be right or it might wrong.. but what is great is that it is mine and if I am getting it wrong I have no one to blame but myself.This started out with Bono's quote on finding solace , and it is a favourite of mine becasue I to find my own solace in so many different places .. I'venever though it my place to say hey you should believe in God.. cause if they dont have that already that belief I'm not sure I am the one that can or should be giving it to them.. it's always something you have to feel yourself..

i think getting it from someone else it just kinda of like cheatin on a math exam or something you know I kinda think if you get it that way ..it's kind of a way that won't last if you have nothing to back it up..it's superficial. I'ts like my parents telling me my whole life i am a chrisitian.. when the truth is I was not a chrisitan until the dayI felt it

I agree with a lot that you say. I agree that the truth is something you can only figure out for yourself and that's why I won't push my religion in people's faces, because even though I believe it's the truth, for whatever reason other people may not want it, may not be ready for it, may not be interested at all or want to have anything to do with any religion for whatever reason. So I think it's wrong to push your religion in their faces like so many other religions have tried to do to me.

We're taught that this isn't how people learn the truth.

There's no way you can know the truth through someone else. You can't build your testimony on someone else's. It's a known fact in our church.

"I'ts like my parents telling me my whole life i am a chrisitian.. when the truth is I was not a chrisitan until the dayI felt it ."....I feel exactly the same way.

 

[Soul Always]

Once again, Katey, very nicely said .



That's the thing, though, we can't say for sure that it's a fact that one of the posed religions has the truth, because we don't know which one, if any, has it.

As for wanting truth and all that-look, if, when I'm discussing a particular religion's beliefs with someone who is of that religion, that person presents sufficient enough evidence to convince me that their religion is the right one for me to be a part of (and does so in a way that doesn't appear as though they're shoving it down my throat), I'll gladly join up. But so far, not a single faith has given me sufficient enough proof that their religion is the right one. When I'm looking at religion in general with more questions than answers, I dunno, I think that tells me something. I'm still trying to figure out everything in regards to the few religious beliefs I do have, so add that in to all the other questions out there about other faiths, and I'm left very confused by it all.

I mean no offense to anybody here who is more religious, by the way. You've all found what works best for you, and more power to ya. This is just my personal view of the whole thing.

Angela

"That's the thing, though, we can't say for sure that it's a fact that one of the posed religions has the truth, because we don't know which one, if any, has it."------ but if you do know your church is true then you can say it's a fact.

 

[Soul Always]

"As for wanting truth and all that-look, if, when I'm discussing a particular religion's beliefs with someone who is of that religion, that person presents sufficient enough evidence to convince me that their religion is the right one for me to be a part of (and does so in a way that doesn't appear as though they're shoving it down my throat), I'll gladly join up." ---- without the Spirit you'll never get enough proof that any church is true. Many churches try to convince you but only the Spirit can truly teach you and tell you which is true.

 

[Soul Always]

"But so far, not a single faith has given me sufficient enough proof that their religion is the right one." ---you're looking for the wrong things, possibly in the wrong places...and this is not the way to learn it, anyway.

 

[Soul Always]

"When I'm looking at religion in general with more questions than answers, I dunno, I think that tells me something." ---- I agree. Or when the religin gives you a cold or empty feeling. What's great about the truth is that you know you have the answers, the truth, the truth whispers to you. You just know. It fills you up. You don't have all those pernicious questions anymore...believe me.

 

[BVS]

"That's the thing, though, we can't say for sure that it's a fact that one of the posed religions has the truth, because we don't know which one, if any, has it."------ but if you do know your church is true then you can say it's a fact.

But it's true for you, it's not true for me. I've tried your religion, it didn't work for me. I have friends that were raised in your religion and left as they got older. I'm glad it works for you. But is it really fact when it's only "true" for some?