My mind tends to wander during the Pledge.

[martha]

I noticed it this morning. It happens many mornings, but it was especially bad today. My hand was over my heart, and my mouth was pledging allegiance to flag and nation, yet I was thinking that I hadn't prepared something for the math lesson this afternoon.

I'm not unpatriotic, just too busy.

 

[KhanadaRhodes]

not to start a debate, but mine did because i was always wondering why it was mandatory. i'm not a big believer in pledges.

 

[martha]

It's such a boring confession, so we can spice the thread up a bit.

I don't require my students to say it if they have a good reason. My Jehovah's Witness students don't say it. They just stand.

 

[BAW]

I never said it out loud ...I just moved my mouth

I did the same thing when we had to sing. I was a rebel.

 

[BAW]

Do they still say "ready...begin"

 

[Mr. BAW]

I would really piss my teacher off when I put my left hand over my right shoulder!!!!

But all the girls thought I was cute!!

Hey, this was the 50's when girls were girls!!!!!! These girls could be your moms!!!

 

[Angela Harlem]

Just curious Martha, what is deemed a good reason? Not by you in particular, but I guess America in general. Obviously being Jehovah's Witness is a good one lol.

 

[HeartlandGirl]

Let's face it. If you say the same thing over and over (or do the same thing over and over), it becomes routine. And the brain naturally devotes less attention to something when it can get by with less. Say the pledge a thousand times, the brain's like "Oh yeah. I know the drill. Blah blah...hmm...I wish I'd had Pop-Tarts for breakfast instead of yogurt..."

"Hmm...that Heartland person is posting some random stuff again..." *mind wanders*

 

[unforgettableFOXfire]

Im not a big fan of pledges of any variety, and Im rather glad that I dont have to deal with such routine every day.

As far as I can tell, forcing people to pledge allegience is like telling kids to eat their broccoli. Forcing them to pledge is a pointless exercise; the people who love their country already don't need to do this to know where their heart is and know where they stand, and the ones who dont love their country arent going to be coaxed into it by forcing them to memorize and recite a string of patriotic verse. You cant force someone to love something, you cant force them to mean what they say - but just because they say it, doesnt mean they mean it. If people are to truly love and appreciate, they must come to find it themselves, give them something to be proud of and they will, force them to be proud of something they cannot just causes unnecessary stresses.

Even so, if you love your country and have nothing to prove, no reason to prove it to anyone, you shouldnt feel ashamed by not feeling it necessary to devote extra time and attention to something you believe in, and its of especially little importance whether or not people see you as 'patriotic' or not... Patriotism is fine, but its hardly a measure of your worth as part of humanity, I would go so far as to say the ones who are upset when people are not being patriotic are the ones who are unsure if they really mean what theyre saying when they recite something of that nature. Uncertainty and doubt breed fear which tends to breed anger and wanting to deflect attention away from themselves to someone who is a more open target to that which hits close to their own weakness/uncertainty. Maybe Im wrong, maybe Im right, I really dont care though... Im extremely patriotic, I love Canada and I wouldnt want to live anywhere else - does that mean I have to shout it from the rooftops or recite prose every morning? I hardly think so. Maybe some people think it actually matters... Who knows... But I certainly don't think ill of you, dear martha.

 

[bammo2]

I have never been able to get my head around the fact that you have to pledge allegiance. Makes me feel uncomfortable to think of all those kids being made to recite something - it all seems a bit 'big brother'

Don't get me wrong - I'm all for people loving their country. If you didn't have to say it all the time, it's more likely that when you do say it, it would actually mean something to you.

I hope that made sense.......

 

[meegannie]

We used to pledge allegience to the UK just to be difficult. :nerdalert:

 

[Mr. BAW]

The only thing the pledge meant to me (back then) that it was the official start of another 7 hours of "do this, do that!!!'

back then.... for now

 

[Laura M]

do you say the pledge everyday?

 

[IWasBored]

we had to say it everyday in middle school, but the high school i moved to didn't say it because they deemed it politically incorrect (with a large number of kids from other countries who aren't staying here permanently, and because it's just a sickening place in the sense that everything has to be utlra-PC around here, even though through some irony it ends up the opposite, but that's another rant for another time).

i actually had to think of what you meant by 'the pledge'

never been a huge fan of it myself, in middle school i'd stand there, but i wouldn't say anything, but it was probably because it was in the morning and i was too tired to be bothered with anything...

 

[U2zoogirl]

I must admitt that a lot of people here (in Colombia) doesn't believe in the national pledge, not even in the anthem, you know, because its hard for us to believe that "good will raise from furrows of pain", the lyrics was composed by a lousy dead president, and we are in a not so good situation... but we are trying to find other ways to show that we love our country.

The bad thing about the symbols of national identity (not in all countries) is that they become boring, they loose all meaning and, in the worst cases, can be corrupted.

 

[martha]

A good reason would be any reason a 9-year-old could articulate. Religious or political. A kid just not wanting to wouldn't fly, but if he or she could give a me any reason, that kid would be excused from saying it. He or she would still have to stand and show respect, though.

I have my class say it every morning because it's district policy. I don't disagree with it, so I do it. I pick my fights carefully, and this wouldn't be one of them.

I think we still say "ready begin," but to tell you the truth, I don't really know! I guess my mind starts wandering even then!!

 

[Angela Harlem]

I forgot your kids are only 9 Martha lol. That is true what you say about their age and if they can ever state a valid reason it is good you support that.
I'm not looking to start a debate on the rights and wrongs of your pledge and the request it be spoken, the whole thing to me is a foreign concept. My country just doesn't have that level of patriotism unless it is about sport.

 

[Mr. BAW]

A good reason would be any reason a 9-year-old could articulate. Religious or political. A kid just not wanting to wouldn't fly, but if he or she could give a me any reason, that kid would be excused from saying it. He or she would still have to stand and show respect, though.

I have my class say it every morning because it's district policy. I don't disagree with it, so I do it. I pick my fights carefully, and this wouldn't be one of them.

I think we still say "ready begin," but to tell you the truth, I don't really know! I guess my mind starts wandering even then!!

OK...you've given Jr. a good reason not to say the pledge; he takes it one step further and turns his back during the pledge...what now???

 

[joyfulgirl]

I was always proud to say it as a kid because I just liked being able to repeat an adult-like thing from memory. But I have never said it as an adult and I don't think that has anything to do with one's patriotism.

But you are wise to pick your fights carefully. I would, too.

 

[martha]

Ok, I listened carefully and it comes over the PA like this: "Please stand. Put you right hand over your heart. Ready...begin." I guess the kids giving direction are thinking maybe the kinnygardners need to be reminded it's the right hand.



Mr. B, if the kid felt that strongly about it, I'd allow him to leave the room to express his displeasure, but I wouldn't allow him to turn his back in the classroom. Remember, my students are 9. I highly doubt it would get that far.

 

[Mirrorball2606]

yeah, saying the pledge when i was in elementary school was all good and great and everyone was happy ?... psh... now some of us have grown conciences (still haven't learned how to spell well. MORE FUNDING), anyway, many of us believe that it is against the constitution. we sit silently and wait for the drones to say the pledge everyone sits back down and says, "why don't you say it? it's not that big of a deal. do you hate america, are you a communist, are you an anarchist?" anyway, you get my drift. ... bad in high school ... good in elementary school. hopefully....

peace, toner
post script - oh, and by many kids i mean a combined of roughly eleven out of a student body of 1200.
________________
one cannot live on marshmallow chicks alone.
"like hell i can't!"

 

[fah]

Why do some school districts require students and staff to state 'The Pledge' while others do not?

 

[Mullen-Girl]

Ugh I hated saying the pledge every morning. We prayed every morning too all through High School ( I went to catholic school K-12). I would never really pay attention and i'd zone out thinking about the cute guy in class LOL or why the hell I didn't finish my Chem homework.

 

[wolfeden]

I've been going 'round with this lately in my head...
My daughter is in preschool and starts kindergarten in September... and they already have them saying the Pledge. She's 5. Other children in the program are as young as 3. It is through the public school system.

I guess what makes me wonder a little is this; she doesn't have the acumen yet to understand what she's saying or really talking about, never mind the REALLY little ones, and somehow this strikes me as programming, not education. She comes home and 'recites' it and I ask her if she knows what she's talking about, and she snorts at me:
"The Flag!"
"But Aislinn, what does the flag mean?"
"The Flag is, um... America!"

.....oy.
I'm all for having her learn it, don't get me wrong.
It's like anything else she is learning, however -- I would rather not introduce concepts she isn't ready to discuss and understand until such time as she IS ready. Teaching 3-to-5-year-olds to recite this bunch of words they don't know the meanings of and attaching it to a concept as simplistic as a piece of colored cloth....
*shakes head* It just sits wrong with me.

Mind you I'm the same person who, post-9/11, developed a compulsion to pull over and pick up the tattered, dirty American flags I see lying in the trash by the sides of the roads after they've fallen off the SUV antennae they previously graced....

THAT to me is a thousand times more disgraceful than a child refusing to state the Pledge or even turning his back.

Martha, may I say thank you for being a teacher in these times; my family is comprised almost entirely of teachers and I have nothing but respect for anyone who takes it on.

 

[martha]

Why do some school districts require students and staff to state 'The Pledge' while others do not?

I don't know.

 

[martha]

Martha, may I say thank you for being a teacher in these times; my family is comprised almost entirely of teachers and I have nothing but respect for anyone who takes it on.

Thank you.