Love is tough

[AtomicBono]

I've only skimmed this thread really, but geez, you've created one shitheap of a problem. What's going on here is infidelity basically, and emotional infidelity is more insidious and destructive than any amount of shagging. I feel sorry for the boyfriend. Perhaps someone should consider how he is going to feel when he finds out what's going on behind his back.

I think that's a bit harsh... he hasn't created emotional infidelity, it already existed. she said she had liked him for awhile. that would be true whether he has told her or not I don't feel like Lance is in the wrong here.

i hope she breaks it off with Jordan because she shouldn't have to be in a relationship where she's not truly happy, and really it's dishonest to be in a relationship when you have feelings for someone else. yes it will suck for the boyfriend, though I don't really know what their relationship is like, but I don't see how it can be avoided. even if she stays with him now, it sounds like it will eventually end. it's not her fault either, no one can help the way they feel, and she hasn't done anything that constitutes as cheating yet. but this is just my opinion based solely on reading this thread, I don't know these people personally obviously.

Lance, I'm happy for you, and I hope everything works out... I pray that you don't get stuck like I did with false hope. if she breaks up with jordan I think everything will fall in place

 

[Angela Harlem]

Thanks VP.

Infidelity? Well, call it what you will, but honestly, when I strip away all person bias and even a little selfishness, all I want for her is happiness.

I dont think people are being so hard on you as it might seem. Many people go through these situations. It doesn't make them morally bankrupted people. You are being the interloper in this, though. That's not a matter of opinion. You even state (and understandably, this is the girl you have fallen head over heels for) that you will do anything to help her with her breakup. I dont question you have only good intentions with that, but it does still remain. You are in love with her and she is tied up with someone else. You're the interloper, mate. You need to understand your role. I know you're going to get defensive, but please try and understand no one is trying to paint you as something you are not; more to hope you see what you might actually be, instead.

 

[Laura M]

our hands eventually hunted each other down into a firm and loving grip under the conceilment of the blanket. I don't believe a first kiss is waiting too far in the future, and I'm actively craving it now.

I can't believe this thread is this long.

Anyway, this may not constitute as cheating to some but you'd have to imagine what her boyfriend would think if he happened to find that out. I'm sure he won't think it's okay because that's how she has felt for a while about someone else.

Her relationship with her boyfriend is their business. Nobody else should be getting involved. There are two stories and we're just hearing one side of it.
Getting involved in it, flirting with her and holding her hand when she is still seeing someone doesn't seem like the most sensible way to approach the whole thing.

What's the harm in waiting a while for her to break it off (if it seems like it will happen)? It would probably save you from a lot of potential hassle.

 

[U2girl]

...

 

[Canadiens1131]

 

[namkcuR]

There are two courses of action that are available now:

She tells her boyfriend everything and breaks off the relationship;

or

You back off.

There is no other honourable way. Sorry.

Will you get off your soapbox? There is no reason to be so pissy about it.

He is not breaking up a marriage here. If he's breaking up anything, it's a puppylove romance that started with high-school level flirting during a study hall(or some other similar scenario, you get the picture). And even then, it's hard to say he himself is breaking that relationship up at all when all he's ever done is tell her how he feels....SHE is the one that suggested breaking it off with Jordan, NOT Lance.

He is not pressuring her to do anything she doesn't want to do. He is not in her ear around the clock saying 'leave him, do it, leave him, do it'. He merely admitted to her that he's fallen for her, and it appears that the only reason he's persuing it further at all is because she EXPLICITLY SAID that she's not happy in her current relationship and that she'd like to be in a relationship with him(Lance). If she had said otherwise, judging from what I've read from him in this thread, he'd probably have backed off. He appears to be willing to give her all the time and space she needs, and he even said in this thread that, above all, he wants her to be happy, with or without him.

Also, with regards to your and others(anitram and meegannie in particular), I think it's important to understand that people are not static. By that, I mean that people change as they grow, and the younger a person is, the more growing they have to do, and therefore the more capacity for change they have. This girl is, what, 19? If you are a certain way and you are 45, then yes, I guess you are pretty much what you're going to be, but not when you're 19. Has it ever occured to anyone that the journey of finally breaking it off with the guy, coming to trust the new guy, and falling for the new guy might MAKE her more mature in the long run? And then in doing so, she might - depending on how things go in a hypothetical relationship with Lance - discover how little she and her current bf really had?

I realize that's a lot of 'what if's, but the point is that you can't expect a 19 year old to be a relationship expert. If 19 year olds were relationship experts, they wouldn't start threads in subforum of a U2 board on the internet asking for advice. I'm 22 and I'm the furthest thing from a relationship expert - insofar as I've never really had a real one yet - but objectively speaking, it seems only logical that a 19(or whatever) year old still has plenty of time and room to grow and mature and that you don't grow and mature by doing nothing - you do it by ending relationships, starting relationships, suffering broken hearts, making friends, losing friends, etc etc.

Lance started this thread asking for advice about how to go about making his feelings known to this girl and how to handle the whole situation, so let's help him with that, instead of judging him or his choice of potential girlfriend(neither of whom we've ever ever met, neither of whom we really know it all, and neither of whom we are really in any position to pass judgment on), because that's not what he started the thread for. He didn't say, "I'm in love with this girl, what do you think of her?", he said "I'm in love with this girl, she's taken by a guy she hardly sees, and I'm gonna go totally nuts if I don't tell her how I feel, what do I do?"

From what I read, the guy does not seem to be any kind of a villan that should warrant cold, judgmental posts like the one I'm responding to right now, so can we stop going around yelling 'homewrecker, homewrecker!'? Particularly since there isn't any home to wreck? The kind of man who just pushes and pushes and goes for it with a girl whether she really wants it or not, and with no regard for her current bf A)Does NOT start threads on the internet looking for an outlet for his angst and for advice for how to handle the whole thing without hurting anyone and B)Doesn't fall head over heels with the girl or he'd care more about the possibility of hurting her.

As far as I can see, Lance just seems to be a good guy wanting to make his feelings known without causing anyone any pain, and I don't see why anyone has to look into it any more than that.

That's all.

 

[U2Girl1978]

^ That was wonderful. Thank you for writing that.

 

[Varitek]

^^

Relationships are complex things. While there are areas on the edges that are black and white, wrong and right, there are huge grey areas everywhere else. Lance hasn't done anything wrong, and he's done a lot of right considering how hard it is to be so respectful and sensitive when an emotion like his love for Kate is tearing him apart. Kate's not happy with Jordan, and if anyone deserves blame, then she does for dishonestly carrying on a relationship she doesn't have feeling for anymore. But I personally wouldn't blame her - the only way we can learn is by living, and she's in her first (?) relationship. If 3 relationships later she's still doing the same thing to herself and others, then that's a problem.

So yeah, back off of Lance, he's human and he's doing his best (and it seems to be a good best).

Lance - about finding out that there might be things about her you alluded to, things that might keep you from working out with her or wanting to... that sucks. But better now than a year too late. You should think long and hard about what you want, what you don't want, though I'm only making guesses here. Email me if you want.

 

[Canadiens1131]

Yeah, come on guys.

I could feel bad for all the tool-boxes for boyfriends some of my female friends have dated, but I am me and they are they. If I know a girl I really truly care for has a relationship on the rocks, I'm going to do the right thing and comfort her, dagnabit.

 

[Lancemc]

Well, I was going to stop posting here until after Christmas break, but I figured I owed it to you to at least show my thanks again for all the support and understanding (despite a few unnecessary posts over the past couple pages) I've received.

I must say, namkcuR understands my situation just about as tightly as one could glaze from this thread. Well, we had a bit of a breakthrough yesterday and today. There's little doubt between us that we're in love, and today we even shared our first kiss (Yeah, it was pretty amazing). However, today was also one of the most dramatic days of my life for a bad reason.

Kyle has been acting fairly depressed and of-character the past couple weeks, and last night was the peak. We were all in Kate's room watching Lord of the Rings, and she and I were sharing a blanket. I could tell Kyle was depressed for some reason, and he kept leaving the room for long periods of time. Now, Kate and I both understand that there are two major obstacles infront of us with this whole relationship thing. The biggest one is of course Jordan. And by the way, she's definitely ending it with him over break, and she seems pretty relieved about it. Like a weight has been lifted form her shoulders. It's good to see her like that.

But anyway, the second obstacle was Kyle. Now, we all sort of secretly has little suspicions that Kyle may have liked Kate for a while, but it was nothing serious. Then he started acting this way a few weeks ago whenever Kate and I would do something without him, God forbid! So we knew we had to tell him about us sooner rather than later. Especially since He and I decided we'd move in together next semester in the dorm.

So today, we finally bit the bullet and went to talk to Kyle. We told him Kate was going to be breaking up with Jordan to be with me, and I could tell he was really broken up. We didn't say much, partly from shock, and party out of fear of his reaction. He was extremely repressed, and nearly started crying before I suggested we give him some time alone.

So, Kate spoke to him alone, and discovered Kyle has had strong feelings for her just about since the first week of school, and how he feels extremely inadequate. I spoke to him over AIM breifly as well since we told him, and he only asked me "Is this a joke?" I told him I was afraid it's not, and he hasn't said a single word about it to me since. He did however tell me he thinks he broke his hand, but that he "popped" it back into place. I urged him to let us take him to a hosptial, but he rejected any help.

So basically, he's a wreck, and Kate's upset about it and thinks she a horrible person for the way he reacted. Now, neither Kate or I really deserve to take any blame for this, but we can't help but worry about him and feel like we could have done something sooner. So, the bottom line is, we may or may not have lost one of our best friends here, and I'm not sure if he can handle the stress. It's really upsetting because he's never had a girlfriend (or even merely a female friend for that matter), and since Kate was really his first sincere female friend, he simply doesn't have the emotional capacity to handle something like this. And the bitch of it all is, this would have happened to him even if I had never had feelings for Kate in the first place, because she just doesn't feel that way about him.

So, that's my drama for the day. I'm extremely concerned about him, but he wont talk to me. I also cannot focus on this 10-page paper due tomorrow, because I'm so shaken up. I've never "killed" a friendship before like this, even though I don't feel any guilt or responsibility for the way he's acting. I think it was inevitable anyway. The problem's only compounded by the fact that it was ME who ended up with her, and not some other completely strange guy.

So, while Kate and I are moving along wonderfully (though we still need to get through the Jordan breakup, but neither of us think that's going to be anywhere near as difficult as this Kyle issue. Her relationship with Jordan is pretty hollow on the inside), I'd be more than willing to take NEW advice on dealing with Kyle. Part of me tells me he'll come around in time, but another part of me thinks we've both lost him for good.

 

[Canadiens1131]

See, that's what happens when you wait too long to make your feelings known to a girl. In this case you were the winner and he was the other guy.

 

[Lancemc]

See, that's what happens when you wait too long to make your feelings known to a girl. In this case you were the winner and he was the other guy.

Well, that's one way to look at it.

Well, good news at least. Kyle actually spoke to me tonight, and it turns out he's not really too mad at me. Kate's a different story though. I think he feels she may have been leading him on for a while (which obviously wasn't the case) and she purposefully ignored his "signals".

He said he still wants me to move in with him next semester, but I'm honesty not too comfortable with that. For one thing, I'm kinda scared of the kid. Just a little, and it's probably unfounded, but he's got some issues. And secondly, if Kate ever comes over to see me, can anyone say "awkward"? Yet at the same time I can't NOT move in with him, because that would only push him away further, making him feel less wanted in our little friend-circle-of-chaos we have going here.

 

[Laura M]

when all he's ever done is tell her how he feels


and with no regard for her current bf

There's little doubt between us that we're in love, and today we even shared our first kiss

Maybe we should all pat Lance on the back for kissing someone while she's still seeing someone (bad relationship or not), namkcuR.

Lance, it just seems that this whole thing is getting more and more complicated, expecially with this Kyle bloke getting involved. Seems like you could just be making things harder for yourselves in the long run, especially if she tells her boyfriend everything that has gone on. That will be another issue you'll both have to deal with.

 

[U2girl]

I wasn't going to post because I didn't want to fight with some of the above posters. But I will say this:

1. They both have feelings for each other. She IS interested in pursuing a relationship with him.
2. Kate IS breaking up a relationship, which she wanted to do for a year now. What does that tell you about that relationship?
3. Let's not forget who did the first signal here with the head on shoulder thing.
4. There are more ways out of this, not just "back off Lance" and "Kate tells her boyfriend and you two don't have a chance". Ever considered the "Kate tells Jordan, they break up and in due time, Lance and Kate start a relationship" option?

So go easy with all the "adultery" notes. It not his fault he fell for a taken girl and vice versa, or that Kyle happened to like Kate too.

That said, I feel you could have waited for the kiss till the breaking up with Jordan thing was over. Giver her some time to think.

 

[the soul waits]

Ever considered the "Kate tells Jordan, they break up and in due time, Lance and Kate start a relationship" option?

i doubt that any of the above posters would have a problem with this scenario.

But that's not how it happened, did it?

 

[U2girl]

Somehow I doubt this would make much difference.

It may not have happened exactly like this, but it sure looks like that is the scenario now - Kate/Jordan relationship is off, Kate/Lancemc begins.

 

[Chizip]

This is what I would worry about

Basically, she's just afraid to break up with Jordan, even though she basically told me she knows she'd never be happy with him. She's afraid of letting go of the stability of the one significant relationship she's ever had.

I must say though, I never knew she had such low self-confidence. She was telling me how amazed she is when people "like her back" because she's so weird and awkward.

It sounds like she has some issues and used the last relationship as a security blanket. She is 19 and has been with this guy for 3 years, so basically her whole dating life has been in a relationship with this guy. And even though she didn't really like him that much anymore, she has strung him along for over a year because she is afraid of leaving the security blanket that is/was the relationship.

The best thing for her would probably be having some time just to herself for a little while, to figure some things out and learn how to get out from under the security blanket. But now she is leaving one blanket to immediately get under another one (both figuratively and literally it seems) and youre both already saying you're in love and all that.

So I don't know, I'd just take that as a bit of a warning sign.

 

[Angela Harlem]

So go easy with all the "adultery" notes. It not his fault he fell for a taken girl and vice versa, or that Kyle happened to like Kate too.

There's always 2 sides to things, and honestly, I'd be cringing at what we're all writing in here if it were not intended as a public forum discussion. However, Lance (which I absolutely agree is out of anyone's control) fell for someone who was unavailable. Unavailable, no matter how you paint it. The girl was still with her boyfriend of 3 years. Lance became the interloper by telling her. He risked his friendship with the girl he said this to, by putting her in a potentially horrible situation. If she'd not felt the same way, then he'd be feeling like an arse and would have done some serious damage. However, that is a hypothetical. We can leave them. It seems the one common issue the dissenters have is he pursued a relationship to a girl (his friend) who should have been strictly and utterly OUT OF BOUNDS!. God, I've turned into Zoney with the CAPS! Sorry. But lets all speak freely, eh. This therad is about to get closed because some of us are honestly a tad wide eyed at the gall and enthusiasm displayed for hapless Lance falling for a girl he, for all intents and purposes, had NO right to go chasing after.

I dont find it galant. I've also got reservations about this girl who takes a year to break up with one long term boyfriend to begin with another. If she did it to Jordan, then Lance, what are you? Adonis? Mate, be careful.

But anyway, this is all falling on deaf ears. Lance is doing a noble thing to half of us, and making the other half cringe at how the luck of her feeling the same way makes his cutting in on another fellow's partner a pretty alright thing.



Yes, I've taken the moral high road. But I have earned my right to. I made a decision once upon a time to set boundaries. I once fell for someone who was going out with a mate. Never told a soul. It was painful for a shitfully long arsed time. I'm not a better person for it; I just couldn't ever sleep at night knowing I had made myself a wedge and forced myself into the space of another's relationship.

Needless to say, no intention of causing anger here. Just speaking from a genuine concern at the situation. As I suspect a rather few of us have.

 

[dazzlingamy]

Lance, I just hope this Jordan break up goes to plan and you and KAte can start seeing each other properly.

But i think you should realise that (that is, if you haven't already)

that she <i> says </i> she'll break up with him, but is he ready to break up with her? He might fight for her, remind her of the fun times, and it all could go horribly wrong - not saying it will but its a possibility

also, (and this is from experience) women get ansty on the rebound. Even though the relationship has been 'hollow' for a year, they're still together he is still her boyfriend, and when she breaks up, she might need to fly do you know what i mean? Be there for her, still love her and support her, but don't restrict her into a big ol relationship!

Good luck.

 

[Varitek]

You can't help when you fall in love. Lay off, guys. Obviously Kate has her own issues and should have broken up with Jordan ages ago, and she didn't, but now she is working through those issues and she's going to. I think it's better she do that in person over break (which I assume is her plan) than call him up now so she can be done with it before she kisses Lance. Well, they were in the moment, they're in love, Kate is ending the other relationship, and while they could have wated, maybe should to let the baggage clear, they didn't and it's really not to big of a crime. Though I do second Chizip's recommendation to give her space to come into her own without a boyfriend before diving into something that you want to last a long, long time. But people. For christsakes it's a high school relationship that should have been dead ages ago, and for those of you on this board who appear not to be in college, well, there are many many worse ways I've seen high school relationships end. What Kate and Lance are doing is really quite tame and dignified in comparison to how most high school relationships end in college.

don't tell someone that he had no right to chase someone. He wasn't chasing, he fell, first of all. Threads shouldn't be closed because people try to hijack someone's support thread into a moral discussion - take it to FYM or start a new thread if you want to discuss the ethics of this. Lance was going through a crazy emotional time, we were supporting him, and I think if you read up the posts, many of his supporters have been others close to his age/situation in life, that is college students and recent grads and student-aged people. Look, at this age, there are some not so serious, some serious relationships, and there are some that used to be and people just can't bear to end them because they don't have the emotional maturity to recognize that things are over and need to be declared so. We're learning at this age. Lance isn't an "interloper" into a marriage here. Angela, there's different kinds of relationships, if the one you declined to interrupt was a strong one, than good for you, it is impressive and commendable that you did that. But the one Lance "interloped" into was dying, should have been dead, and even if he'd not fallen for her he would have been a good friend to tell her she should break it off with Jordan and help her through - otherwise what kind of friend watches a friend stuck in a relationship that isn't making them happy and doesn't try at least once to give some support and advice?


Anyway Lance, back to the point, which is to advise you - I agree with Chizip, and what I said to you in that email a while ago, that you need to make sure that she is over Jordan, and that she has learned from the situation. If she has, if she can follow through, break up, and recognize what went wrong and where it went wrong and what she should have done and would do in the future, then I think she's fine - again we're 19 here, we're only learning, you can't expect everyone to get it right the first time. Don't be her rebound, just be a friend, give her space, and make sure you've talked to her about this. Tell her, look, it's gonna kill me to wait but ultimately it will make us better, you need some space.

And yeah, good luck. Ignore the flak you don't deserve, and keep us informed. You have my email if you feel that people have spoiled this public forum for you.

 

[U2girl]

There's always 2 sides to things, and honestly, I'd be cringing at what we're all writing in here if it were not intended as a public forum discussion. However, Lance (which I absolutely agree is out of anyone's control) fell for someone who was unavailable. Unavailable, no matter how you paint it. The girl was still with her boyfriend of 3 years. Lance became the interloper by telling her. He risked his friendship with the girl he said this to, by putting her in a potentially horrible situation. If she'd not felt the same way, then he'd be feeling like an arse and would have done some serious damage. However, that is a hypothetical. We can leave them. It seems the one common issue the dissenters have is he pursued a relationship to a girl (his friend) who should have been strictly and utterly OUT OF BOUNDS!. God, I've turned into Zoney with the CAPS! Sorry. But lets all speak freely, eh. This therad is about to get closed because some of us are honestly a tad wide eyed at the gall and enthusiasm displayed for hapless Lance falling for a girl he, for all intents and purposes, had NO right to go chasing after.

I dont find it galant. I've also got reservations about this girl who takes a year to break up with one long term boyfriend to begin with another. If she did it to Jordan, then Lance, what are you? Adonis? Mate, be careful.

But anyway, this is all falling on deaf ears. Lance is doing a noble thing to half of us, and making the other half cringe at how the luck of her feeling the same way makes his cutting in on another fellow's partner a pretty alright thing.



Yes, I've taken the moral high road. But I have earned my right to. I made a decision once upon a time to set boundaries. I once fell for someone who was going out with a mate. Never told a soul. It was painful for a shitfully long arsed time. I'm not a better person for it; I just couldn't ever sleep at night knowing I had made myself a wedge and forced myself into the space of another's relationship.

Needless to say, no intention of causing anger here. Just speaking from a genuine concern at the situation. As I suspect a rather few of us have.

I would agree with the "back off" stance if - she didn't feel the same (it takes two and she, not Lance, was in a relationship yet somehow Lance gets all the flak) and more importantly - if the Kate/Jordan wasn't a falling apart relationship.

Also some here paint this as "Lance chased her". From what I read, all he did was tell her how he felt, after getting signals from her. She had all the reason to say "lay off, you know I'm seeing someone already" and end the friendship potentially.

Everything afterwards was consentual, though I agree he should have waited for kissing, holding hands etc for after the air cleared with Jordan (and now Kyle) and yes, it could be risky getting in a relationship with someone who waits for a year to break up with someone. I believe Lancemc already said he needs to tread carefully now.

 

[Laura M]

You can't help when you fall in love. Lay off, guys. Obviously Kate has her own issues and should have broken up with Jordan ages ago, and she didn't, but now she is working through those issues and she's going to. I think it's better she do that in person over break (which I assume is her plan) than call him up now so she can be done with it before she kisses Lance.

don't tell someone that he had no right to chase someone. He wasn't chasing, he fell, first of all. Threads shouldn't be closed because people try to hijack someone's support thread into a moral discussion - take it to FYM or start a new thread if you want to discuss the ethics of this. Lance was going through a crazy emotional time, we were supporting him, and I think if you read up the posts, many of his supporters have been others close to his age/situation in life, that is college students and recent grads and student-aged people. Look, at this age, there are some not so serious, some serious relationships, and there are some that used to be and people just can't bear to end them because they don't have the emotional maturity to recognize that things are over and need to be declared so. We're learning at this age.

But the one Lance "interloped" into was dying, should have been dead, and even if he'd not fallen for her he would have been a good friend to tell her she should break it off with Jordan and help her through - otherwise what kind of friend watches a friend stuck in a relationship that isn't making them happy and doesn't try at least once to give some support and advice?

And yeah, good luck. Ignore the flak you don't deserve, and keep us informed. You have my email if you feel that people have spoiled this public forum for you.

Yes, it is a public forum and people aren't always going to see eye to eye. Of course there will be differing opinions on certain things. If someone can't deal with that then they shouldn't start a thread and have it continue if it gets to the stage where people will feel uncomfortable with what they're reading and make a comment about it. (Yes, they could just ignore it and post elsewhere, but that doesn't always happen)

I think everyone here is trying to give their opinion. Lance asked for advice. Just because everyone doesn't agree that he should not have kissed her or held her hand or got involved isn't telling him what he did was right or wrong, or crticising him. They're stating their opinion about it.

The fact they are young has nothing to do with it. Someone can say he is in love with someone and ready to have a relationship with them, but the fact she has a boyfriend and has spent a year breaking it off with him isn't important because she's young and they both fell for each other? I don't think anyone here denies you can't help who you fall for, but the fact remains that someone is kissing a girl who has a boyfriend. Young or not. Some think it's ok, some don't. I don't think anyone is blaming Lance for all this happening either, but in this situation maintaining contact with the girl and flirting with her isn't solving anything. It might just cause more hassle in the future and someone is bound to get hurt. I'm sure nobody wants that.

I believe Lancemc already said he needs to tread carefully now.

Yes, this was before he kissed her and held her hand under the duvet. Personally I don't think that's treading carefully.

Angie's last post was spot on. She has given some very helpful advice.

Good luck, Lance.

 

[Lancemc]

Like I said before, I wasn't going to post much here until after break, but this thread seems to have exploded.

First of all, I see no reason why this should be closed. The posts disagreeing with what happened are just as valid as the ones supporting it. And some of them could probably even help keep my head out of the clouds.

Secondly, it seems my ambiguity regarding "the kiss" is causing quite a stir. Believe me when I say I'm trying to be careful with this...really careful. We even agreed to take things slowly so she can deal with Jordan and all. But over the course of Saturday night and yesterday afternoon she kissed me twice. Twice, without me returning the display of affection. So I guess when she went in the third time yesterday evening I figured "What the hell", threw caution to the wind and returned the favor. It's not what I intended to happen, or even what I wanted to happen this early in the game, but hey, there is it.

So take that for what it's worth.

 

[U2girl]

Yes, this was before he kissed her and held her hand under the duvet. Personally I don't think that's treading carefully.

I said I think he should have waited - and see below post. She kissed him.

Personally I think there are few people here in fact critisizing Lance and saying he's wrong.

As for people getting hurt, yes. Unfortunately that can happen in relationships forming. Lance could very well be in Kyle's shoes now.

 

[VintagePunk]

Will you get off your soapbox? There is no reason to be so pissy about it.

He is not breaking up a marriage here. If he's breaking up anything, it's a puppylove romance that started with high-school level flirting during a study hall(or some other similar scenario, you get the picture). And even then, it's hard to say he himself is breaking that relationship up at all when all he's ever done is tell her how he feels....SHE is the one that suggested breaking it off with Jordan, NOT Lance.

He is not pressuring her to do anything she doesn't want to do. He is not in her ear around the clock saying 'leave him, do it, leave him, do it'. He merely admitted to her that he's fallen for her, and it appears that the only reason he's persuing it further at all is because she EXPLICITLY SAID that she's not happy in her current relationship and that she'd like to be in a relationship with him(Lance). If she had said otherwise, judging from what I've read from him in this thread, he'd probably have backed off. He appears to be willing to give her all the time and space she needs, and he even said in this thread that, above all, he wants her to be happy, with or without him.

Also, with regards to your and others(anitram and meegannie in particular), I think it's important to understand that people are not static. By that, I mean that people change as they grow, and the younger a person is, the more growing they have to do, and therefore the more capacity for change they have. This girl is, what, 19? If you are a certain way and you are 45, then yes, I guess you are pretty much what you're going to be, but not when you're 19. Has it ever occured to anyone that the journey of finally breaking it off with the guy, coming to trust the new guy, and falling for the new guy might MAKE her more mature in the long run? And then in doing so, she might - depending on how things go in a hypothetical relationship with Lance - discover how little she and her current bf really had?

I realize that's a lot of 'what if's, but the point is that you can't expect a 19 year old to be a relationship expert. If 19 year olds were relationship experts, they wouldn't start threads in subforum of a U2 board on the internet asking for advice. I'm 22 and I'm the furthest thing from a relationship expert - insofar as I've never really had a real one yet - but objectively speaking, it seems only logical that a 19(or whatever) year old still has plenty of time and room to grow and mature and that you don't grow and mature by doing nothing - you do it by ending relationships, starting relationships, suffering broken hearts, making friends, losing friends, etc etc.

Lance started this thread asking for advice about how to go about making his feelings known to this girl and how to handle the whole situation, so let's help him with that, instead of judging him or his choice of potential girlfriend(neither of whom we've ever ever met, neither of whom we really know it all, and neither of whom we are really in any position to pass judgment on), because that's not what he started the thread for. He didn't say, "I'm in love with this girl, what do you think of her?", he said "I'm in love with this girl, she's taken by a guy she hardly sees, and I'm gonna go totally nuts if I don't tell her how I feel, what do I do?"

From what I read, the guy does not seem to be any kind of a villan that should warrant cold, judgmental posts like the one I'm responding to right now, so can we stop going around yelling 'homewrecker, homewrecker!'? Particularly since there isn't any home to wreck? The kind of man who just pushes and pushes and goes for it with a girl whether she really wants it or not, and with no regard for her current bf A)Does NOT start threads on the internet looking for an outlet for his angst and for advice for how to handle the whole thing without hurting anyone and B)Doesn't fall head over heels with the girl or he'd care more about the possibility of hurting her.

As far as I can see, Lance just seems to be a good guy wanting to make his feelings known without causing anyone any pain, and I don't see why anyone has to look into it any more than that.

That's all.

This post is SO insightful and spot-on, and it echoes exactly how I see the situation.

Given the ages of everyone involved, it's a time of learning and growth. They're not expected to be relationship experts, or even to be all that self-aware (although Lance seems to be well beyond his years in self-awareness, from what I've read). And for the record, I'm oooollllld, so I've been around the block a time or two. I have a daughter who is close to their ages. I've also been on the receiving end of a college-break up, a situation very similar to this, back in the dark ages. Whether or not Kate and Lance stay together 4-eva, they'll all come out of this just fine. 10 or 15 years down the road, there won't be any lasting scars. Really.

Good luck Lance. I really hope you choose to keep us posted.

And btw...heaven forbid, but if things don't work out with Kate... my daughter is cute, intelligent, great sense of humour...

 

[anitram]

Needless to say, no intention of causing anger here. Just speaking from a genuine concern at the situation. As I suspect a rather few of us have.

I agree with you 100% (is this a new thing for us?).

I understand the opposing view. I just feel that for ME, this constitutes bad karma in life and it's why I would not have pursued the same course of action. That's all. We all make choices in life, and you can say that this is probably something small and nobody will remember it in 15 years, but that's immaterial to me personally. What matters is what choice I believe is right under the circumstances and I have just had enough life experience to conclude that it's bad karma to get involved with involved people. Yes, you can't help whom you fall for, but you can help how you react to it and what choices you make in respect of it.

Nobody is equating Lance with satan here. Some of us just don't see his actions as something we ourselves would partake in.

 

[blueeyedgirl]

This thread makes my head hurt.

Next time you want useful advice Lance mate, go to a counsellor. DO NOT start a fucking thread on IF.

 

[Sicy]

I have been following this thread and I must say that this is quite the sticky situation.

On one hand I agree that one cannot control who you fall in love with, and I am sure a lot of us have been there. Whether or not that person has or doesnt have a boyfriend/girlfriend/husband/wife etc., the problem is that love is a very difficult emotion to control. I dont argue with that at all.

On the other hand, I agree that the kissing, hand holding etc. does constitue cheating and is something that probably should have waited until she broke up with her boyfriend. She really needs to sort out that situation first. After 3 years she owes her boyfriend that respect. If she is not happy she needs to tell him so that she can move on. And throw that other friend of yours into the mix and well, I cant imagine how you will be able to face him or the boyfriend and not feel extremely uncomfortable to say the least.

I agree with what Chizip said as well. This girl is 19 and has been in a relationship for 3 years, and now it seems she is going to jump right into another one. I really feel she needs to take some time to herself before jumping into another relationship so soon. Especially under these circumstances. But that's just my opinion.

As far as the thread goes, I feel that for the most part the majority of the posters have remained very civil in giving Lance their opinions and advice. As it should be. Sure, you can disagree with what he's doing, and you are more than welcome to give him your opinion as he did post this on a public forum. But there is no need to be rude. This is what Zoo Confessionals is for. For members who wish to discuss their personal life and problems as sometimes its a lot easer to discuss with strangers behind the computer rather than in person with a professional.

 

[Lancemc]

This thread makes my head hurt.

Next time you want useful advice Lance mate, go to a counsellor. DO NOT start a fucking thread on IF.

Hey now, this thread has provided tons of useful advice and needed support. Just because there have been a few posters projecting the other side of the story doesn't mean it has to go in the gutter. Those opinions are equally valuable.

Yours however have been absolutely worthless, if not downright mean. I seriously don't know what your problem is. I think we'd all appreciate it if you just left. Don't tell me not to post a serious thread that has helped me greatly over the past month or so.

So, THAT'S ALL.

Edit:

Just saw your post Sicy, thank you for that. And I don't disagree either about what you said. I know the intimate contact was probably a mistake. But I can't take that back now, so I'm just trying to make this work out the best I can. Thanks for the help.

 

[U2Girl1978]

This thread makes my head hurt.

Next time you want useful advice Lance mate, go to a counsellor. DO NOT start a fucking thread on IF.

Come on! Is it necessary to be rude? He asked us for advice and that's what he got whether good or bad. You don't see him swearing or being rude to you or others do you? I understand that you think it sucks but everyone has an opinion on this matter.

Please let's be civil about this and not get this thread closed.