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Old 06-09-2010, 01:49 PM   #81
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Don't you have something to go shred?
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Old 06-09-2010, 01:50 PM   #82
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Hannity really dredges up the worst for that show
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Old 06-09-2010, 01:51 PM   #83
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Hannity IS one of the worst.
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Old 06-09-2010, 01:52 PM   #84
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Yeah, that too
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Old 06-09-2010, 01:56 PM   #85
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Ollie North is still around? Jesus.
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Old 06-09-2010, 01:59 PM   #86
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“It’s all about national security."
'Cause firing people who could help us out significantly in the war on terror for something as inconsequential as who they love will help us be more secure .

STFU, Ollie North. And to Hannity for still essentially seeming to agree with him, or even having him on and taking him remotely seriously.

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Old 06-09-2010, 02:02 PM   #87
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A couple of the comments on that story that I liked. Yes that is just it, it's like some of these guys are fantasizing

"I am also a vet….I had no problem serving with gays, which I did….I am sick of bigotry and hate…I am sick of people like Ollie North who presume to speak for the military of today. If somebody wants to serve his/her country let them…they should be judged by their performance when carrying out their assignments….not by some stereotypical fantasy swirling around in some old codger’s empty head. "

"It was never spoken of openly while I was in the military, and it never will be unless the policy is lifted. But that doesn’t mean that people don’t know who is and isn’t gay. I can say honestly that in my unit the majority of the people felt that way. That being said, in my battalion alone there were several instances where a gay man and woman would marry, get their married pay, and share a home off base with their respective partners. I know of 3 instances where that happened, and the unit level chain of command knew about it. Nobody cared because they were good soldiers."
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Old 06-09-2010, 02:15 PM   #88
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We should send those comments on to idiots like North. I'd love to see him still try and defend his homophobia after hearing from actual soldiers who genuinely don't have a problem with gays serving. I'd love to see how he would answer that.

That's really nice to hear those comments. Yay for those people .

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Old 06-09-2010, 02:32 PM   #89
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There will be a special place for those two...
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Old 06-09-2010, 03:33 PM   #90
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I was in the Army for a few years, and there were some homosexuals in the units I was in. One was my boss for a brief time and later became the battalion commander -- and was one of the better examples of military leadership I came across. A few were my soldiers. Honestly, from what I recall, all of them were competent and committed, if not superior to their peers. Generally, everyone knew what their orientation was, but I feel confident in saying that nobody really cared. If there was any discrimination, I never saw it at all.
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:05 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by I Move in Mysterious Ways View Post
I was in the Army for a few years, and there were some homosexuals in the units I was in. One was my boss for a brief time and later became the battalion commander -- and was one of the better examples of military leadership I came across. A few were my soldiers. Honestly, from what I recall, all of them were competent and committed, if not superior to their peers. Generally, everyone knew what their orientation was, but I feel confident in saying that nobody really cared. If there was any discrimination, I never saw it at all.
So he was an LC? Sometimes I feel like there's a huge difference between the enlisted and officers. My dad, and some of my friends were enlisted, and they became the butt of racists, sexist, etc. jokes. Whereas, in my brief experience with officers, I noticed there wasn't much of that going on.
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Old 07-08-2010, 11:03 AM   #92
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Washington (CNN) -- The Pentagon on Wednesday began sending out to troops a survey of more than 100 questions seeking their views on the impact of repealing the "don't ask, don't tell" restrictions prohibiting gays and lesbians from openly serving in the U.S. military.

An administration official confirmed to CNN that the survey is being sent to 200,000 active duty troops and 200,000 reserve troops. The official declined to be identified because the survey has not officially been made public.

The survey, which service members can expect to receive via e-mail, asks about such issues as how unit morale or readiness might be affected if a commander is believed to be gay or lesbian; the need to maintain personal standards of conduct; and how repeal might affect willingness to serve in the military.

The survey also asks a number of questions aimed at identifying problems that could occur when troops live and work in close quarters in overseas war zones. For example, the questionnaire asks military members how they would react if they had to share a room, bathrooms, and open-bay showers in a war zone with other service members believed to be gay or lesbian.

There also are several questions about reactions to dealing with same-sex partners in social situations.


The Pentagon established a team to conduct the survey earlier this year. President Barack Obama, Defense Secretary Robert Gates, and Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Adm. Mike Mullen have all publicly backed a repeal of the current policy. Defense Department officials insist the survey is aimed at determining the impact of a repeal -- not whether repeal should happen.

Several members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff have said they want to see the results of the survey before they offer their final advice on the impact of a repeal to Obama and Gates.

In May, the House of Representatives approved a plan that would repeal the "don't ask, don't tell" policy after the military's internal review is completed and Obama, Gates, and Mullen to sign off on the policy change. The Senate, however, did not pass the measure.

According to a senior U.S. military official with direct knowledge of the review process, the military needs until the end of 2010 to figure out how to implement a repeal of "don't ask, don't tell" in terms of housing, medical and marriage benefits, as well as issues involving the reinstatement of gay soldiers previously discharged under the policy.

A major problem might be determining how to reconcile the repeal of "don't ask, don't tell" with federal law that defines marriage as between a man a woman, the official said.

In addition to distributing the survey, the Pentagon has also been soliciting opinions in a number of private meetings with troops.

The results of the review will not be available until December, the official said.
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Old 07-11-2010, 04:12 AM   #93
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I don't understand, isn't "don't ask, don't tell" a GOOD thing?
It means that a soldier's private life should remain PRIVATE and sexual orientation is nobody's business, right?
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Old 07-11-2010, 04:33 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by AchtungBono View Post
I don't understand, isn't "don't ask, don't tell" a GOOD thing?
It means that a soldier's private life should remain PRIVATE and sexual orientation is nobody's business, right?
it's not so much keeping it a secret because it's no one's business, it's keeping one's sexuality a secret, otherwise they can't serve in the armed forces. if someone in the armed forces is gay, they can be discharged. the don't ask, don't tell policy was added as a sort of compromise to that.
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Old 07-11-2010, 11:23 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by AchtungBono View Post
I don't understand, isn't "don't ask, don't tell" a GOOD thing?
It means that a soldier's private life should remain PRIVATE and sexual orientation is nobody's business, right?


if a gay servicemember were to, say, put a picture of their partner on their desk, or if they were to mention that they went to the movies with a significant other, they could be discharged.

are you married? have a boyfriend? try spending a day not talking about them at all, and worrying about whether or not you said something that might tip someone off that you have a husband/boyfriend, and that's what it's like for gay soldiers living under DADT.
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Old 07-11-2010, 01:33 PM   #96
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I understand now - thank you both for clarifying that.
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Old 07-11-2010, 02:55 PM   #97
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I understand now - thank you both for clarifying that.


no problem.

and i understand that Israel allows openly gay members to serve without issue. that's very admirable.
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Old 07-23-2010, 10:35 AM   #98
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Washington Post

One of the most vocal critics of the military's “don't ask, don't tell” policy has been honorably discharged for being in violation of the policy.

Dan Choi, a West Point graduate and first lieutenant with the Army National Guard, said he learned of the decision on Thursday.

“It's painful mostly, not that my career is coming to an end, but really that it's been a very difficult year,” he said in an interview.

Though his discharge has been rumored for weeks in the gay blogosphere and among gay rights activists, Choi said he only officially learned of the discharge on Thursday after a phone call from his commander.

"The Army said I was notified by letter to my home of record, which is Orange County, Calif.," Choi said. "My dad apparently signed for the letter and, well, that’s what they say."

Choi hasn't spoken to his father since October, he said.

He emerged as the face of gay and lesbian service members discharged under the policy when he came out publicly during a March 2009 MSNBC interview -- essentially violating "don't ask, don't tell" in front of a primetime television audience.

The military started discharge proceedings shortly after the interview. The move angered gay rights groups and other opponents of the policy, who cited Choi's training as an Arab linguist as reason enough to keep him in the military.

Choi has been arrested several times for disorderly conduct at rallies in opposition to "don't ask" and other anti-gay policies. On Tuesday officers arrested him in Las Vegas at a rally in support of the Employment Non Discrimination Act. In March he was arrested in Washington for handcuffing himself to a White House fence. Prosecutors dropped charges against him without explanation last week shortly after he said he would subpoena President Obama if his case went to trial.

Choi said he spends his time "couch surfing" between the homes of friends in New York and Washington. He will reenlist if the Pentagon repeals the policy.

"The statute hasn’t been lifted yet," he said. "And I’m still going to be an activist. I’m still going to be fighting loudly for equal rights. I don’t find the two incompatible, I’ll do both. I believe being an activist makes me a better soldier, and being a soldier makes me a better activist."

The House included a repeal of “don't ask” in its version of the annual defense spending bill and the Senate is expected to do the same later this year. On Friday a federal judge in California is scheduled to hear closing arguments in a case brought by the conservative, pro-gay Log Cabin Republicans that challenges the constitutionality of the policy.
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Old 07-23-2010, 10:44 AM   #99
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How the hell did he end up being in the Guard if he graduated from West Point? I thought they had a four year active duty comittment.
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Old 07-23-2010, 10:52 AM   #100
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He served in Iraq in 06 and 07 and transferred from active duty to the National Guard in 08. I don't know about the 4 year thing.

Don't think that's relevant to DADT
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