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#541 | ||||
Blue Crack Supplier
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 33,246
Local Time: 01:45 AM
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the Daily Mail: Quote:
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so the distortion is entirely on the part of the DM. plus the application of Drudge rules for headline (in the requisite colossal font, and written directly to imply some sort of dissent within what is a clear, established consensus when there is none): Quote:
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#542 |
ONE
love, blood, life Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: New York / Dallas / Austin
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Local Time: 11:45 PM
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From what I understand, the latest models indicate that the coming decade or so will be one of natural cooling, countered relatively evenly by climate change. The two effects will result in largely flat temperatures globally, as has been the case over the past few years. What is scary is what will happen after that.
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#543 |
ONE
love, blood, life Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: New York / Dallas / Austin
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Local Time: 11:45 PM
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Here's a much more sane article: Arctic sea ice rebounds, but don't jump to 'global cooling' conclusions - CSMonitor.com
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#544 |
Resident Photo Buff
Forum Moderator Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Somewhere in middle America
Posts: 13,647
Local Time: 12:45 AM
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Following up on Irvine's counterpoint:
With Climate Journalism Like This, Who Needs Fiction? - ImaGeo | DiscoverMagazine.com |
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#545 | |
Refugee
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: ROCKville
Posts: 1,246
Local Time: 05:45 AM
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I am sure we do damage to our environment but recent images of the sun indicate that the sun is actually cooling down, one recent image was very alarming as about 1/3 of the sun was shown to have a large cooling spot. Global warming is mostly due to the activity of the sun, so Earth would not be the only planet warming, but I see it as solar cycles, and am sure the Earth will begin cooling and much of the polar regions will see a return of ice. Said as an observer, not a scientist or politician. I choose to believe the Earth and our solar system are under control and that as humans we have only a small effect on the Earth. ![]() |
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#546 |
Blue Crack Supplier
Join Date: Dec 2003
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there may well be many things beyond our control when it comes to the climate of the earth.
however, the amount of greenhouse gas and pollutants we pump into the atmosphere isn't beyond our control. regardless of the impossibility of knowing the exact, precise effect of CO2 gas -- which seems to be what the denialists demand -- we do know that not only is this stuff not good for the earth, it isn't good for us either. therefore, we should do what we can to reduce our impact on the planet. it's surely impossible to entirely stop pollution, but there are many things we can do to reduce our impact. it's utterly beyond me why anyone would be opposed, unless you're a fossil fuel company. the idea that green science is some sort of socialist wealth redistributionist plan is a few steps into Loose Change tin foil asshattery. |
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#547 |
Refugee
Join Date: Feb 2005
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Agreed, not against the reduction of the toxins we create, definitely bad for us and the environment, just suggesting that the temperatures we have seen, that seem to be record highs or lows can be attributed to solar activity as well.
Earth goes through cycles, and I think some of what we have seen over the past 10-12 years are because the sun was in a high activity cycle as well, now it could be in a cooling phase for the next 10-12 years, instead of flooding and hurricanes from excess water, we are likely to see more blizzards and colder temperatures during winter months. But, yes, we still need to find options for cleaner energy. Interesting reading : http://rt.com/news/solar-activity-cycle-maximum-114/ |
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#548 |
Blue Crack Addict
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Southern California
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Local Time: 09:45 PM
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To the extent policy is created based on scientific predictions, we are going to end up with a lot of bad policy.
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#549 | |
ONE
love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005
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#550 |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
ALL ACCESS Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: In right wing paranoia
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#551 | |
ONE
love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005
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#552 | |||
Rock n' Roll Doggie
ALL ACCESS Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: In right wing paranoia
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Diemen's repeated assertions that it doesn't matter if predictions don't match reality should be a warning bell. When results don't match a thesis it's time to revise the thesis or you are not a scientist. I don't know what a person would be at this point. Maybe an indirect U.N. employee or just toeing the line for a political spectrum a person likes. People don't have to be in a cabal or secret society to follow self-interest, despite what BVS keeps thinking will settle the issue. The U.N.'s prescription (supposedly based on scientists) is to tax 70 trillion over 40 years to develop green energy. The U.S. (including most western countries) has enough debt to deal with so taxpayers should flip the U.N. the bird and clean their own financial messes. This debate keeps popping up precisely because the reality isn't matching the computer models and when that happens it's healthy for some skepticism to arise. Just because people project authority doesn't mean they are right. It's actually possible for scientists to be as morally corrupt by short-term self-interest as any religious leader that disappoints. Science has had past disappointments before so it's nothing new. What will settle the issue and the only thing that will is good predictions that match reality again and again. True science has always been this way and always will be. The projections have been wrong all the time going back to Hansen's 1988 projection that New York would be under water by the year 2000. We are even beating the 2 degree increase in world temperatures limit agreement and we haven't even lowered CO2 and it's approaching 400ppm. I believe CO2 warms, but the planet doesn't appear to be as sensitive to the increased CO2. When we had 20 times the CO2 it didn't destroy the planet. We should look for new sources of energy because fossil fuels aren't unlimited but we have much more time to do this than all these scare scenarios of "there's only 10 years left before it's too late". They are trying to use fear and emotion to get taxpayers to part with their money that they wouldn't otherwise do in a lucid state of mind. If doubling the CO2 in the atmosphere only adds a degreee of warming most people wouldn't give a shit and there would actually be some benefits to food production by the CO2 and increased temperatures in remote areas. The Climate Science Capitulation Begins…Hans von Storch: “We Definitely Have Seen Less Warming Than Expected” Quote:
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#553 | |
Resident Photo Buff
Forum Moderator Join Date: Sep 2000
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Quote:
2)Apparently you missed the follow up, which showed me to be a bit hasty to take the Daily Mail article at it's word: With Climate Journalism Like This, Who Needs Fiction? - ImaGeo | DiscoverMagazine.com |
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#554 | ||
Rock n' Roll Doggie
ALL ACCESS Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: In right wing paranoia
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I would love to see AGW lobbies stop lying and return to actual science and realistic predictions. Unfortunately that would mean no fear and alarmism which would derail cap and trade schemes for revenue generation which is what it's all about. It's not just one year up or down. It should have been far more warm now than it is. Next year and the year after would have to be exceedingly warmer to catch up to those predictions. I'm not even talking about the higher temperature predictions that would have us at 6 degree increase in 100 years which would require much higher temperatures now. Then there's the predictable lamentation of people that the "cool period will offset the temperatures but wait until the warm period returns then it will be really bad!" We need to know if excessive warm temperatures are our fault as well. Nature can dole out high temperatures on her own regardless of what we do. That's why understanding cosmic rays and the sun's effect plus the sun's effect on oceans is also important instead of blaming CO2 for most of it. |
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#555 |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: California
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In about 15-20 years, solar power will be so cheap and ubiquitous we won't need to worry about 99% of this...the biggest issue will become cleanup (prevention will be in place).
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#556 |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: California
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Could Kurzweil be right about solar, the Google of energy?
"We also see an exponential progression in the use of solar energy," he has predicted. "It is doubling now every two years. Doubling every two years means multiplying by 1,000 in 20 years. At that rate we'll meet 100% of our energy needs in 20 years." |
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#557 |
Blue Crack Addict
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Southern California
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If the US conducted a quest for fusion power in the same fashion as the quest to put a man on the moon, we'd have a true long term solution to our energy & environmental concerns.
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#558 |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
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#559 | |
Rock n' Roll Doggie
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#560 | |
ONE
love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005
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