Scientology is a creepy and weird cult, says Murdoch on Twitter - Page 2

LemonMelon · 07-03-2012, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jive Turkey

Honest question for the religious folk: from a purely objective viewpoint, what is the difference between Jesus and a guy like David Koresh?

Your distaste for Branch Davidians doesn't come up nearly as often.

PhilsFan · 07-03-2012, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jive Turkey

Honest question for the religious folk: from a purely objective viewpoint, what is the difference between Jesus and a guy like David Koresh?

I'm not religious, but ... the media.

maycocksean · 07-03-2012, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jive Turkey

Honest question for the religious folk: from a purely objective viewpoint, what is the difference between Jesus and a guy like David Koresh?

Jesus didn't take His followers down with Him when He died.

financeguy · 07-03-2012, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jive Turkey

Honest question for the religious folk: from a purely objective viewpoint, what is the difference between Jesus and a guy like David Koresh?

Janet Reno didn't order Jesus's execution?

martha · 07-03-2012, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jive Turkey

Honest question for the religious folk: from a purely objective viewpoint, what is the difference between Jesus and a guy like David Koresh?

The one that came to mind, right away: Jesus didn't murder anyone.

financeguy · 07-03-2012, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martha

The one that came to mind, right away: Jesus didn't murder anyone.

Neither did Koresh.

Jive Turkey · 07-03-2012, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LemonMelon

Your distaste for Branch Davidians doesn't come up nearly as often.

My spite is non discriminatory

Jive Turkey · 07-03-2012, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maycocksean

Jesus didn't take His followers down with Him when He died.

Maybe that's right or maybe he and his followers were killed by the government intervention. And even if it were the former, a quick creative flourish and he's suddenly a martyr.

My point is not to belittle the story of Jesus. I'm just fascinated by religion and how it comes in to being. Presumably, those who believe in Jesus are as atheistic on the other religions as me (or at least, all but one other that's just a couple millennia past its best before date), so I don't think my question was an unfair one or even a sacrilegious one for that matter.
All the bullet-points are there. His story somewhat (and I would presume, intentionally) mirrors that of Jesus. Undoubtedly there will be another 'legit' religion to come along and scoop up a ton of followers; I'm fascinated by the idea of someone picking up on a story like his a few decades or a century from now and that becoming the basis for a new worldwide religion. It's not that far fetched.

Jive Turkey · 07-03-2012, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martha

The one that came to mind, right away: Jesus didn't murder anyone.

I don't believe he did either. The whole thing is kinda sketchy

Jive Turkey · 07-03-2012, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhilsFan

I'm not religious, but ... the media.

Curious what you mean by this

Jive Turkey · 07-03-2012, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by financeguy

Janet Reno didn't order Jesus's execution?

Yes, I suppose that isn't nearly as dignified

PhilsFan · 07-03-2012, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jive Turkey

Curious what you mean by this

Consider how the stories of each were told. Jesus' story was spread by word of mouth, and later by the written word. People were left to decide for themselves what they believed based on how much they trusted a certain orator or writer.

Koresh was on television. You could see his compound on CNN, you could hear his voice over the airwaves. Reporters stood outside Branch Davidian and described the scene as it was unfolding right before our eyes.

If there was television in Jesus' time, no one would have believed it. I can't imagine the homes he inhabitated or the temples he preached in were any less humble than those of Koresh.

Jive Turkey · 07-03-2012, 07:00 PM

I suppose there's substance to that, but are you then saying the media has taken away the ability to spread a new religion in any meaningful capacity or will it still spread despite it? And I mean, Koresh had a small core of followers in the same way Jesus did, despite what the media was saying about him at the time; It wouldn't be unthinkable that there would be others out there willing to believe his message too. Especially when you take into account the possible cover up about the whole incident that ended everything. That in itself could generate sympathy and an openness to his 'teachings'. It's not like Jesus was Mr Popular either and it only took a little over 3 centuries for the government who executed him to buy into his religion

PhilsFan · 07-03-2012, 07:47 PM

I'm saying that stories about his importance and greatness will be much more limited because everyone has access to the media coverage of him. It's preserved, unable to altered by hand-me -down storytelling.

Jive Turkey · 07-03-2012, 07:50 PM

They're still second hand accounts though. There's enough distrust in the media to, at least for some people, render those accounts irrelevant. I get what you're saying though and it adds an interesting wrinkle to the whole process

Moonlit_Angel · 07-03-2012, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jive Turkey

Honest question for the religious folk: from a purely objective viewpoint, what is the difference between Jesus and a guy like David Koresh?

Jesus had a good message and attitude towards mankind.

Jive Turkey · 07-03-2012, 09:39 PM

What was Koresh's message?

Moonlit_Angel · 07-03-2012, 09:47 PM

Koresh, from what I've understood about him, seemed to talk more about prophecy and was more obsessed with gaining power than actively helping people with whatever messages he claimed to be getting.

His message seemed to focus on helping himself. Jesus was more interested in helping others.

Danny Boy · 07-03-2012, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jive Turkey

What was Koresh's message?

"I need all my riches to pay for my bitches."

cobl04 · 07-03-2012, 10:08 PM

Funny, that's mine as well.

07-03-2012, 10:08 PM	#40
cobl04 45:33 Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: East Point to Shaolin Posts: 59,008 Local Time: 08:00 AM	Funny, that's mine as well. __________________

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07-03-2012, 07:00 PM	#33
Jive Turkey ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,646 Local Time: 06:00 PM	I suppose there's substance to that, but are you then saying the media has taken away the ability to spread a new religion in any meaningful capacity or will it still spread despite it? And I mean, Koresh had a small core of followers in the same way Jesus did, despite what the media was saying about him at the time; It wouldn't be unthinkable that there would be others out there willing to believe his message too. Especially when you take into account the possible cover up about the whole incident that ended everything. That in itself could generate sympathy and an openness to his 'teachings'. It's not like Jesus was Mr Popular either and it only took a little over 3 centuries for the government who executed him to buy into his religion

07-03-2012, 07:47 PM	#34
PhilsFan Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: South Philadelphia Posts: 19,218 Local Time: 06:00 PM	I'm saying that stories about his importance and greatness will be much more limited because everyone has access to the media coverage of him. It's preserved, unable to altered by hand-me -down storytelling.

07-03-2012, 07:50 PM	#35
Jive Turkey ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,646 Local Time: 06:00 PM	They're still second hand accounts though. There's enough distrust in the media to, at least for some people, render those accounts irrelevant. I get what you're saying though and it adds an interesting wrinkle to the whole process

07-03-2012, 09:39 PM	#37
Jive Turkey ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,646 Local Time: 06:00 PM	What was Koresh's message?

07-03-2012, 09:47 PM	#38
Moonlit_Angel Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: In a dimension known as the Twilight Zone...do de doo doo, do de doo doo... Posts: 20,774 Local Time: 05:00 PM	Koresh, from what I've understood about him, seemed to talk more about prophecy and was more obsessed with gaining power than actively helping people with whatever messages he claimed to be getting. His message seemed to focus on helping himself. Jesus was more interested in helping others.