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Old 06-13-2013, 06:10 PM   #201
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Practically speaking, people aren't judged by whether or not they're good, they're judged by the belief system they accept and endorse.
this doesn't seem backward to you?
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Old 06-13-2013, 06:16 PM   #202
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Practically speaking, people aren't judged by whether or not they're good, they're judged by the belief system they accept and endorse.
According to whom?

It's not what the majority of the world's Christians (i.e. Catholics) believe.
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Old 06-13-2013, 06:18 PM   #203
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this doesn't seem backward to you?
That is one of the largest reasons why I am an agnostic. I just really could not buy into that viewpoint at all. There are religions that don't hold that to be the case (anytime karma comes into play, really), but I've never really gone far enough down that path to know if it's for me or not.
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Old 06-13-2013, 06:34 PM   #204
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hahahahaha

When you actually start hanging around conversations long enough to make a point, I'll start respecting the things you say
And I would respect your conversations about religion if you weren't always getting the most basic aspects completely wrong.
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Old 06-13-2013, 06:37 PM   #205
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this doesn't seem backward to you?
I put it rather simplistically; there are traditional Christian ideals (fruits of the Spirit) that a Christian should develop in time, but reaching some arbitrarily chosen human ideal isn't an end unto itself.

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According to whom?
The Epistles

Sometimes I forget that Catholics and Protestants actually read a similar book.
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Old 06-13-2013, 06:48 PM   #206
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And I would respect your conversations about religion if you weren't always getting the most basic aspects completely wrong.
I couldn't care less, bud. You're a joke
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Old 06-13-2013, 06:51 PM   #207
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I couldn't care less, bud.
Then why are we talking about this
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Old 06-13-2013, 06:51 PM   #208
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I put it rather simplistically; there are traditional Christian ideals (fruits of the Spirit) that a Christian should develop, but reaching some arbitrarily chosen human ideal isn't an end unto itself.
Contributing to the happiness and well being of others should be the only end. All the rest seems tacked on in order to make you believe you need something that you really don't.
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Old 06-13-2013, 06:52 PM   #209
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Then why are we talking about this
I couldn't care less about BVS' "respect". Instead of actually keeping up with an argument, he goes into hiding, then throws around little comments when nothing of substance is being discussed. Worst poster on the site.... second worst
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Old 06-13-2013, 07:04 PM   #210
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I couldn't care less, bud.
I realize that. It doesn't matter to me either way if you want my respect or not, I'm just trying to point out to you that your arrogance is really unwarranted in these types of discussions. You just lack the knowledge. What iron horse is to a science thread you are to a thread on religion.

What you call hiding, I call having little to no time.
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Old 06-13-2013, 07:04 PM   #211
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Contributing to the happiness and well being of others should be the only end. All the rest seems tacked on in order to make you believe you need something that you really don't.
Well, that's what I try to do. I've yet to find a reason why Christianity necessarily precludes contributing happiness to others, but that's probably because I have no interest in what other Christians do.

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I couldn't care less about BVS' "respect". Instead of actually keeping up with an argument, he goes into hiding, then throws around little comments when nothing of substance is being discussed. Worst poster on the site.... second worst
Sorz, misread. If we're going to have a religious debate, it's necessary to care about the particulars. Note the result of trying to project Protestant beliefs about grace onto Catholics.

I think I know who the first worst poster is.

Schloop-a-Doop must really hate atheists, they're so negative all the time.
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Old 06-13-2013, 07:11 PM   #212
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Well, that's what I try to do. I've yet to find a reason why Christianity necessarily precludes contributing happiness to others, but that's probably because I have no interest in what other Christians do.

I think we could find lots of instances where being Christian has precluded other believers from contributing to the happiness of others. But like I said earlier, if more people practiced the way you appear to be, it would be a nicer world.

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Sorz, misread. If we're going to have a religious debate, it's necessary to care about the particulars. Note the result of trying to project Protestant beliefs about grace onto Catholics.

Schloop-a-Doop must really hate atheists, they're so negative all the time.
Particulars are important, yes. Arguing over semantics is kinda boring though. Especially when considering the original comment about Mormonism (way back when) was taken completely in the wrong context. My remarks about them taking out ads and handing out books was meant to be in stark contrast with what we'd have if the musical was called Book of Mohammed. There would be guaranteed deaths over it. Instead, we get charming behaviour (some people here would have you believe that all religions are equally violent, however. But then they'd disappear for 4 pages)
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Old 06-13-2013, 07:11 PM   #213
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I think I know who the first worst poster is.
You might be surprised...
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Old 06-13-2013, 07:15 PM   #214
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Yeah, this has gone way off topic, into the land of religious semantics that I absolutely cannot stand. I actually used to frequent a Christian forum until I realized that the shit they argued about on there was so insignificant they might as well have blown the bandwith on GIFs of paint drying.

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You might be surprised...
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Old 06-13-2013, 07:33 PM   #215
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I find semantics to be tedious as well.

I pointed out the difference between Protestant and Catholic thought/belief in this instance because I think it is central to the debate.

When you consider major world religions on the whole, the majority of believers actually do not believe that they are saved by belief alone. I think even a person like Jive who is not at all religious would probably recognize that there is a significant difference between believing in grace and karma...not that I'm implying that one has resulted in a better world here on earth than the other. Sadly.
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Old 06-13-2013, 07:37 PM   #216
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I realize that. It doesn't matter to me either way if you want my respect or not, I'm just trying to point out to you that your arrogance is really unwarranted in these types of discussions. You just lack the knowledge. What iron horse is to a science thread you are to a thread on religion.

What you call hiding, I call having little to no time.
I've got plenty of knowledge. You just don't have the wit or intellect to keep up. You're a slogan machine.

And if it's not hiding maybe stay the fuck out instead of popping your little head back in after the topic changes. Funny that you have no time when you're asked direct questions, but all the time in the world to shit on easy targets like Indy. And lets be honest, you post in FYM probably more than anyone else. You've got plenty of time
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Old 06-13-2013, 07:42 PM   #217
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When you consider major world religions on the whole, the majority of believers actually do not believe that they are saved by belief alone. I think even a person like Jive who is not at all religious would probably recognize that there is a significant difference between believing in grace and karma...not that I'm implying that one has resulted in a better world here on earth than the other. Sadly.
I honestly believe most people are inherently good people, religious or not
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Old 06-13-2013, 07:59 PM   #218
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I've got plenty of knowledge.
That wasn't any kind of slogan, you had a major tenant of Christianity flat out wrong, it had nothing to do with semantics. There is a big distinction made in Christianity between sin and good.

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And if it's not hiding maybe stay the fuck out instead of popping your little head back in after the topic changes. Funny that you have no time when you're asked direct questions, but all the time in the world to shit on easy targets like Indy. And lets be honest, you post in FYM probably more than anyone else. You've got plenty of time
My apologies if you asked me anything in this thread that I didn't answer. I've been posting a lot less in Interference lately.
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Old 06-13-2013, 08:11 PM   #219
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That wasn't any kind of slogan, you had a major tenant of Christianity flat out wrong, it had nothing to do with semantics. There is a big distinction made in Christianity between sin and good.
it absolutely was (and still is ) semantics. There's a direct connection between sin and the quality of the person (call it 'goodness', call it what you want). I didn't get anything wrong. And this is boring as fuck, but if you'd like to hang your hat on it, I'll throw you a bone. You rarely get one of those and this is pretty goddamn minor in the grand scheme of things.

Boring ass, worthless point conceded to BVS, you guys.

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My apologies if you asked me anything in this thread that I didn't answer. I've been posting a lot less in Interference lately.
You know exactly what I'm talking about. Dont 'play' stupid
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Old 06-13-2013, 08:31 PM   #220
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I honestly believe most people are inherently good people, religious or not
Interesting.

I think most people try or strive to be good most of the time. And that is something that is innate and unrelated to religious practice or dogma.
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