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Old 05-02-2011, 04:24 AM   #201
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what about the twitter guy?
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Old 05-02-2011, 04:27 AM   #202
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is the "buried at sea" thing accurate??

no mention as yet on The Guardian at least...

Osama bin Laden death: What to do with body poses dilemma for US | World news | guardian.co.uk

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Osama bin Laden death: What to do with body poses dilemma for US
Officials will be wary of creating shrine or feeding conspiracy theories, while honouring Islamic burial traditions

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Paul Harris in New York
guardian.co.uk, Monday 2 May 2011 07.58 BST
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Osama bin Laden in an undated file photograph. Now that he is dead the Americans will have to prove they got their man while disposing of his remains without creating a shrine or feeding conspiracy theories that he is still alive. Photograph: AFP/Getty Images
Osama bin Laden is dead but the al-Qaida leader is still posing difficult questions for US intelligence and security officials: notably, what to do with his body?

The US authorities are doing DNA tests to ensure they have got the right man; and they have taken possession of his body to make sure no myths of "escape" build up.

An official said the DNA results would be known within a few days. In the meantime US authorities must deal with the thorny problem of what to do with his remains.

Senior US officials told news agencies that his body would be buried in accordance with Islamic tradition. But it is not clear yet what they mean. Islamic custom often involves the bathing, shrouding and burial of a body within 24 hours.

And where to send Bin Laden's remains? His large extended family in Saudi Arabia have largely distanced themselves from him. The Saudi government would be wary of having any grave on Saudi territory that could become a shrine for followers of radical Islam – there are many such people inside the kingdom.

Pakistani authorities would have similar concerns, sharpened by the embarrassment of having Bin Laden caught deep within their country and living in relative comfort an hour's drive from Islamabad.

There is some precedent in the case of Jordanian-born terrorist Abu Musab al-Zarqawi. He was killed during a bombing in Iraq. Authorities in Jordan refused his family's wishes to have his remains repatriated to his homeland. His body was transferred to the Iraqi authorities who buried him according to Islamic customs but at a secret location, according to a US military press release issued at the time.

A similar unknown and murky fate may await Bin Laden's remains, but it may also feed conspiracy theories that he was never killed.

Uday and Qusay Hussein, the sons of the Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein, were buried in a community graveyard after their deaths in a firefight with US troops and then later reinterred in a family plot. Something similar might be an option for Bin Laden.

US authorities did not immediately rush to bury the Hussein brothers, instead releasing the corpses 11 days after they were killed and relying on photographs of their bodies to convince people they were dead.
eta:
ok just found this...
Quote:
3.24am ET: MSNBC says US officials have confirmed that Osama bin Laden's body has been buried at sea.

It was done "in accordance with Islamic law and traditions," and took place at 2am eastern time (7am BST).
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Old 05-02-2011, 04:30 AM   #203
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Guardian live blog:

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3.24am ET: MSNBC says US officials have confirmed that Osama bin Laden's body has been buried at sea.

It was done "in accordance with Islamic law and traditions," and took place at 2am eastern time (7am BST).
Timeframe, from the AP:
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On April 29, Obama approved an operation to kill bin Laden. It was a mission that required surgical accuracy, even more precision than could be delivered by the government's sophisticated Predator drones. To execute it, Obama tapped a small contingent of the Navy's elite SEAL Team Six and put them under the command of CIA Director Leon Panetta, whose analysts monitored the compound from afar.

Panetta was directly in charge of the team, a U.S. official said, and his conference room was transformed into a command center.

Details of exactly how the raid unfolded remain murky. But the al-Qaida courier, his brother and one of bin Laden's sons were killed. No Americans were injured. Senior administration officials will only say that bin Laden "resisted." And then the man behind the worst terrorist attack on U.S. soil died from an American bullet to his head.

It was mid-afternoon in Virginia when Panetta and his team received word that bin Laden was dead. Cheers and applause broke out across the conference room.
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Old 05-02-2011, 04:31 AM   #204
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heh yeah i just found the same update and edited, thanks though!
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Old 05-02-2011, 04:31 AM   #205
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okay I am absolutely sick to death (ha) of the facebook groups already. most aren't remotely funny. so don't ask my to join your page because you're two millionth person to draw a connection to Waldo/Wally

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Honestly, I'm going to give newscasters a pass for any Obama/Osama mixups because I've done that at least 4 times while typing tonight. It's the same thing when I try and transition between U2 and the UW.
so have I, but that headline is fucking amateur. huge difference between a typo on an internet forum and a major news channel
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Old 05-02-2011, 04:36 AM   #206
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so have I, but that headline is fucking amateur. huge difference between a typo on an internet forum and a major news channel
There should probably be on a sticky note on every chyron writer's desk:

IMPORTANT- DID YOU USE AN "S" OR A "B"
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Old 05-02-2011, 04:39 AM   #207
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Some more details on Politico about how they got a trail on Bin Laden.
Osama bin Laden's death brings celebration, unity – and questions - Ben Smith and Glenn Thrush - POLITICO.com
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Senior administration officials say the trail heated up about a year ago when they discovered the identity of a key Bin Laden courier – and linked the man to the construction of a fortified compound 35 miles north of Islamabad bristling with barbed-wire, 12-foot walls and packed with a mysterious family that burned its own trash.

After months of surveillance and analysis – and no fewer than nine Oval Office meetings on the topic – Obama authorized a daring helicopter assault on the mansion, culminating at around 7 p.m. Sunday night when the president was told that the “high value target” killed while resisting US troops at the compound was, in fact, the man responsible for 3,000 deaths a decade ago.

The final decision to authorize the assault came at an 8:20 a.m. meeting Friday in the White House diplomatic reception room with chief of staff Bill Daley and national security adviser Tom Donilon. By 3 p.m., the formal orders were produced and Obama spent most of Sunday – apart from a nine-hole round of golf – monitoring the operation in the Situation Room.

By 3:50 p.m. Sunday came word that Bin Laden was in the compound, followed by firm confirmation the remains in U.S. custody were his, officials said.
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U.S. intelligence had been trying to track those couriers for years and grew suspicious about the specific compound last August, after noting that it was eight times larger than other homes in the area and had unusual security features like 12-to-18 foot walls topped with barbed wire, one official said. “It is also noteworthy that the compound is valued at $1 million and has no telephone or Internet service connected to it,” the official added.
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Old 05-02-2011, 04:51 AM   #208
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Originally Posted by mobvok View Post
Guardian live blog:



Timeframe, from the AP:
April 29th???

*light bulb goes off*

I thought it was odd that William and Kate suddenly postponed their honeymoon overseas.
They were supposed to leave on Saturday but I'm guessing that British intelligence knew about this action and decided that they would be in grave danger if they left Britain, so they decided to postpone it "for personal reasons".

I get it now.....
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Old 05-02-2011, 05:27 AM   #209
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Some may say this vindicates GITMO

apparently they found OBL couriers from intelligence gathered from detainees at GITMO,
once they started tracking a courier, they found the compound,
they say the compound had no internet, phones or cell phones. Also all trash was burned on site.
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Old 05-02-2011, 05:37 AM   #210
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Wow.
Never thought OBL would be captured or killed - would have preferred the former, to prevent martyrdom.

I suppose this means 2012 election is now effectively won for Obama.

And now we have to worry about the retaliation attacks...the problem with people like this there's probably 10 guys waiting in line to carry on.
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Old 05-02-2011, 05:44 AM   #211
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deep View Post
Some may say this vindicates GITMO

apparently they found OBL couriers from intelligence gathered from detainees at GITMO,
once they started tracking a courier, they found the compound,
they say the compound had no internet, phones or cell phones. Also all trash was burned on site.
link
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As a matter of fact, terrorism falls pretty far down that list, but state repression is a rather important risk. Think-tanks that track terror fatalities measure the number of dead from terrorism since 1970 in the tens of thousands. Compare this to the hundreds of thousands killed by their own governments over the same period, a number that rises, RJ Rummel tells us, to a staggering 169,198,000 between 1900-1987. International terrorism may be scary, but in relative terms it’s pretty small beer.

It stands to reason that if the goal is to protect civilians the means used to be consistent with the wider protection of civilians. So although liberals are fond of making the absolutist moral argument and the constitutive argument against torture, it turns out that you can also argue against torutre on purely utilitarian grounds. And the argument is not that it’s ineffective. The argument is that even if it’s sometimes effective and even if it’s necessary to protect civilians, civilians stand to benefit far more from preserving a rule of law political culture than they do from avoiding every single risk that comes with living in an era of techno-globalization in which the gap between the haves and have nots is widening.
The same general risk is true for the broad deference given to the executive branch over the last decade for the compromises at GITMO that punch a hole in our constitution.
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Old 05-02-2011, 05:50 AM   #212
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I'm sure they'll release images of the corpse within the few days...or they may want to hold off for the time being knowing it could stir up the hornet's nest.
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Old 05-02-2011, 05:59 AM   #213
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Both 9/11/01 and today have been surreal bookends. I keep glancing at this thread title, and it doesn't settle easily in my head.
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Old 05-02-2011, 06:18 AM   #214
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Great avatar man.

Someone said hitler also died today...?
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Old 05-02-2011, 06:19 AM   #215
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Wow.
Never thought OBL would be captured or killed - would have preferred the former, to prevent martyrdom.

I suppose this means 2012 election is now effectively won for Obama.

And now we have to worry about the retaliation attacks...the problem with people like this there's probably 10 guys waiting in line to carry on.
I wouldn't be too sure about the 2012 election.
I remember in 1991 when the first gulf war ended and everyone was predicting a sound victory for Bush the elder in 1992 but he was still defeated by Bill Clinton.

Granted this is a MAJOR coup for Obama, however, when the euphoria wears off, he will still be left with the problems of the economy, health care and other things he needs to take care of in order to get re-elected.
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Old 05-02-2011, 06:21 AM   #216
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Great avatar man.

Someone said hitler also died today...?
Hi Cob,

Not exactly......

What I said was that today is Holocaust remembrance day in Israel. The day where we remember the 6 million Jews who perished by Hitler's orders during world war II.
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Old 05-02-2011, 06:23 AM   #217
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Great avatar man.

Someone said hitler also died today...?
Thanks!

Achtung, word's been getting around that May 1st was the day that Hitler's death was officially confirmed. I think that's what cobl was getting at.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:03 AM   #218
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It's a pity that ideologies don't have a body to kill.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:05 AM   #219
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It's a pity that ideologies don't have a body to kill.
yep very frustrating.

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Thanks!

Achtung, word's been getting around that May 1st was the day that Hitler's death was officially confirmed. I think that's what cobl was getting at.
yes, that's what i was getting at. i think i saw someone mention something like that on twitter.
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Old 05-02-2011, 08:35 AM   #220
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