Israel - Page 6

the iron horse · 08-23-2014, 07:34 AM

A four year old Israeli girl was killed by Hamas rocket fire.

Also...
Hamas executes 18 suspected collaborators with Israel in Gaza | JPost | Israel News

Kieran McConville · 08-23-2014, 07:59 AM

And?

Vlad n U 2 · 08-23-2014, 08:10 AM

Don't remember hearing anything from the iron horse about the countless children killed by the IDF.

BVS · 08-23-2014, 01:31 PM

Palestinian 4 year old girls don't count...

Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

Galeongirl · 08-23-2014, 02:36 PM

Why is it so much different when a child dies? As if the adults dying aren't bad? Every innocent person dying is one too many if you ask me, and it makes zero difference what age or gender they are to me.

the iron horse · 08-23-2014, 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BVS

Palestinian 4 year old girls don't count...

Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

And who said that BVS?

What's up with this body count?

Do you view all of this as a video game?

AEON · 08-24-2014, 12:17 AM

I was reading an article somewhere that instead of "Palestine" - we (the nations that won WWII) should have given the Jewish people the best lands of Germany - instead some arid land in the Middle East.

I have some issue with this "promised land" and "chosen people" mentality. As a Christian that now completely rejects the Old Testament as canon - I fail to see why so many fundamentalist Christians think they force God into the "end times" by encouraging the fight between Israel and her neighbors.

However, I'm no fan of Hamas or radical Islam either. I just don't see why we give Israel so much more support than we do other moderate Arab countries (or for that matter - small ancient tribes that have been around for thousands of years and are now threatened with extinction).

BVS · 08-24-2014, 04:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the iron horse

And who said that BVS?

What's up with this body count?

Do you view all of this as a video game?

What is your problem?

You point it out on one side, but not the other...

Why?

Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

Popmartijn · 08-24-2014, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AEON

I was reading an article somewhere that instead of "Palestine" - we (the nations that won WWII) should have given the Jewish people the best lands of Germany - instead some arid land in the Middle East.

I wasn't entirely joking earlier on when I mentioned that it would've been better if California had been given to the Jewish people.

AEON · 08-24-2014, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Popmartijn

I wasn't entirely joking earlier on when I mentioned that it would've been better if California had been given to the Jewish people.

Maybe Northern California...I love SoCal.

Popmartijn · 08-24-2014, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AEON

Maybe Northern California...I love SoCal.

Maybe in the initial agreement, but then Israel might've invaded SoCal and claimed it for themselves as well. Tough luck for you.

Vincent Vega · 08-24-2014, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AEON

I was reading an article somewhere that instead of "Palestine" - we (the nations that won WWII) should have given the Jewish people the best lands of Germany - instead some arid land in the Middle East.

That's just naive. Most survivors either wanted to get away from Europe, or they wanted to go back to what once were their home. Not be given something somewhere in the country. Long-term, that also would have created new conflicts.

Popmartijn · 08-24-2014, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincent Vega

Long-term, that also would have created new conflicts.

As opposed to the current situation?

Vincent Vega · 08-25-2014, 03:16 AM

No, like the current situation. The idea that there was some solution and if we had just taken that route we would all be shiny happy people today is naive.
By the European nations, largely, there was no willingness to take in all the Jewish survivors returning. Many survivors, on the other hand, were not eager to return to the neighbours who just a few years earlier bullied them into submission and then took their possessions.
Giving them the "best lands" would neither have been wanted by the survivors nor by the European nations (neither victors nor losers).

The "if only..." is a very moot point to me.

Kieran McConville · 08-25-2014, 07:44 AM

The only even remotely 'happy' solution would have been the British hanging onto their mandate long enough to lock in something vaguely tolerable to both sides. But in 1948 the British were ruined.

AEON · 08-25-2014, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kieran McConville

The only even remotely 'happy' solution would have been the British hanging onto their mandate long enough to lock in something vaguely tolerable to both sides. But in 1948 the British were ruined.

That's an interesting point. Do you have any links to more information on that?

DaveC · 08-25-2014, 01:59 PM

1947–48 Civil War in Mandatory Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Kieran McConville · 08-26-2014, 01:09 AM

Well yeah, that. I was just spouting what I thought was vaguely general knowledge, like saying that Britain gave up India because it was, likewise, economically and morally exhausted.

AEON · 08-26-2014, 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kieran McConville

Well yeah, that. I was just spouting what I thought was vaguely general knowledge, like saying that Britain gave up India because it was, likewise, economically and morally exhausted.

What I was interested in was the notion that you thought peace between Israel and the Palestinians would have actually been possible....

Kieran McConville · 08-26-2014, 02:24 AM

Peace, maybe not. I didn't actually use the word peace. But if they were something like territorial equals in the former Palestine (mandate), that might be a different situation.

08-23-2014, 07:34 AM	#101
the iron horse Rock n' Roll Doggie Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: in a glass of CheerWine Posts: 3,266 Local Time: 07:14 AM	A four year old Israeli girl was killed by Hamas rocket fire. Also... Hamas executes 18 suspected collaborators with Israel in Gaza \| JPost \| Israel News __________________

08-23-2014, 07:59 AM	#102
Kieran McConville ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Hi, Violet Posts: 10,253 Local Time: 09:14 PM	And? __________________

08-26-2014, 02:24 AM	#120
Kieran McConville ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Hi, Violet Posts: 10,253 Local Time: 09:14 PM	Peace, maybe not. I didn't actually use the word peace. But if they were something like territorial equals in the former Palestine (mandate), that might be a different situation. __________________

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08-23-2014, 08:10 AM	#103
Vlad n U 2 Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 28,387 Local Time: 09:44 PM	Don't remember hearing anything from the iron horse about the countless children killed by the IDF.

08-23-2014, 01:31 PM	#104
BVS Blue Crack Supplier Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: between my head and heart Posts: 41,232 Local Time: 06:14 AM	Palestinian 4 year old girls don't count... Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

08-24-2014, 12:17 AM	#107
AEON Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: California Posts: 4,052 Local Time: 04:14 AM	I was reading an article somewhere that instead of "Palestine" - we (the nations that won WWII) should have given the Jewish people the best lands of Germany - instead some arid land in the Middle East. I have some issue with this "promised land" and "chosen people" mentality. As a Christian that now completely rejects the Old Testament as canon - I fail to see why so many fundamentalist Christians think they force God into the "end times" by encouraging the fight between Israel and her neighbors. However, I'm no fan of Hamas or radical Islam either. I just don't see why we give Israel so much more support than we do other moderate Arab countries (or for that matter - small ancient tribes that have been around for thousands of years and are now threatened with extinction).

08-25-2014, 03:16 AM	#114
Vincent Vega Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Berlin Posts: 6,746 Local Time: 01:14 PM	No, like the current situation. The idea that there was some solution and if we had just taken that route we would all be shiny happy people today is naive. By the European nations, largely, there was no willingness to take in all the Jewish survivors returning. Many survivors, on the other hand, were not eager to return to the neighbours who just a few years earlier bullied them into submission and then took their possessions. Giving them the "best lands" would neither have been wanted by the survivors nor by the European nations (neither victors nor losers). The "if only..." is a very moot point to me.

08-25-2014, 07:44 AM	#115
Kieran McConville ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Hi, Violet Posts: 10,253 Local Time: 09:14 PM	The only even remotely 'happy' solution would have been the British hanging onto their mandate long enough to lock in something vaguely tolerable to both sides. But in 1948 the British were ruined.

08-25-2014, 01:59 PM	#117
DaveC Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: slouching towards bethlehem Posts: 22,845 Local Time: 07:14 AM	1947–48 Civil War in Mandatory Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

08-26-2014, 01:09 AM	#118
Kieran McConville ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Hi, Violet Posts: 10,253 Local Time: 09:14 PM	Well yeah, that. I was just spouting what I thought was vaguely general knowledge, like saying that Britain gave up India because it was, likewise, economically and morally exhausted.