Israel

[Irvine511]

Originally Posted by the iron horse

Stolen land?

I don't know of any other people in history who have a more
legitimate claim to a strip of land than the Jews.

native americans?

[anitram]

There is no BIBLE that says it's theirs.

[DaveC]

Originally Posted by Irvine511

native americans?

I pictured you dropping the mic and walking off like a badass after reading this post.

You are very correct, sir.

[Axver]

Originally Posted by the iron horse

Stolen land?

I don't know of any other people in history who have a more
legitimate claim to a strip of land than the Jews.

If you want to talk about legitimate claims to land, let me introduce you to a certain group of people called Aboriginals, who've been living on the Australian continent for 40,000 years.

[Kieran McConville]

And if you want to talk about history, Iron Horse, it's worth bearing in mind that the modern Israel is above all a European project; inspired and founded by European Jews from Europe.

[digitize]

Israel is a European colony.

I claim to be against colonialism, but I also think that liberal, democratic, first world, free-enterprise-employing societies and government are good things, and I don't think that Palestine sans Israel would be that. So I'm torn. Perhaps colonialism is generally a bad way to create such societies. (Although many people of Hong Kong might disagree.)

[anitram]

Originally Posted by digitize

Israel is a European colony.

I claim to be against colonialism, but I also think that liberal, democratic, first world, free-enterprise-employing societies and government are good things, and I don't think that Palestine sans Israel would be that. So I'm torn.

I don't understand this comment at all.

What Palestine? What are you proposing here, indefinite occupation whereby Israel shows "Palestine" the right way to exist?

[Vlad n U 2]

I really doubt that "liberal" and "democratic" are terms you can describe Israel with.

[digitize]

Originally Posted by anitram

I don't understand this comment at all.



What Palestine? What are you proposing here, indefinite occupation whereby Israel shows "Palestine" the right way to exist?

I'm commenting on Israel's right to exist (or not). On one hand, I don't like that there's a European colony in the middle of Palestine. On the other hand, I think that the existence of states like Israel in general ought to be celebrated.


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[anitram]

Originally Posted by digitize

I'm commenting on Israel's right to exist (or not).

I think it's very interesting that Israel is the only nation in the world that has a "right" to exist. That term is simply not bandied about anywhere else.

Why don't Chechnya or Kurdistan have a "right" to exist?

[digitize]

Originally Posted by anitram

I think it's very interesting that Israel is the only nation in the world that has a "right" to exist. That term is simply not bandied about anywhere else.



Why don't Chechnya or Kurdistan have a "right" to exist?

Most other countries don't have organizations at their southern borders with stated desires to destroy them.

(Although I don't really know why the international community doesn't use that language for Chechnya or Kurdistan.)

Regardless, I think that it's fundamentally absurd for any nation to claim a right to exist based on religion or ethnic heritage. I also think that it's absurd for governments to be anything but totally secular. But that argument can be applied against both the Israeli state and a Palestinian state in the absence of Israel.


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[the iron horse]

Originally Posted by prbiker15

I feel the same way. I just wish they would go ahead with a ceasefire, even if this sort of conflict has been going on for decades.

Islamists terrorists are bent on the destruction of Israel and
the Jewish people. It's not about the land.

The Arabs were offered land.

In 1948, the United Nations declared that the British territory known as Palestine would be divided into two independent countries: Israel and Palestine.

Arab leaders rejected the declaration.

[Diemen]

Originally Posted by the iron horse

Arab leaders rejected the declaration.

Perhaps because they had been living there long before the Brits and objected to the idea of occupiers dividing up their land as they saw fit?

[PhilsFan]

Originally Posted by the iron horse

Islamists terrorists are bent on the destruction of Israel and
the Jewish people. It's not about the land.

The Arabs were offered land.

In 1948, the United Nations declared that the British territory known as Palestine would be divided into two independent countries: Israel and Palestine.

Arab leaders rejected the declaration.

Europeans didn't want to have to deal with the Jewish refugees from World War II so they demanded Palestinians cough up half of their land.

[Popmartijn]

It would've been so much easier if they'd given the Jews California. Much bigger, so easier to fit all the people who want to live there. And the US is big enough to absorb those who lived in California before.

[U2DMfan]

Originally Posted by Popmartijn

It would've been so much easier if they'd given the Jews California.

Hollywood by itself wasn't enough?

[RIMSHOT]

[Vlad n U 2]

I think I remember reading that a part of Argentina was another option.

[bigjohn2441]

How about the moon?

[cobl04]

Not often I can't even make it through an article After a reported 17 warnings on shelter location, Israeli artillery hits Gaza school, killing 19

[Galeongirl]

It's pretty much a shitty situation from either side. I can't really judge as I don't know enough on the situation, but I don't think in a situation this big there is only one party at fault.