Iraq: What to do?

[kidrambler]

I really appreciate your informed posts in this subject. Thank you.


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Oh, ok. Shhhh. Mums the word. Zipping it up now. Closing my mind on the free your mind forum. Just for Vega. Not!

Sorry. That was to quote the other guy. My bad. Just getting used to how the mobile app works.

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[BVS]

Oh, ok. Shhhh. Mums the word. Zipping it up now. Closing my mind on the free your mind forum. Just for Vega. Not!

Sorry. That was to quote the other guy. My bad. Just getting used to how the mobile app works.

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No one is asking you to close your mind, just show some logic, facts, or sources to back up your posts.


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[Galeongirl]

A lot of wars were started on made-up stories, that's true. The crisis of the Yezidi is neither made-up, nor were they too stupid to use the resources. If you have cattle and animals on a bunch of rocks, and you have 40,000 people in 45°C (113°F), then all liquid is gone very quickly.

The US is not behind everything. There is a great desire to create conspiracies out of everything. The support the US gave ISIS is by not doing anything in Syria, not the other way round.

Sounds like a humanitarian disaster.

 

[kidrambler]

My assessment of the videos I saw were relatively few people walking up a mountain. I saw no one who appeared to be suffering. There was the Iraqi relief helicopter with crowds of men pressing upon others, all trying to receive food. It was a brief video clip, lasting only seconds, which was just as easy to stage as when a dozen Iraqi men in polished leather loafers and gabardine slacks chanted for Americans rescuing them from Saddam several years ago. Back to the present, I saw carefully selected images designed to tug at our heart strings with reporters telling us of a situation far graver than the images actually depicted. The inconsistencies or contradictions are now resolved when the dots get connected. For America's sake, I'll say no more. But to my fellow Christians, I advise you to use caution before handing over the Word of God to be trampled yet again by the money-hoarding warmongers who wage war to gain and/or maintain a position of wealth. "The love of money is the Root of all evil."


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[U2DMfan]

The inconsistencies or contradictions are now resolved when the dots get connected.

Only you have to ignore a lot of "dots" for your conspiracy theory to make sense. As is the case with pretty much all conspiracy theories.

 

[kidrambler]

Only you have to ignore a lot of "dots" for your conspiracy theory to make sense. As is the case with pretty much all conspiracy theories.

Touché. And right back atchya!

Admittedly, I hadn't had my morning coffee yet at the time our President made his announcement. But somehow it still makes sense out of a whole week of senseless media reports, even after I've had my coffee. My comment about the payroll was said in jest though. I'm not an idiot. I understand how the dots must be blurred for success to happen. And another thing I understand is that we only perform humanitarian acts when it's in our nation's greater interest to do so. The Fat Cats don't spend unless there will be a return on their investment.

Read CONFESSIONS OF AN ECONOMIC HITMAN by John Perkins. There is a process to their grubbing. A process that often leaves Congress and the White House in the dark as they get carried along like a menagerie held captive for the purpose of the real powers that be--the fat cats.

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[The_Pac_Mule]

I fear Blackwater (now known as XE) more.

Oh please.

 

[Jacobite]

The inconsistencies or contradictions are now resolved when the dots get connected.

Complicated problems are not easily solvable.

 

[kidrambler]

Oh please.

Oh please what? The use of privatized armies (cough) I mean contractors by the United States (my country) should alarm all citizens. And if they would use them against Americans in the time of Bush's Katrina to protect the possessions of the wealthier parishes, nothing is beyond the scope. I suspect they have become the new Praetorian Guard.


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[kidrambler]

Oh please what? The use of privatized armies (cough) I mean contractors by the United States (my country) should alarm all citizens. And if they would use them against Americans in the time of Bush's Katrina to protect the possessions of the wealthier parishes, nothing is beyond the scope. I suspect they have become the new Praetorian Guard.


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I wasn't addressing solving a problem. I am discerning what's happening here. Americans were fooled into war with Iraq twice before. It isn't cynical to question the allegiance of our leaders.


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[kidrambler]

Sorry. I'm still using iPhone 4s. Either the small screen or my fat thumbs caused me to miss the comment above my last reply and tap my previous comment. I think my new comment makes clear to whom and what I was replying. iPhone 6 supposedly comes out next month. I'm sure I'll get one by Christmas.


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[kidrambler]

I find it interesting that the Translation for whatever Arabic name ISIS or ISIL calls itself, fits neatly into its English acronym. Coincidence? Messaging is key.


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[Galeongirl]

... why are you trying so hard to find food for your conspiracy theories? It's just an abbreviation of a name, that happens to have an English acronym. How the hell is that anything more than a complete utter coincidence?

 

[Vincent Vega]

al-Dawlah al-ʾIslāmiyyah fi al-Iraq wa al-Sham

ISIS/ISIL are commonly translated as follows:
Islamic State in Iraq and Syria
Islamic State in Iraq and al-Sham
Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant

where Syria is rather too narrow, so some say "Greater Syria", to avoid the misperception that ISIS would be content with taking Iraq and Syria.
al-Sham and the Levant are almost the same words. Levant is Italian and historically referred to the Mediterranean lands east of Greece. al-Sham is Arabic and historically was comprising roughly the areas of Syria, Lebanon, Jordan and a bit of Israel.
I guess the Arabs just did a poor job of differentiating their language more from the Indogermanics.

 

[Babydoll]

I find it interesting that the Translation for whatever Arabic name ISIS or ISIL calls itself, fits neatly into its English acronym. Coincidence? Messaging is key.


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Huh?

I don't get this at all.

 

[Galeongirl]

Don't you see the straws?

 

[PhilsFan]

m e s s a g i n g i s e v e r y t h i n g

 

[Popmartijn]

Everything you know is wrong
beLIEve
Watch more TV

 

[Babydoll]

Don't you see the straws?

I do now

 

[the iron horse]

"And Iraqi Ministry of Human Rights spokesman Kamil Amin told CNN that up to 20,000 Yazidi Iraqis, who have been targeted by the militants, had been rescued and taken to safety near the Syrian border. However, thousands remain trapped on a mountain, scrambling for food and water dropped by U.S. airlifts."

U.S. airstrikes bring early gains in Iraq


At least some good news after a week of bad.

 

[kidrambler]

I think it is far more nefarious to not question things. Sure, we're using a humanitarian situation to persuade Americans to get involved for a reason other than humanitarian. Two days in to helping out and now they say we'll be there for weeks and months.... Because of the Kurds not the Yezidis. It was always about the oil and/or gas fields, pipelines and refineries. I don't know but one person in this forum who is Christian and referred me here. We met years ago on the band Creed's forum. The nations will do as they please. My only concern pertains to believers abandoning the Word of God, letting it take a back seat to kingdoms of the earth which are destined for destruction. Matthew 16:24-26; 10:28; Daniel 2:41-45


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[kidrambler]

... why are you trying so hard to find food for your conspiracy theories? It's just an abbreviation of a name, that happens to have an English acronym. How the hell is that anything more than a complete utter coincidence?

I'm not trying to do anything. After two glasses of wine last night it was just an interesting thought I had because the languages are so different. It doesn't have anything to do directly with the real reason the West is going into Iraq. How many times must people be lied to by their national leaders before they wise up? The persons here who are taking issue with the obvious remind me of someone who went by the name Creed of Kings. C.O. K. convinced an entire board of Christians to believe the Bush administration was telling the truth about Iraq's "wmds" and that he helped Al Quaeda. Even though the truth existed beforehand. But they were so bent on believing in a man who professed to be Christian, they supported war based on lies. Many people died or were maimed for that man's lies. Those lives could have been protected if there was an educated populace. But the kings of the earth, and the corporate- (fat cats who profit from war and oil) -controlled media had a job to do and they revealed that they serve the powers that be rather than the publics interest. Afterwards they express remorse and say they needed to do better, until now when they are doing it all over again.


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[BVS]

I think it is far more nefarious to not question things. Sure, we're using a humanitarian situation to persuade Americans to get involved for a reason other than humanitarian. Two days in to helping out and now they say we'll be there for weeks and months.... Because of the Kurds not the Yezidis. It was always about the oil and/or gas fields, pipelines and refineries. I don't know but one person in this forum who is Christian and referred me here. We met years ago on the band Creed's forum. The nations will do as they please. My only concern pertains to believers abandoning the Word of God, letting it take a back seat to kingdoms of the earth which are destined for destruction. Matthew 16:24-26; 10:28; Daniel 2:41-45


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I find this post to be really sad on many fronts. Of course question things. But don't assume who is Christian or not, don't create conspiracies without facts, and more importantly don't get holier than thou... You do know how many verses there are about false witness, right?

I'm glad you're here, I welcome your point of view, but you might want to relax a little. More open discussion less assuming, maybe...


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[kidrambler]

Thank you for the welcome. I haven't assumed anyone to be Christian but the one I know. And he's falling down the same rabbit hole again.

As for facts, they said it plainly on the news before we started giving aid, our involvement is important because the Kurds are our friends and 80% of Iraq's oil is at stake in the northern region.

Yesterday CNN showed a map of the places in Iraq where ISIS have control or have an "occupational presence". If you google a map of Iraq's oil fields, you will that the fields, pipelines and refineries locations match the map ISIS locations in Iraq.

Before people here jump to accuse someone of creating a conspiracy, especially a person new and unknown to the forum, they might try asking questions for clarification. I admit, I don't know how to write well, but I'm not an idiot.

Now my husband returned today from a ten day river trip and I'm going to spend the rest of my evening with him.


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[Galeongirl]

I'm not trying to do anything. After two glasses of wine last night it was just an interesting thought I had because the languages are so different. It doesn't have anything to do directly with the real reason the West is going into Iraq. How many times must people be lied to by their national leaders before they wise up? The persons here who are taking issue with the obvious remind me of someone who went by the name Creed of Kings. C.O. K. convinced an entire board of Christians to believe the Bush administration was telling the truth about Iraq's "wmds" and that he helped Al Quaeda. Even though the truth existed beforehand. But they were so bent on believing in a man who professed to be Christian, they supported war based on lies. Many people died or were maimed for that man's lies. Those lives could have been protected if there was an educated populace. But the kings of the earth, and the corporate- (fat cats who profit from war and oil) -controlled media had a job to do and they revealed that they serve the powers that be rather than the publics interest. Afterwards they express remorse and say they needed to do better, until now when they are doing it all over again.


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Why is it so important for you to constantly point out christianity in all of your posts?

Why does it matter that the guy convinced an entire board of christians? Why is that any different from believing a board of people of random faith beliving Bush was telling the truth?

 

[BVS]

Thank you for the welcome. I haven't assumed anyone to be Christian but the one I know. And he's falling down the same rabbit hole again.

As for facts, they said it plainly on the news before we started giving aid, our involvement is important because the Kurds are our friends and 80% of Iraq's oil is at stake in the northern region.

Did the news source that you're watching also happen to mention that humans are being killed, beheaded, and that there are thousands without food and water?

Or is this the rabbit hole you're talking about?

I'm extremely confused about the point you are trying to make. I've seen you mention oil and Christianity in several of your posts, but not once have I seen you mention the targeting of humans?


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[kidrambler]

Why is it so important for you to constantly point out christianity in all of your posts?



Why does it matter that the guy convinced an entire board of christians? Why is that any different from believing a board of people of random faith beliving Bush was telling the truth?

I'm sorry. I thought this forum was the spot where U2 fans to express their views and opinions. My bad.


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[Galeongirl]

It is, I'm asking about your view so you can explain it... since the way you are posting makes it seem that christians is all that matters to the world I assume I am taking this wrongly, so I ask for an explanation rather than jumping to conclusions.

 

[kidrambler]

Did the news source that you're watching also happen to mention that humans are being killed, beheaded, and that there are thousands without food and water?

Or is this the rabbit hole you're talking about?

I'm extremely confused about the point you are trying to make. I've seen you mention oil and Christianity in several of your posts, but not once have I seen you mention the targeting of humans?


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Yes, they mentioned it. And I saw the photos online. Our media is acting like this is worse than before. But mass executions and beheadings did happen before. My point is that we only "help" people when it's in our "interests " to do so. I'm addressing what I strongly suspect is coming, not what is now. An old Christian acquaintance in the virtual world invited me here because he thought I'd find it a welcoming place. He knows me, he usually disagrees with me. But he's respectful of my zeal for the truth in all matters, especially as it pertains to the teachings of J.C. Also, I care about using the troops under false pretenses. I detest lying. And this time I have skin in the game--a loved one who is a Marine.
America isn't as noble as it pretends to be.


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[BVS]

Yes, they mentioned it. And I saw the photos online. Our media is acting like this is worse than before. But mass executions and beheadings did happen before. My point is that we only "help" people when it's in our "interests " to do so. I'm addressing what I strongly suspect is coming, not what is now. An old Christian acquaintance in the virtual world invited me here because he thought I'd find it a welcoming place. He knows me, he usually disagrees with me. But he's respectful of my zeal for the truth in all matters, especially as it pertains to the teachings of J.C. Also, I care about using the troops under false pretenses. I detest lying. And this time I have skin in the game--a loved one who is a Marine.
America isn't as noble as it pretends to be.


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You're right, we don't send aid to every humanitarian cause, but it's in our interest to do so. This is the worst mass executions since we've gone in their and done our nation building. I along with others would say we should have never gone in there in the first place, and we've caused some of this, but to turn our backs now would be irresponsible. I'm not sure what you believe is to come, but I think our military efforts will be pretty minimal no one has any interest in going back in there.


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