Harvard Professor Looking for Neanderthal Surrogate

Jive Turkey · 01-21-2013, 09:33 PM

Wasn't sure if I should put this in the science thread, but I think it might interest people who otherwise wouldn't look in there. Maybe even stimulate some discussion on ethics.

Palaeolithic Park? Harvard professor seeks 'adventurous' woman to give birth to baby Neanderthal - Science - News - The Independent

Vlad n U 2 · 01-21-2013, 10:13 PM

If there is enough evidence that the pregnancy would not endanger the woman, and that the child wouldn't spend much of his/her time in cruel lab experiments, then I think it might be worth giving it a shot.

I don't have a definite 'yes' or 'no' on this.

Pearl · 01-21-2013, 10:30 PM

I don't think this is a good idea. There's a good chance the kid will be examined and watched all its life, even if it lives a "normal" life with a family in a small town. It will be watched to see how it mentally and physically develops, how it handles technology, how it socializes and is treated by others. While this idea taps into people's imagination of Neandertals living in the present world and what it would be like for them, I don't see how this professor's plans can be ethical.

digitize · 01-21-2013, 11:00 PM

Sigh.

deep · 01-21-2013, 11:01 PM

What's one more Irishman.

Jive Turkey · 01-21-2013, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by digitize

Sigh.

Why sigh?

U2DMfan · 01-22-2013, 12:32 AM

We're finding more and more that Neanderthals were pretty damn smart actually.
I mean, relative to the way they've always been seen. The fact that they were likely killed off by us might fly in the face of that, but who knows?

As for the actual subject...that's one hell of a question. I'll get back to it. Initially, I am against it for several reasons but I'll have to think more on it.

U2DMfan · 01-22-2013, 12:43 AM

I said that as a fact...it's just a theory but personally, I think it has merit.
It very may well have been that Anatomically Modern Humans killed them off.
Makes sense to me, just as a fan of science.

And so that item, if true, is incredibly curious unto itself within this ethical debate. What if we were responsible for their genocide? Do we owe it to them to bring them back?

Are we going to create one and never let it mate? What if it is a male that rapes a woman? Will the authorities allow it to be aborted? All sorts of strangeness here...many fascinating questions.

Also worth noting, as most people make this mistake - Neanderthals gave very little to the human genome. We are somewhat related but very distant, as far as I'm aware.

Jive Turkey · 01-22-2013, 01:17 AM

If I'm not mistaken, we share a common ancestor, but there are traces of neanderthal DNA in people of European descent due to some interbreeding..... I'm going to verify that right now

Jive Turkey · 01-22-2013, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by U2DMfan

What if we were responsible for their genocide?

This is an interesting thought. I feel a great deal of responsibility when our species causes the the extinction of another... but 30,000 years ago, homo sapiens were living what would seem like a more.. ecologically friendly lifestyle. Species cause other species to go extinct all the time. I'm not sure why, but I feel like it's different to clear a rainforest and wipe out a species than it is to out-compete them. But then you run into the question of "when exactly did we start living 'unnatural' lifestyles"... I've always thought that was a silly question, because it divorces us from the so-called natural world in a very arrogant way. I dunno.... late night stream of conscious and what not

Jive Turkey · 01-22-2013, 01:28 AM

Study: Neanderthal DNA Lives On in Modern Humans - TIME

Neanderthals live on in DNA of humans | Science | The Guardian

deep · 01-22-2013, 02:37 AM

Harvard professor blasts Web rumor | Boston Herald

Jive Turkey · 01-22-2013, 02:53 AM

NOOOOOOOO!

I was worried about that (seemed a little too good to be true), but at least thought it was within the realm of possibility. And it was mentioned in some legit sources

I suppose the discussion is still valid as it will happen one day

Thanks for destroying my dream of a real life captain caveman, deep and the Germans

BoMac · 01-22-2013, 09:01 AM

Pfft, such a cliché pick-up line. He should be more original if he wants to impress women.

Pearl · 01-22-2013, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jive Turkey

I suppose the discussion is still valid as it will happen one day

It's possible. Just get one mad scientist to do it.

I remember some years ago there was talk about bringing back the woolly mammoth. They found one frozen in Siberia and there were rumors of cloning it or finding some way to bring back the specie.

Jive Turkey · 01-22-2013, 11:10 AM

I think Japanese researchers are still working on the wooly mammoth as far as I know

U2DMfan · 01-22-2013, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jive Turkey

Study: Neanderthal DNA Lives On in Modern Humans - TIME

Neanderthals live on in DNA of humans | Science | The Guardian

Yeah we share DNA and carry it to this day but it's not much.

We are all of the same Homo family.
And our dad is Mike Brady.

Jive Turkey · 01-22-2013, 02:48 PM

But the interesting thing about it is that neanderthal specific DNA is contained in ours after our lines had split. Cavemen getting freaky with other species and such. Hot paleolithic inter-species action

u2popmofo · 01-22-2013, 04:56 PM

I'm so sick of your internet rumors and lies, "Jive Turkey". First "evolution", then "science", now "this".

Jive Turkey · 01-22-2013, 06:34 PM

I don't want to start any internet rumours

01-21-2013, 09:33 PM	#1
Jive Turkey ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,646 Local Time: 08:32 PM	Harvard Professor Looking for Neanderthal Surrogate Wasn't sure if I should put this in the science thread, but I think it might interest people who otherwise wouldn't look in there. Maybe even stimulate some discussion on ethics. Palaeolithic Park? Harvard professor seeks 'adventurous' woman to give birth to baby Neanderthal - Science - News - The Independent __________________

01-21-2013, 10:13 PM	#2
Vlad n U 2 Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 28,354 Local Time: 11:02 AM	If there is enough evidence that the pregnancy would not endanger the woman, and that the child wouldn't spend much of his/her time in cruel lab experiments, then I think it might be worth giving it a shot. I don't have a definite 'yes' or 'no' on this. __________________

01-22-2013, 09:01 AM	#14
BoMac Self-righteous bullshitter Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Soviet Canuckistan — Socialist paradise Posts: 16,899 Local Time: 09:32 PM	Pfft, such a cliché pick-up line. He should be more original if he wants to impress women. __________________

01-22-2013, 06:34 PM	#20
Jive Turkey ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,646 Local Time: 08:32 PM	I don't want to start any internet rumours __________________

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01-21-2013, 10:30 PM	#3
Pearl Rock n' Roll Doggie VIP PASS Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: NYC Posts: 5,741 Local Time: 08:32 PM	I don't think this is a good idea. There's a good chance the kid will be examined and watched all its life, even if it lives a "normal" life with a family in a small town. It will be watched to see how it mentally and physically develops, how it handles technology, how it socializes and is treated by others. While this idea taps into people's imagination of Neandertals living in the present world and what it would be like for them, I don't see how this professor's plans can be ethical.

01-21-2013, 11:00 PM	#4
digitize ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: New York / Dallas / Austin Posts: 14,074 Local Time: 06:32 PM	Sigh.

01-21-2013, 11:01 PM	#5
deep Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: A far distance down. Posts: 28,600 Local Time: 04:32 PM	What's one more Irishman.

01-22-2013, 12:32 AM	#7
U2DMfan Rock n' Roll Doggie VIP PASS Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: It's Inside A Black Hole Posts: 6,637 Local Time: 06:32 PM	We're finding more and more that Neanderthals were pretty damn smart actually. I mean, relative to the way they've always been seen. The fact that they were likely killed off by us might fly in the face of that, but who knows? As for the actual subject...that's one hell of a question. I'll get back to it. Initially, I am against it for several reasons but I'll have to think more on it.

01-22-2013, 12:43 AM	#8
U2DMfan Rock n' Roll Doggie VIP PASS Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: It's Inside A Black Hole Posts: 6,637 Local Time: 06:32 PM	I said that as a fact...it's just a theory but personally, I think it has merit. It very may well have been that Anatomically Modern Humans killed them off. Makes sense to me, just as a fan of science. And so that item, if true, is incredibly curious unto itself within this ethical debate. What if we were responsible for their genocide? Do we owe it to them to bring them back? Are we going to create one and never let it mate? What if it is a male that rapes a woman? Will the authorities allow it to be aborted? All sorts of strangeness here...many fascinating questions. Also worth noting, as most people make this mistake - Neanderthals gave very little to the human genome. We are somewhat related but very distant, as far as I'm aware.

01-22-2013, 01:17 AM	#9
Jive Turkey ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,646 Local Time: 08:32 PM	If I'm not mistaken, we share a common ancestor, but there are traces of neanderthal DNA in people of European descent due to some interbreeding..... I'm going to verify that right now

01-22-2013, 01:28 AM	#11
Jive Turkey ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,646 Local Time: 08:32 PM	Study: Neanderthal DNA Lives On in Modern Humans - TIME Neanderthals live on in DNA of humans \| Science \| The Guardian

01-22-2013, 02:37 AM	#12
deep Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: A far distance down. Posts: 28,600 Local Time: 04:32 PM	Harvard professor blasts Web rumor \| Boston Herald

01-22-2013, 02:53 AM	#13
Jive Turkey ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,646 Local Time: 08:32 PM	NOOOOOOOO! I was worried about that (seemed a little too good to be true), but at least thought it was within the realm of possibility. And it was mentioned in some legit sources I suppose the discussion is still valid as it will happen one day Thanks for destroying my dream of a real life captain caveman, deep and the Germans

01-22-2013, 11:10 AM	#16
Jive Turkey ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,646 Local Time: 08:32 PM	I think Japanese researchers are still working on the wooly mammoth as far as I know

01-22-2013, 02:48 PM	#18
Jive Turkey ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,646 Local Time: 08:32 PM	But the interesting thing about it is that neanderthal specific DNA is contained in ours after our lines had split. Cavemen getting freaky with other species and such. Hot paleolithic inter-species action

01-22-2013, 04:56 PM	#19
u2popmofo Blue Meth Addict Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Utah Posts: 37,179 Local Time: 07:32 PM	I'm so sick of your internet rumors and lies, "Jive Turkey". First "evolution", then "science", now "this".