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Old 01-03-2009, 06:55 PM   #21
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Who needs America if they Have Venezuela



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Old 01-03-2009, 07:43 PM   #22
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Yep..and the health care and education system is soo good that they still die trying to swim to the USA.

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You're welcome to return to this thread once you gain the slightest clue regarding what you're talking about. Until then, there's the door.
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Old 01-03-2009, 09:09 PM   #23
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You're welcome to return to this thread once you gain the slightest clue regarding what you're talking about. Until then, there's the door.


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Thursday, 22 November, 2001, 01:48 GMT
Cuban immigrants feared drowned



Anxious relatives are waiting for news

Up to 30 Cubans, including several children, are feared drowned after the boat which was carrying them illegally to the United States was found capsized off the Florida Keys.
United States coastguard helicopters and rescue crafts are continuing to scour the area, but they say hope is fading of finding anyone alive.



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How many people have to die before people realise that paying a smuggler is paying to put people in grave danger?
Gene Smith, US Coastguard

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Each of the immigrants had reportedly paid $10,000 for their place on the boat, which set off from Cuba on Saturday evening and was expected to arrive in the Florida keys on Sunday.
When the boat failed to arrive as planned anxious relatives in Miami waited a further 24-hours before contacting the American authorities for fear of prosecution.

As soon as they did, a full scale rescue operation was launched involving the US Coastguard and US Air Force. Late on Tuesday night they found a vessel matching the boat's description floating upside down.

No sign of passengers

A single life-jacket was floating nearby, but there was no sign of those on board.

"Pending further developments, we have exhausted all hope of finding anybody," coastguard spokesman Gene Smith said.




The sinking is the single worst smuggling tragedy ever from Cuba - according to the Miami-based relatives of the missing there were 30 people on board, including a dozen children.


Federal prosecutors in south Florida are investigating the incident, hoping to find the organisers of the voyage, who could face charges of smuggling illegal migrants.

Perilous journey

Mr Smith said the boat probably hit high seas.

"A 30-foot (9m) boat in 14-foot (4.5m) seas, that's just crazy, it's really dangerous, and this is a 30-foot boat with 30 people on board," Mr Smith said.

"How many people have to die before people realise that paying a smuggler is paying to put people in grave danger?" he asked.




The charge for the trip, up to $10,000 a head, is far beyond the means of most Cubans on the island, and so it is usually paid by relatives in the US.

Carlos Montane, whose ex-wife and eight-year-old daughter were on board the boat, said he paid the fee for their passage.

"I can't live all my life with this guilt," he told the Miami Herald.

The US Coastguard say their search for the missing will continue and again warned Cubans of the dangers of trying to enter the country in this way.
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Old 01-03-2009, 09:32 PM   #24
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You're welcome to return to this thread once you gain the slightest clue regarding what you're talking about. Until then, there's the door.
I've been to Cuba, loved the country and people. Yet if you cannot see that 50 years on there are still people that risk their lives in the hope of a better life, I don't know what to tell you. I suppose you're going to blame United States propaganda on the deaths of those that try to escape by raft. Yet, for some, but not all, they're escaping for legitimate reasons, and presumably one would be because they're unhappy with life in Cuba.

I also agree with Martina, in that invariably, the truth is always somewhere in the centre. You're basing your opinion—and it is an opinion, not fact—on history books and anecdotal evidence, yet unless you were there in both periods, you cannot say for certain that Cuba is better off now than they were prior to 1959.
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Old 01-03-2009, 11:08 PM   #25
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You're basing your opinion—and it is an opinion, not fact—on history books and anecdotal evidence, yet unless you were there in both periods, you cannot say for certain that Cuba is better off now than they were prior to 1959.
I took a "History of Cuba 1400-2000" class here at university as an elective. By no means does that make me an expert, but I'm just saying that I'm not entirely ignorant in this matter (I'm not solely a believer in propaganda, one way or another). This is where I met my Cuban friends who were also taking the class and who expressed the opinions I stated earlier in this thread. I trust their judgement much more than anyone else's, just as I would trust a Norwegian's opinion on the state of Norway more than a Canadian who proclaims themselves an expert on Norwegian history.



ETA: Diamond, you haven't the slightest clue what I'm talking about, either.
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Old 01-03-2009, 11:50 PM   #26
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So just to be clear, your expertise on Cuba comes from an elective you took in college and a some Cubans you met in that class who are having their education in Canada financed by the Cuban government?
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Old 01-03-2009, 11:58 PM   #27
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So just to be clear, your expertise on Cuba comes from an elective you took in college and a some Cubans you met in that class who are having their education in Canada financed by the Cuban government?
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By no means does that make me an expert,
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Old 01-04-2009, 12:14 AM   #28
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perhaps of interest

Anastasia Haydulina, "Interview with Mariela Castro on the Future of Sex and Socialism in Cuba"
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Old 01-04-2009, 12:19 AM   #29
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It's clear you're not an expert.
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Old 01-04-2009, 09:43 AM   #30
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It's clear you're not an expert.


You've made a very valuable contribution to this thread. Is that all you came in here for?
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Old 01-04-2009, 10:07 AM   #31
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Just think about how much lovely capitalism those Che Shirts encourage, the man may have been a Stalinist philistine but the irony is wonderful



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Old 01-04-2009, 05:40 PM   #32
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Old 01-05-2009, 11:02 PM   #33
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You've made a very valuable contribution to this thread. Is that all you came in here for?
I guess what Dave C is saying is that he has an affinity for the country of Cuba-after studying its history.

You had some of schnuckered with the title of the thread.

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