Christians are Compassionate

[deep]

For God so loved the world
he gave a yawn, took a nap
woke up, grabbed the remote for World of Warcraft

 

[maycocksean]

^What if God was one of us.
Just a slob like one of us.

 

[A stor]

God is a concept by which we measure our pain - J. Lennon.

Not for me.......My spiritual path is what I freely choose. A private issue. Don't believe in any kind of "conversion" or see it my way. Religion, non-religion. I make up my own mind.

Don't see it the way that Lennon did either. Great songwriter. But, He. Nor does anyone else have the right to tell me what to believe. Or not to believe.

 

[PhilsFan]

He, nor does anyone else have the right to tell me what to believe. Or not to believe.

Right. But most instances of "forced beliefs" occur with religious people doing so to the nonreligious, not the other way around.

Just think of how much political debate includes religion.

 

[A stor]

Right. But most instances of "forced beliefs" occur with religious people doing so to the nonreligious, not the other way around.

Just think of how much political debate includes religion.

I agree and it is wrong. It is not something I would do. That was why I said. I don't believe in "conversion" or see it my way. In any circumstance.

Spirituality is personal. A path, I choose. But, would never force it on anyone else. This would go against everything I believe in.

 

[financeguy]

I agree and it is wrong. It is not something I would do. That was why I said. I don't believe in "conversion" or see it my way. In any circumstance.

Spirituality is personal. A path, I choose. But, would never force it on anyone else. This would go against everything I believe in.

I'll tell you what I do worry about, though, and that's the lack of community values and sheer amoral callousness of, erhm (without wanting to read like a fourth rate sociology treatise ) contemporary early 21st century western society.

There does seem to be a correlation between these developments and the decline in religious worship - not necessarily a causation. I think that's part of what U2 were getting at with albums like 'Zooropa' and 'Pop'. I think that the kinds of trends they were speaking about in those albums, are unfortunately, worse now than back in the mid 1990s. The whole celebrity culture thing, for example.

 

[A_Wanderer]

COEXIST is untenable

Muslim Mob Kills Wife, Children of Christian in Pakistan


Fearing local religious leader, area police refuse to file murder complaint.
ISLAMABAD, Pakistan, July 8 (Compass Direct News) – A Muslim mob in Jhelum, Pakistan murdered the wife and four children of a Christian last month, but local authorities are too afraid of the local Muslim leader to file charges, according to area Muslim and Christian sources.

Jamshed Masih, a police officer who was transferred 50 kilometers (31 miles) from Gujrat to Jhelum, Punjab Province, said a mob led by Muslim religious leader Maulana Mahfooz Khan killed his family on June 21 after Khan called him to the local mosque and told him to leave the predominantly Muslim colony. Jhelum is 85 kilometers (53 miles) south of Islamabad.

“You must leave with your family, no non-Muslim has ever been allowed to live in this colony – we want to keep our colony safe from scum,” Khan told Masih, the bereaved Christian told Compass.

Masih had moved to Mustafa Colony in Jhelum with his wife, two sons and two daughters and were living in a rented house. Masih said that a Muslim neighbor, Ali Murtaza, told him that area Muslims notified Khan, telling the religious leader, “We cannot allow these non-Muslims to live here, they will be a bad influence on our children.”

An anxious Masih told his wife Razia Jamshed about the local Muslim response, and they decided to bring their concern to the pastor of a local Presbyterian Church, Saleem Mall.

“Pastor Saleem said, ‘I will also advise you to vacate the house, as it can be dangerous living there – these people can harm your family,” Masih said.

Masih’s neighbor, Murtaza, confirmed to Compass the response of the local Muslims and related incidents that led up to the murders. Murtaza told Compass that after Masih went to work at 7 a.m. on June 21, his children could be heard singing hymns before breakfast.

“Razia sent their eldest son to buy a packet of Surf [detergent], and he was singing a hymn on his way to buy the Surf,” Murtaza said.

Neighbors saw Masih’s s 11-year-old son come into the store, he said. The shopkeeper asked him if he was a Christian; the child responded that he was.

“The shopkeeper refused to give him the packet of Surf and spoke very harshly to him, ‘I don’t sell to any non-Muslim, you are not welcome here, don’t you dare ever come to my shop again,’” Murtaza said.

The boy went home, upset, and told his mother about the encounter; she grew worried and called her husband, saying, “Jamshed, please come home quickly, the kids and I are very worried, we must leave this house today,” Masih said.

His neighbor, Murtaza, said that shortly afterward some area residents came to the door with the Muslim religious leader, Khan.

“Your son has committed blasphemy against Muhammad, our beloved prophet – we can’t allow him to live, he should be punished,” Khan told Razia Masih, Murtaza said. “Razia got scared and said, ‘My son couldn’t do such a thing, he is only 11 years old.’”

Khan became furious and said, “Are we lying to you? You call us liars, how dare you insult us,” Murtaza said. “Someone from the crowd hit something hard on her head, and she started bleeding. The children started crying and shouted for help. Razia kept shouting for help, ‘Please have mercy on us, please let my husband come, then we can talk.’”

Jamshed Masih said his daughter telephoned police as the mob attacked his wife and children. He said he later learned that “the people kept shouting, ‘This family has committed blasphemy, they should be killed.”

Before police arrived, his family was murdered, he said.

Murtaza said Masih rushed home and was devastated to find the dead bodies of his wife and four children.

When Masih tried to file a complaint against Khan for the murder, Station House Officer (SHO) Ramzan Mumtaz refused to do so, according to Murtaza and Mall, the Presbyterian clergyman.

“He said, ‘Khan is an influential man, and he said your son has committed blasphemy – we cannot do anything against him,’” Mall said.

Murtaza added, “The SHO just said, ‘I am a poor man, I have a family, and I was pressured by higher authorities not to register the FIR [First Information Report] as Khan is a very influential man. I am sorry, I don’t have anything in my hands.’”

Contacted by Compass, SHO Mumtaz confirmed that he responded to the request to file the complaint against Khan in these exact words.

Masih has filed a complaint with the chief minister of Punjab Province begging him for justice, Mall told Compass.

“We condemn this brutal murder of innocent children in the name of Islam,” Mall said. “This has to stop now. We appeal to the government to let us live in peace.”

Muslim Mob Kills Wife, Children of Christian in Pakistan

 

[financeguy]

^ Ok. But, even though I'm not a believer, I think it's too easy to blame religion solely for these kinds of incidents.

It's really just mob mentality and the tribal instinct, which seems to be innate in human nature. Religion at times gives people the excuse to behave badly.

 

[A_Wanderer]

Your right about the tribe mentality, but I'm not sure that religion is as much of an excuse as an extension of that.

 

[A_Wanderer]

Apparently the source for that story is pretty bogus which is good news.

 

[Pearl]

I'll tell you what I do worry about, though, and that's the lack of community values and sheer amoral callousness of, erhm (without wanting to read like a fourth rate sociology treatise ) contemporary early 21st century western society.

There does seem to be a correlation between these developments and the decline in religious worship - not necessarily a causation. I think that's part of what U2 were getting at with albums like 'Zooropa' and 'Pop'. I think that the kinds of trends they were speaking about in those albums, are unfortunately, worse now than back in the mid 1990s. The whole celebrity culture thing, for example.

I've kind of noticed that, too. It seems with individualism becoming more important in society, there's more selfishness going around.

As for celebrity culture, I saw a quote that said something like, anyone with self-esteem would not model themselves after a celebrity, or something like that.

There's more I would like to discuss on this topic, but that's a whole new thread.

 

[A stor]

I'll tell you what I do worry about, though, and that's the lack of community values and sheer amoral callousness of, erhm (without wanting to read like a fourth rate sociology treatise ) contemporary early 21st century western society.

There does seem to be a correlation between these developments and the decline in religious worship - not necessarily a causation. I think that's part of what U2 were getting at with albums like 'Zooropa' and 'Pop'. I think that the kinds of trends they were speaking about in those albums, are unfortunately, worse now than back in the mid 1990s. The whole celebrity culture thing, for example.

I don't understand. What you are saying to me.

 

[juliaguliaxo94]

I don't understand. What you are saying to me.

He means that it's not exactly popular these days to have religious values and morals included in popular culture, like when Zooropa and Pop ventured away from spirituality to more down to earth matters.

 

[A stor]

Thank you! Now, I understand.

 

[BoMac]

Thank you! Now, I understand.

This has no bearing on the conversation, but is there, any reason. why, you always misplace, commas and periods in your sentences? It makes it, hard to read.sometimes.

 

[Jive Turkey]

Must go to the Deep School of Punctuation

 

[juliaguliaxo94]

 

[nathan1977]

Must go to the Deep School of Punctuation

And Benji's graduate school.

 

[Diemen]

And Benji's graduate school.

Ooh, zing!

 

[A_Wanderer]

The last story I posted was a fabrication by a Christian organisation which was designed to attract sympathy for the oppression of Christians worldwide.

This story however is part of an ongoing saga over this cartoon

The cartoon is obviously a hate crime, but does it justify this response?

Seattle, Washington (CNN) -- A Seattle cartoonist who drew a cartoon about the Prophet Mohammed has been warned by the FBI about death threats made against her by a radical cleric with ties to al Qaeda, an FBI agent said Tuesday.

"She should be taken as a prime target of assassination," terror suspect Anwar al-Awlaki purportedly wrote about cartoonist Molly Norris in an English-language magazine called Inspire that claimed to be a publication of al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula.
"This campaign is not a practice of freedom of speech, but is a nationwide mass movement of Americans" who are "going out of their way to offend Muslims worldwide," the article signed by al-Awlaki continued. Al-Awlaki is himself being sought in Yemen for his alleged role as a planner of the failed bombing of a Detroit-bound passenger plane on Christmas Day last year.

Norris has been advised to take precautions to ensure her safety, said FBI Special Agent Marty Prewett.

"The FBI is always reviewing and assessing information it receives," Prewett said. "Whenever the FBI comes into possession of information of a threatening nature to an individual, we let that person know so they can take appropriate security measures. That is the case here."

Prewitt declined to comment on where Norris is and whether she is receiving protection from law enforcement. Al-Awlaki also threatened eight other cartoonists, journalists and writers from Britain, Sweden and Holland.

Norris kicked off a controversy in April with a cartoon published online about an imaginary group called "Citizens Against Citizens Against Humor" that proposed an "Everybody Draw Mohammed Day" on May 20.

Norris said in media interviews at the time that she was inspired by the furor created from an episode of the show "South Park" that depicted the Propeht Mohammed dressed in a bear suit.

Comedy Central, which airs "South Park," aired an edited version of the episode after the show's creators received threats.

Norris' cartoon inspired a campaign to create pictures of the Islamic prophet across the internet with over 100,000 people signing up on a Facebook page. A Pakistani court ordered access to Facebook there cut off for two weeks. Competing sites blasted the campaign also drew tens of thousands of followers.

Many Muslims find drawings and other depitcions of the Prophet Mohammed to be deeply offensive.

Norris said the consequences of the drawing were unintended. "I wasn't savvy," the cartoonist said in an interview last month with City Arts Magazine, where many of her cartoons were published. "I didn't mean for my satirical poster to be taken seriously. It became kind of an excuse for people to hate or be mean-spirited. I'm not-mean spirited," Norris said.

An editor at City Arts said neither the magazine nor Norris had any comment on the death threats against her.

Adam Raisman, a senior analyst for the Site Intelligence Group, which monitors Islamic terror groups online communications, said al-Awlaki's threats constituted a continued effort to reach a wider audience and should not be taken lightly.

"The prophet is the pinnacle of Jihad [for al-Awlaki and his followers]," he said. "It is better to support the prophet by attacking those who slander him than it is to travel to land of Jihad like Iraq or Afghanistan."

In February an ax-wielding man broke into the home of Danish cartoonist Kurt Westergaard who has been targeted by extremists for his drawing of Mohammed. He and his grandaughter hid in a fortified "panic room" during the attack.

FBI warns Seattle cartoonist about threats from radical cleric - CNN.com

 

[juliaguliaxo94]

Oh, dear.

 

[Jive Turkey]

The cartoon is obviously a hate crime

crime?

 

[A stor]

This has no bearing on the conversation, but is there, any reason. why, you always misplace, commas and periods in your sentences? It makes it, hard to read.sometimes.

Sorry.

 

[A stor]

This has no bearing on the conversation, but is there, any reason. why, you always misplace, commas and periods in your sentences? It makes it, hard to read.sometimes.

English is my first language. I am using proper punctuation and spelling.

 

[BoMac]

OK. Sure.

 

[Jive Turkey]

Guess she had a long think about it last night and changed her mind....

 

[juliaguliaxo94]

A stor is a she.

 

[Jive Turkey]

Sorry fixed

 

[A stor]

Guess she had a long think about it last night and changed her mind....

Don't tell everyone!

BoMac,

I will try harder in the future to make my statements easier to read.

 

[financeguy]

TC: Your father once said, it’s not so much that I don’t believe in God, it’s that I hate him.

MA: It’s more that I hate him. He said it to that poet. . .

TC: To the Soviet poet, Yevtushenko. Is that your position?

MA: No. In fact, I’m an agnostic, which is the only rational position. It’s not because I feel a God or think that anything resembling the banal God of religion will turn up. But I think that atheism sounds like a proof of something, and it’s incredibly evident that we are nowhere near intelligent enough to understand the universe. We are a dozen Einsteins away. It’s pathetic. I feel very sorry for cosmologists. Only a couple of years ago I was told by one, Lee Smolin, he said they had just discovered that the universe is not only expanding but that this process is accelerating. For us, he said, that’s like throwing your car keys in the air and them not coming down. And then, they’ve just been struggling to understand what dark matter is, which occupies 80 per cent of mass in the universe and until the last year all they knew about it was that it was this “dark material.” The guy at Playboy magazine said that “Hugh is a great admirer of your material.” I mean, “material” is really telling you nothing at all. Paul Davies in the Guardian says that we now know it exists in massive particles that haven’t really gelled. But that’s 80 per cent of mass in the universe, and we have no idea…

Martin Amis: the Prospect interview – Prospect Magazine ? Prospect Magazine