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Old 07-30-2010, 07:22 PM   #521
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Just got back from my lovely holiday in Spain where all there was in siesta time at the hotel was CNN so watched a lot on this bill and was thinking a bit about it especially the racial profiling issue.

Why is wrong to ask someone who looks hispanic after you've arrested them for something if they are legally in the country? When the majority of illegial people in Arizona are from mexico/central america why is it seen as discrimatory to ask them?
I understand the issue behind racial profiling and discrimination but in this case I don't really see an issue? When I arrive in the USA i am asked all sorts of questions at border control because i am not am american citizen. When I was pulled over while driving for a random inspection the police asked to see my passport to check my visa. I did not feel discriminated against, I understand there are rules and regulations and my veeeeeeeeery strine accent certainly made me stand out from an american citizen.

My issue isn't with illegial immigrants coming to the usa, but more with the major issue of racial profiling people seem to have... I just don't see why its such a big deal?

Stereotyping is one thing, but when they are cracking down on mexican/central american people coming illegially over the border and then want to ask someone who looks or sounds like a mexican/central american if they are here legally, then why is that a problem?
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Old 07-30-2010, 11:23 PM   #522
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^I have quite a few African-American friends who've been pulled over and harassed by police. They say it's racial profiling, but they shrug their shoulders and say "That's the way the world is".
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Old 07-31-2010, 11:58 PM   #523
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My issue isn't with illegial immigrants coming to the usa, but more with the major issue of racial profiling people seem to have... I just don't see why its such a big deal?

why don't you ask some non-white Australians how they feel about this?
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Old 08-01-2010, 08:42 AM   #524
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Well I would but not in Australia at the moment.

So say if something is statistically very high in one area, we can't look that way without being called a racist? I am genuinely interested in the very PC area of this and how its become almost the main issue in the whole thing. I don't see why if I am asked for ID when i sound Australian and someone getting asked for id if they look/sound mexican is any different? This isn't someone in New York, this is people living just across the border where people are excaping through all the time, and by reading lots of articles, it seems like this sort of questioning already happens.

But whatever. Whenever a race is singled out we always have to call racism right? Unless its positive and then we can all clap for them, but if its in a negative light then we all back peddle like crazy.

America has my fingerprints on file, every time i come into te country they scan them to check im the same person, same goes for UK because im on a biometric visa. I think its way over the top, but its a necessary part of travel, should i feel discrimnated against being a non us/uk citizen as well?
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Old 08-01-2010, 10:07 AM   #525
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America has my fingerprints on file, every time i come into te country they scan them to check im the same person, same goes for UK because im on a biometric visa. I think its way over the top, but its a necessary part of travel, should i feel discrimnated against being a non us/uk citizen as well?
You seem to be forgetting that there is a very large Hispanic (Mexican and otherwise) population in America which is comprised of legal immigrants and American citizens. The U.S. Government estimates that 62% of the roughly 47 million Hispanics in the U.S. are American-born. I believe that's more people than all of Australia. Why should they be subject to the same scrutiny as you, a non-citizen?
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Old 08-01-2010, 10:21 AM   #526
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true true, but i thought this law was only in Arizona, which has a border with Mexico and is a known way in for illegal immigrants. Its like stemming the tide at the edge of the land. Of the 11 million illegal immigrants over 85% are mexican or hispanic, therefore i don't necessarily see it as intentionally discrimatory racial profiling but more than just a 'stab in the dark'

i don't think they need the same scruitiny as me, but if there are over 8 million hispanic people who are living illegally in the us, then surely they should have to go through the same channels as every other citizen who wants to live in the us (that is another issue all together!)
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Old 08-01-2010, 10:25 AM   #527
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Do you all feel that there are actually people who support illegal immigration or is that just a mischaracterization of the issue?

What would be the arguments against say requiring people to show proof of citizenship when applying for food stamps? And what would be the argument against automatically deporting those who are found to be in the country illegally?

I often end up opposing those who are demanding stronger enforcement of immigration laws because of the blatant racism evident in the arguments, but the truth is I can't see why anyone reasonable person would oppose more stringent illegal immigration standards.
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Old 08-01-2010, 11:20 AM   #528
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true true, but i thought this law was only in Arizona, which has a border with Mexico and is a known way in for illegal immigrants.
Something like a quarter to a third of Arizona is of Hispanic descent - that's a lot of people to suspect. Interesting how you use "sound" for Australian but "look/sound" for Mexican - that's a poor analogy.
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Old 08-01-2010, 12:42 PM   #529
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well obviously I can't say I look Australian as i'm a white descendent from the UK like most white americans etc, i don't mean you can look 'mexican' i meant look hispanic etc, poorly chosen words i agree!

I didn't think we were suspecting every single hispanic person on the street, i thought this bill was about when someone is arrested they are asked for id rather than going up to hispanic people in restuarants and knocking on doors demanding papers. I thought it was more to the fact of is someone is acting suspicious they can ask (and obviously if they then exploit this its for the law enfourcement to crack down on etc)
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Old 08-01-2010, 02:06 PM   #530
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rather than going up to hispanic people in restuarants and knocking on doors demanding papers.

Go back and read through the thread. That's exactly what the police were doing last time Arizona tried something like this.
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Old 08-01-2010, 05:51 PM   #531
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Arizona’s Governor Can’t Tell Bump From Sinkhole: Ann Woolner - Bloomberg
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Old 03-08-2011, 02:29 AM   #532
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Illegals Could Work Legally Under Utah's Immigration Bill

Conservative Utah does it differently than Arizona.
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Old 05-10-2011, 09:37 PM   #533
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A 51st State? Some In Arizona Want A Split : NPR
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May 9, 2011 NPR

A 51st State? Some In Arizona Want A Split

SB 1070 enjoys widespread support in Arizona. But that support is by no means unanimous. In southern Arizona some people are so unhappy with the direction the state has taken that they want to create their own state.Inside the Shanty, a favorite bar for Tucson Democrats, you can find people who don't like Republican-controlled Arizona government.

David Euchner is set up just inside the door to catch patrons before they have a drink after work: "Hi, would you like to sign a petition?"

Euchner is having no trouble getting people to sign a petition declaring Baja Arizona the 51st state. Organizers will have to get 48,000 signatures to put it on the local ballot in Pima County. Then, if it passes, statehood will have to be approved by the Arizona Legislature and the governor — and then Congress.
Ha, seeing as how foolish Democratic lawmakers in Wisconsin and here in Indiana looked when they ran off and hid in Illinois because they didn't get their way in the Statehouse. Guess Democrats have hit on a new plan to insure a majority in perpetuity... gerrymander their own state.

Best part. Watching them try and design a state flag that doesn't offend some liberal group somewhere.
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Old 05-11-2011, 08:48 AM   #534
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Maybe they should talk to Gov Perry about how succession, and how well that's going.
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Old 05-11-2011, 10:48 AM   #535
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If I lived in Arizona I'd find any way to leave it as well, including secession.

Could be worse, these people could be living in Florida: the bacteria-ridden, wood-paneled, fecal matter-contaminated hot tub of America.
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Old 05-11-2011, 09:00 PM   #536
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Could be worse, these people could be living in Florida: the bacteria-ridden, wood-paneled, fecal matter-contaminated hot tub of America.
And it's fucking humid. Holy shit. I spent a week there in April a few years back and sweated my balls off the whole time.
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Old 05-12-2011, 03:45 AM   #537
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i laugh that they just want to become their own state. why not a whole different country? oh that's right, they still want all the good stuff america can offer, just no homos or darkies can have any rights.
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Old 05-20-2011, 05:33 PM   #538
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Anyone else starting to see the cracks forming in our Federalist system?

I'm not secess-trash, but I'm increasingly not a unionist either.
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Old 04-25-2012, 06:01 PM   #539
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UPDATE 2-US high court appears to back Arizona on immigration | Reuters

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US high court appears to back Arizona on immigration
Justice Kennedy questions social, economic disruption

WASHINGTON, April 25 (Reuters) - Conservative justices who hold a majority on the U.S. Supreme Court appeared to endorse Arizona's immigration crackdown on Wednesday, rejecting the Obama administration stance that the federal government has sole power over those who illegally enter the United States.

During 80 minutes of oral arguments, the justices suggested by their questions and comments that states have significant latitude to adopt laws that discourage illegal immigrants from moving to and staying in the country.

Justice Anthony Kennedy, who often casts the deciding vote, referred to the "social and economic disruption" that states endure as a result of a flood of illegal immigrants and suggested that states such as Arizona have authority to act.

Only eight of the nine Supreme Court justices heard the arguments. Liberal Justice Elena Kagan, the former top Obama administration lawyer at the court, recused herself because she had worked on the matter previously.

Her fellow liberal justices appeared to accept that the conservative majority would vote to uphold at least part of the Arizona law and focused their questions on how those provisions, which have been on hold during the litigation, would be applied on the ground.

“It seems to me the federal government just doesn’t want to know who’s here illegally,” Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. said at one point.
Oh,oh. Expect more thinly-veiled threats from the constitutional teacher-in-chief against that "unelected group of people" in the black robes.
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Old 04-25-2012, 06:39 PM   #540
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Could be worse, these people could be living in Florida: the bacteria-ridden, wood-paneled, fecal matter-contaminated hot tub of America.
Bro, have you ever been to South Beach?
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